A historic nation sim game proposal

[Sea Skimmer]

It would be very mercantile, with navel military vessels (for the most part) being cargo traders equipped with cannons. Ports are also defended by forts.

We already have a pretty huge number of merchant ships on the seas.

[Sea Skimmer]

Even in 1725, one gun for every thousand men would be about average I think, though siege artillery would be in addition to that. Only at Neerwinden in 1693 can I find such a concentration of artillery as one gun to five hundred men (actually slightly exceeding that), and that only for the Allied side. Will look for other discrepencies--perhaps it was fortress guns.

Well the ratio of 1 for 500 seemed about right based off the few decent sources I could find. And it was only meant to represent field artillery; I didn't want to bother people with fortress and siege guns since I lacked good data myself on what was normally mounted and what move around with the army.

As for standing armies, they are on the large large. Probably no one should have over 150,000-125,000. The French reached over 400,000 around the turn of the century but they couldn't maintain it for very long and soon plunged back. But I'm inclinded to wait for everyones order of battle and then do any additional balancing work.

[Dahak]

Ok, re-compiled previous texts into a new one. If anything's still missing Sea Skimmer, please tell me.

The national flag:


Military Jack


Name: Sacrum Romanorum Imperium nationis Germanicae, commonly known to it's inhabitants as the Holy Roman Empire.

Capital: Charlottenburg. A very old city, founded then the Empire was still young, it is a fortress city, the best defended city in the whole Empire.

Other major cities: Bersenburg, Lutetia, Peenemünde, Karlsruhe, Ludwigsburg, München, Hamburg (the main sea harbour)

Government: autocratic monarchy. The Empire is divided into several kingdoms, which over the centuries devolved into provinces in all but name. Together the make up the High House.

Populace: 15 million, relative densely populated, with an educated elite. Public schooling is set to educate the populace. The country brought forth great smiths and craftsman.

National Anthem: Preußens Gloria

Religion: polytheistic Roman religion

Head of State: Kaiser Friedrich V, 30, recently acquired the throne. His chancellor, Wilhelm Grachtenburg leads his Majesty's ruling council.

Short history: Before the Empire could fall to instabilities 500 years ago, an unusual Emperor, Karl VI., managed to reform the system and degrading the kingdoms to mere provinces in all but name in a bloody, but short, war. Today, the "kings" have limited power over their fiefdoms, and have almost nothing to say on the whole.
This reformation allowed the Empire to grow stronger.
Given the country's natural abundant resources it soon managed economic self-sufficiency to a point where it was thought that other nations were irrelevant. This led to a long phase of isolationism, which was performed with a fervour that soon turned to xenophobism and paranoia regarding the Empire's safety. The only nation it still had full contact with was its neighbour to the south, the Kaiserreich, with which it shared some minor cultural and historical events. The contacts to its other neighbours were performed only on a very low level.
Since the demise of the late Emperor Friedrich IV. and the coronation of his son, things have started to change. Even the Empire couldn't ignore the possibilities colonialism, and trade with those colonies, brought. And in the light that other nations were far better suited for those challenging times (and already made the grabs), it was decided to open itself once more to the world in order to jump on the train. The fact that the massive drain on resources the huge military meant might have been another reason.

Army: Due to its isolationist nature, the army is primarily thought of as a defence force. With the added xenophobism and paranoia, the Empire fields one of the largest fielded army in the area, to protect itself. The "aggressive" nature of this defence has brought several skirmishes with neighbouring nations over the years.
Standing professional army of 200,000 men, focused on heavy Cavalry and light infantry. Artillery of 400 cannons. Dense network fortifications at the borders.
Due to the extensive knowledge the Empire has in smithcraft and cannon making, those are formidable cannons, renowned even outside the Empire.
Of those, roughly 100,000 are manning the dense network of outposts, watch posts, mountain fortresses and forts to protect the nations proper.
There also exists the Royal regiment of elite Husars, numbering 5000 men, stationed in the capital.
In the case of war, the number can be increased as up to 350,000 men, at horrendous costs for the Empire.

Navy: The navy is a still slightly unbalanced mix of lighter units and newly constructed larger Ships of the Line, leaning on knowledge from the Kaiserreich to its south. Generally, the Holy Empire tends to build heavier and larger ships, and unfortunately slower ones.

2 1st rates, 1 104-gun flag ship, one divisional flag ship of 98 guns.
2 2nd rate squadron flag ships, 90 guns
21 3rd rates, 10 80-gun ships, 11 64-guns
15 frigates, 54 guns
6000 merchant ships, very fast ships, roughly 2 guns each.

