Diablo 3

[DireApostasy]

I've not been able to try it yet as my PC is broken and won't run any games newer then DOW, but as a rule of thumb, if you expect all your games to have some new and revolutionary feature or something like that, Blizzard games aren't really for you as they rarely if ever have those but what they do is make really fun games from tried and true methods.

No. I'm asking because this game is surprising me with its popularity in spite of the type of game it is, as did Diablo 2. I'm looking and wondering what it is that makes it so popular, and all I'm coming up with is name recognition and name branding and the social pressure to play that comes with it. People who don't even like dungeon crawlers are playing Diablo 3. This basically contrasts Starcraft II, which as far as I know, still only appealed to people who would generally like a strategy or a sci fi title. Completely anecdotal.

Because it is, in general, good fun. Run around, kill things, take their stuff. And the story is pretty good too, for those who pay attention to such things.

[Stark]

The difference between Starcraft and Diablo is accessibility. People who don't want to watch videos of aces to learn the winning patterns can still enjoy Diablo. Part of Diablos success as a franchise is that normal people who weigh less than 80kg will buy it and play it.

I love it, though. 'Just a dungeon crawler' 'why play it' 'branding'. These are all reasons why people laughed at Skyrim hysteria, and D3 is much more accessible and to my mind even more distinct from the previous games. Why play any game in any established genre? Clearly social pressures!

[wautd]

Game is pretty fun, but Belial is a mf to beat.

I dunno, I remember Duriel being much harder for the Act II end boss. At least you could dodge Belial's attacks.

[HeadCreeps]

I love it, though. 'Just a dungeon crawler' 'why play it' 'branding'. These are all reasons why people laughed at Skyrim hysteria, and D3 is much more accessible and to my mind even more distinct from the previous games. Why play any game in any established genre? Clearly social pressures!

Except I wasn't laughing at it. There is nothing wrong with it being just another dungeon crawler. I'm asking because, as I said, I'm interested in why this game has so many people who wouldn't normally play such a game trying it out.

Good point about accessibility versus Starcraft.

Would you say social pressure has nothing to do with people playing specific online multiplayer games? Do you get what I mean about social pressure?

[Stark]

People are drawn to high population games because they work better. D3 was always going to have high population, but I'm not sure if that is a big motivator for all the people who won't actually join games with other people.

Just think of it as an action game or mobile game that the nerd sphere allows people to like. Whether its nostalgia or social pressure or whatever, the game has exposure and that exposure should continue to grow the population, horrible failures aside.

[HeadCreeps]

Whether its nostalgia or social pressure or whatever, the game has exposure and that exposure should continue to grow the population, horrible failures aside.

Nostalgia shouldn't be the kind of factor it is for other series like Skyrim, because Diablo 2 (2000) is quite old compared to games like the Fallouts (2008-10) or Oblivion (2006). Yeah it factors in, but only for old farts.

Are there any dungeon crawlers in the last 5 years that managed to be successful without being a successor to another game? I'm reasonably sure there was on the PS3 but it was notoriously difficult or somesuch?

[Stark]

Diablo is in the situation of effectively defining a genre. Not only did D2 continue to sell well to the present time, but all the people who grew up on Titan Quest knew it was 'like Diablo'. The exposure is absolutely huge.

[Darth Quorthon]

Just downed Belial on Nightmare. It remains to be seen if I'll be able to persevere and push through to Hell and Inferno. Co-op games are fun though. When I played Diablo 2 back in 2000 it was strictly a solo experience, as I didn't have an internet connection in my bedroom and my folks weren't going to let me play it on their PC. I've pretty much fallen into the pattern of going solo when I just want to farm, then finding a co-op game when I feel like advancing the quest.

[wautd]

While the free rune skills are nice, I kind of miss the old system where you could make runewords to improve your items, plus it gave a nice extra economy of its own (at least I could find runes in D2 while I never, ever found a damn Stone of Jordan).

[Thanas]

Finished the game for the first time. Pretty good. The main problem I had as a sorcerer were finding space to evade - once you got that, you can pretty much out-dps everything. I mean, 350 dps? Yes, please.

[wautd]

I also noticed the game hasn't included the charms from Diablo 2. Not sure I like this. They could take up a lot of space, but then again, some were really useful to carry around.

[wautd]

I also noticed the game hasn't included the charms from Diablo 2. Not sure I like this. They could take up a lot of space, but then again, some were really useful to carry around.

edit: I DO miss the ability to allocate skill/statpoints though. Now it's being done automatically and I think you loose a lot of flavour between possible character builds this way.

[Minischoles]

Finished the game for the first time. Pretty good. The main problem I had as a sorcerer were finding space to evade - once you got that, you can pretty much out-dps everything. I mean, 350 dps? Yes, please.

I tried playing Barbarian first, got annihilated once I reached the harder settings - and Wizard is incredibly easy once you figure out kiting. And that is basically what 90% of the harder difficulty consists of, kiting like crazy because everything can 1 shot you.

[Darmalus]

Just beat it for the first time. It's a close race between wallers, teleporters and vortexers for my most hated random enemy. I was all the way to Act 3 before I realized that the sell price of white and grey gear wasn't scaling the way gold drops were, I lament all those unnecessary trips back to town to empty my inventory.

I rather enjoy the random nature of the levels and enemies, I play with a lot of people I play WoW with, so its a nice change of pace to have encounters where the abilities and dynamics of the fight are learned on the fly. Haven't had this much fun since WotLK.

[wautd]

Got into the final act now. Can't say I was ever surprised by all the plot twists (saw them coming from miles away) but it's been a good run, although it felt short compared to Diablo 2 (or at least I remember it like that; perhaps Diablo 2 was a lot harder to do solo on normal).