[Sea Skimmer]

Problems: Your claim to arming all merchant ships with 40 cannon, no more then a tiny fraction of merchantmen had such an armament, most of those which had any guns had twelve or less and many had just 6-4 or none at all beyond perhaps a few swivel guns.

Your population is also very big for your current land area, you can have that but its going to mean you've got little in the way of forests to support further naval construction.

Your fleet is too large for you given that you posses the maximum army of 200,000 and I'd like you see it dropped considerably, I said the limit was to be a few dozen SOL for such powers and you've got 40, kill fifteen of them.

[justifier]

What would be the appropriate amount of cash reserves? How much would a country take in per year in taxes? And what is a reasonable price for common goods?

[Jaded Masses]

About trade and mercantile states, I think we also need to state what we produce and sell. I chose fish, cloth, and wine as primaries and grains as a secondary source of trade. Now since I am a major trading power I would think I would have the largest market share of fish, cloth, and wine and that any other power would do well to trade other items so that they wouldn't have any competition except local vendors. Basically I want to know where I can market my goods to the people who need them most.Bear in mind I am willing to feed your military.

[Captain Cyran]

Eronwal

Population: 9 Million
Capital: Erastor
Government: Monarchy
Religion: Slightly polytheistic, one major God with a few minor gods to assist.
Major Cities: Erastor (capital city), Malagos (Fortress city), Arwan, Veldren (coast city)
Ruler: King Halen Relant III, 37. Son, Graimin Relant, 19. Graimin is next in line for kingship, and should be handed the crown within months.

History: The Relant family was one of the first that joined with the Aragon after their first victory. Their knights were always the ones pressing the charge and whenever Aragon said they had enough land, It was the Relant family that pushed them on to conquer more, using underhanded tactics and even once killing one of the royal family under the guise of Barbarians to insight further war. When all was said and done, the Relant family carved out a large portion of the southern part of the new nation to call home. It had suffered heavy casualties during the war, but unlike other war torn familys it did not turn inward, it decided that the best way to recover was to trade with other nations.

The Relant family were always the troublemakers, refusing to burn their libraries, and even when they did under order of the church it was rumored that they removed most of the books first, they were also the last area to close down open trade with other nations under order of the church, though the black market thrived in the lower portion of the kingdom, with the Relant's not paying it any real heed.

In 1690, they'd had enough and created an alliance with other southern families, with a few quick strikes Eronwal liberated itself from Aragon, the few struggles that did break out caused further casualties, killing the leader of the Relant family who had wished to go on to take over all of Aragon. His son quickly grabbed the reins, and he was far more cautious, the expansion of Eronwal stopped almost immediately and fortification began. As soon as it was assured that Aragon would ignore the small nation the boy king, Halen Relant the first, re-openned libraries filled with books that had never been burned and open trade began again.

Fearing invasion still, the Eronwal citizenry researched into weaponry, making advances in leaps and bounds, with the help of trade, until they reached the level of the rest of the world. In fact, it wasn't far after that Eronwal weaponry actually surpassed that of most of the rest of the world. For some unknown reason, no guns, even exact replicas, can match the quality of the firearms of the Eronwal, as such rumors abound of a magical spell which is the key component behind their legendary craftsmanship. Most nations have at least some Eronwal guns, a few even have a few Eronwal cannons mounted on fortifications and ships. Aragon, has none of these things as Eronwal refuses to even attempt to even speak with their parent nation.



Military: The Eronwal fields one of the best trained, best armed armies in the known world, with Aragon training techniques, Eronwal weaponry, and a zealousness, which is just as great as Aragon's religious zealousness, to defend their country it is no surprise.

Cavalry are not in heavy use, unlike Aragon, what is in heavy use is the cannon. Eronwals cannons are simply the lightest, most durable, and most accurate cannons on the market, with the same being able to be said for their smaller arms. They have 180 artillary pieces for the field and an obsene number in use in the fortifications which run along Eronwal's border. The fortification cannons, of course, make the field cannons look like mere muskets in comparison.

The infantry carries the best Eronwal has to offer and makes good use of it in defending their nation. Most of the army is infantry.

The navy of Eronwal is rather 2nd rate at the moment as their main concern is neither gaining land nor destroying other navys, the only jb of the navy is to defend Eronwal's massive amount of merchant ships and to protect the likewise large seafront Eronwal has.

Fortresses cover the border of Eronwal. They are giant structures, the larger ones having as many as 40 large cannons. The walls are thick and the most important fortresses have a thin layer of metal covering more vital areas of the walls. The fortress city of Malagos puts the other fortresses to shame, with 65 large cannons and a metal layer covering most of the outside wall, this fortress nearly bankrupted the Eronwal government to renovate and enlarge. The capital city itself is as strongly fortified as Malagos.

Army: Currently at peace, as such 50,000 are currently at arms. Under war time that number jumps to 100,000 and under dire circumstance local militias can be called upon to bring that number up to 130,000 troops. Though every citizen of Eronwal can and will fight tooth and nail against invaders.
Of the 100,000 troops only 20,000 are Cavalry.
Eronwal has 200 artillary pieces for use in the battlefield.

Naval Forces:
Fleet:
3 2nd rate
5 3rd rate
20 4th rate (Used for convoys)
30 5th rate (Used for convoys)
3,000 merchant ships

If you have any problems, please tell me.[/b]

[Sea Skimmer]

Naval Forces:
Fleet:
1 1st rate, 110 guns, rarely leaves the waters of Eronwal
5 2nd rate
50 3rd rate
25 4th rate (Used for convoys)
150 5th rate (Used for convoys)
5,000 merchant ships

If you have any problems, please tell me.[/b]

Your fleet is far too large especially since you're a small breakaway power with limited funding, it should be more like 10-15 SOL, maybe twenty forth rates and twenty frigates. Even that is on the excessive side, if you nation is so paranoid about defence then you should have a big army and massive fortresses, not an expensive fleet. Those two things will protect your country, a fleet can't stop an overland invasion.

Your merchant fleet should also be smaller.

[Captain Cyran]

Edited for larger army, much smaller navy, probably one of the few navys without a 1st class ship, it's all good though.

And Eronwal has massive fortifications...I forgot to mention those, crap...edited again to add fortresses.

[Sea Skimmer]

Edited for larger army, much smaller navy, probably one of the few navys without a 1st class ship, it's all good though.

I wouldn't worry about those, in reality there only useful for prestige and tended to be slow and expensive. Both first and second rate's where very rare at this time but even by 1805 they only accounted for perhaps 20% of ships of the line. Your fleet is now fine.

[Stravo]

Skimmer, maybe we should have a thread where we just post our nation's attributes so as we don't have to keep scrolling back and forth to see who has what in this thread.

[Captain Cyran]

Skimmer, maybe we should have a thread where we just post our nation's attributes so as we don't have to keep scrolling back and forth to see who has what in this thread.

I was just thinking of that myself...damn you Stravo for saying it first and getting all the credit.

[Pablo Sanchez]

I will start such a thread and sticky it. Discussion will remain here, just post your national data.

[Sea Skimmer]

I've mentioned the inferior speed of first and second rates a couple times now without giving specifics. Basically a big first or second-rate ship could do about ten knots if it was well designed, while a third rate could do as much as twelve to thirteen knots. That is a significant advantage.

Now there where exceptions, HMS Victory for example was a first rate with 100 guns yet could sail as good and fast as a 74 gun. However the British could never repeat that feat with another vessel. On the other hand some nations third rates could only do about ten knots as well.

[Alyrium Denryle]

So who's map are we using, Sea Skimmers or Sheps?

[Alyrium Denryle]

Das Kaiserreich von Deutschland

Government: What do you think? The Kaiserreich is a Constitutional Monarchy the title of Kaiser is inherited, but it is not absolute. Elected officials in the form of a house of commons check the Kaiser. They have power with a ¾ vote to reverse an executive decision

National Flag



Navy Jack



Nation anthem: Edelweiss

The constitution of the Keiserreich is set up to protect the people from potential abuses by the lawmaking bodies. It protects basic freedom of expression, and property rights, as well as outlines a fair due process system.]


Religion: Religion is polytheistic, based on the Roman religion.

Geography: Das Kaiserreich is a stretch of land with a rocky coastline, dominated by well-sheltered harbors, and coastal fortresses. The interior is mostly flat oak and pine forests, and grasslands peppered with rivers, which have been cultivated for the arming of grain, and cattle. Sheep, and goats are raised in the moutain range that runs on the southern boarder, these are rich in mineral wealth.

Army: The army, though not as strong as the navy is a force to be reckoned with. Each soldier is trained in and provided with, a flintlock musket with bayonet, and is trained in the basics of fencing, and may acquire their own sword should they so choose.
Grenadiers are also in use, and are used to storm fortresses, and Cuirassiers and lancers form the backbone of the cavalry.

Navy: The navy, seeing as how the Kaiserreich has a massive coastline, is one of the strongest in the oceans. They use a balanced approach to their navy, and in addition to their massive Ships of the Line, Frigates are also used. These smaller faster ships escort the hulking warships, and provide fire support outside of formation. Kaiserreich marines are well armed, and make use of and are trained with, boarding pikes, bayonets, muskets, pistols and a variety of swords, Those specialized in it, are capable of firing a ships cannon faster than their naval counterparts, giving them an advantage in fire rate.

Culture and personality: Though it has a wealth of natural resources and is economically self-sufficient, the Kaiserreich is very mercantile, and is home to a massive merchant fleet and is beginning to colonize primitive tribes, and less developed nations to use as a market outlet for steel, wool, and other commodities
Due to this, its seaports, and entire country even are very open and are not nearly as insular as its southern neighbor. The military tradition is just as strong, though it leans more towards the maritime side of things. The navy is the pride of the country.

Their openness however, does not make them push overs. Castles and fortifications are located in strategic locations around the country, and the coastal fortresses keep pirates, and hostile powers from being able to take the only safe harbors on the rocky coast.

The climate is mild both in summer and winter, the temperature kept more constant by warm curents from the equator.

Military Assets of the Kaiserreich.

Navy:
First rates: 5 ships
Second Rates: 15.
Third rates: The backbone of my fleets... 80 ships

Frigates and light patrol ships(Frigates, scooners, armed courrier ships, pirate interceptors, small ships with btween 30 and 50 guns): 75

Merchant vessels are heavily armed of course, and the largest have 70 guns. There are roughly 10000 merchant vessels that fly the Kaiserreichs flag.

Army:
The Army of the Kaiserreich, consist of 15 legions, each containing 5000 men.

The army is divided into centuri, each of 100 men, 10 of which are mounted heavy cavalry. The rest are men armed with musket, bayonet, sword, and a few grenades.

Each legion carries with it, 10 cannons.

Fortifications:
Fortfications are up-to date coastal fortresses. They are comprized of stone walls, shaped like a star. The walls are sloped(but not enough to allow climbers to ger up easily), and are surrounded by earthen ramparts to protect from the worst of cannon fire.(at least I thnk this is how fortresses were designed in this time period)

[Captain Cyran]

Hey shep, could you host an image of my country for me?

[Captain Cyran]

Can someone add a scale to the map? So we know how big our countries are.

[Crown]

Sea Skimmer, if we are using Shep's Round 9 map there is an island south of Pablo, that is almost interescted in two... They are marked as free slots, and if no one has claimed them, anychance of me having them?

Small Island Duchy, related to Pablo's Empire, pays tribute and maintains very small army, medium (or large for it's size) Navy, with a huge mercentile fleet?

Say population of about 4 million?

Basically a proxy province of Pablo's but the 'Duke' is really ruled by the Merchant's guild, who contorl the bulk of the fleet?

Also I guess I Pablo would have to be okay with this too.

[Sea Skimmer]

Sea Skimmer, if we are using Shep's Round 9 map there is an island south of Pablo, that is almost interescted in two... They are marked as free slots, and if no one has claimed them, anychance of me having them?[/quot[e

I suppose, we start Wednesday.

Small Island Duchy, related to Pablo's Empire, pays tribute and maintains very small army, medium (or large for it's size) Navy, with a huge mercentile fleet?

The last thing we need is another huge merchant fleet. There's only so much commerce to go around and the requirements to support a large fleet are not universally found.

Say population of about 4 million?

That's fine, the worlds already overpopulated

[Alyrium Denryle]

I suppose, we start Wednesday.

An STGOD starting on my Birthdy? What a wonderful birthdy gift!!!

[Jaded Masses]

Various unforseen complications in moving have arose and I will have to drop out of this rp due to them. Sorry. I may enter later as a single character or nomad tribe (with T-72s ) later on.

[Crown]

The last thing we need is another huge merchant fleet. There's only so much commerce to go around and the requirements to support a large fleet are not universally found.

Considering that it is an island nation, boardered by pirate cities ... still if you want, I could just make it a 'flag of convenience' for other nations? I don't know, if you want it scaled back, then so be it.

Say population of about 4 million?

That's fine, the worlds already overpopulated

EDIT :: Would 2 million be better?

EDIT :: I spelt 'flag' as 'fag'

[Agent Fisher]

If it is not to late I take which ever slot you want to give me.

[Sea Skimmer]

Considering that it is an island nation, boardered by pirate cities ... still if you want, I could just make it a 'fag of convenience' for other nations? I don't know, if you want it scaled back, then so be it.

Such practices don't exist in 1725, a neutral flag is no protection and being close to pirates would chase traders away. I'd prefer if you based your economy around resources and perhaps an army that's hired up as mercenaries.

EDIT :: Would 2 million be better?

It doesnt really matter