Anyone found anything green or legendary yet?

[wautd]

Oh yeah, there won't be a secret cow level, but we a magical pony realm instead. It looks jolly hilarious.

How to get there.

[MrDakka]

Just beat it for the first time. It's a close race between wallers, teleporters and vortexers for my most hated random enemy.

Try rolling against a champion pack of Fast, Frozen, and Invulnerable Minions. Randomization!!! ARGH pretty much unkiteable... and those enrage timers

[MrDakka]

Oh yeah, there won't be a secret cow level, but we a magical pony realm instead. It looks jolly hilarious.

How to get there.

Good lolz

[Darth Quorthon]

Got into the final act now. Can't say I was ever surprised by all the plot twists (saw them coming from miles away) but it's been a good run, although it felt short compared to Diablo 2 (or at least I remember it like that; perhaps Diablo 2 was a lot harder to do solo on normal).

Anyone found anything green or legendary yet?

I got a Legendary hand crossbow called "Dawn" off a random drop in act 3 nightmare, I put it on the auction house for 50k and it sold about 5 minutes after the cooldown expired.

Azmodan on Nightmare was pretty much a joke. I'm hoping to push through and unlock Hell tonight.

[DireApostasy]

I got a legendary mace called Odyn's Son in Act IV on Normal, so it was absolutely terrible, not even worth auctioning. didn't find any o my nightmare playthrough, and have never seen any smithing plans either.

[AniThyng]

Nostalgia shouldn't be the kind of factor it is for other series like Skyrim, because Diablo 2 (2000) is quite old compared to games like the Fallouts (2008-10) or Oblivion (2006). Yeah it factors in, but only for old farts.

Are you sure? There's plenty of people who haven't gamed in a decade deciding to just this once get D3 because they fondly remember D2. Of course nostalgia is a huge factor. I don't even know why you bring in Skyrim, no one plays Skyrim because they are nostalgic for Oblivion, and Fallout3 also had something similar going with regards to Fallout 2 which is of similar vintage.

I was in my senior year of high school when I played D2. 12 years on and I may not have the time to play it as much, but for many of my generation(I'm from a country where the game piracy rate is still pretty high) d3 will be one of the few games bought at full retail price and now we can easily afford it. I would not underestimate the purchasing power of a generation of nostalgic 30 year olds...


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Oh wait. I get it. I'm an old fart. I mean, my signature even references BGII, which is contemporary to D2! None of this Neverwinter Nights or Dragon Age newfangled rubbish*

*J/k, i played those too

[DesertFly]

I've been having loads of fun with Diablo 3 (I got it for free as one of the World of Warcraft annual pass holders), and I didn't like the first two. I don't know what little tweaks together make it different, but it's definitely not nostalgia driving my interest. I played Titan's Quest as well, up through the second act, and couldn't I make myself keep playing.

[HeadCreeps]

oldmaninitis

I'm old, too. I played Diablo 1 around my senior year of High School and I even have fond memories of the original Warcraft: Orcs and Humans. I was referring to the fact that the game doesn't have nostalgic appeal to younger generations of gamers as it would with Bethesda's works (which also works for old farts as long as they haven't fallen into "derrrr I hate games these days, nothing like Baldur's Gate and NWN!!!"). As for bringing in Skyrim, I didn't. Stark did. Any somewhat recent game would fit the bill.

Stark made a fair point about D2 still having sales over the last decade, though. Online RPGs have considerable longevity as long as they don't flop. I'm just not sure what demographic was playing that - online RPGs with a long shelf life tend to retain the same loyal customers and not branch out too heavily to newer gamers, but then again Blizzard's other online RPG is an exception to this rule.

No one plays Skyrim because they are nostalgic for Oblivion? This is news to me.

[AniThyng]

oldmaninitis

I'm old, too. I played Diablo 1 around my senior year of High School and I even have fond memories of the original Warcraft: Orcs and Humans. I was referring to the fact that the game doesn't have nostalgic appeal to younger generations of gamers as it would with Bethesda's works (which also works for old farts as long as they haven't fallen into "derrrr I hate games these days, nothing like Baldur's Gate and NWN!!!"). As for bringing in Skyrim, I didn't. Stark did. Any somewhat recent game would fit the bill.

Stark made a fair point about D2 still having sales over the last decade, though. Online RPGs have considerable longevity as long as they don't flop. I'm just not sure what demographic was playing that - online RPGs with a long shelf life tend to retain the same loyal customers and not branch out too heavily to newer gamers, but then again Blizzard's other online RPG is an exception to this rule.

No one plays Skyrim because they are nostalgic for Oblivion? This is news to me.

Well maybe we're using different definitions of nostalgia here. Skyrim was 5 years removed from Oblivion, but they fundamentally do not really span 2 different eras. Both still share the same console generation even. But you didn't really see people who say, have fond memories of Daggerfall come out and declare they want to get Skyrim on account of that in a big way. I mean I'm sure there are, and I personally did feel quite a bit of nostalgia, but it wasn't anything like a prime consideration. I started playing Oblivion sometime in 2007 and it doesn't really invoke any particularly strong sense of nostalgia since 2007 vs 2012 isn't really all that different. GPU's and CPU's got somewhat more powerful in the interm, but not in what I would call a "generational" way.

On the other hand, the gap between D2 and D3 is much more pronounced. Even if we use the definitive D2 e.g. D2 + LOD plus full patches, which I suppose takes us into 2002 or so - that's a pretty big relative span of time for someone just short of 30 - especially when you consider in between D2 and D3 I left high school, did Pre-U, then Uni, then 5 years of career building on top of all the other things that happened etc. When I think of the times surrounding D2, and play D3 where it evokes those, it's an entirely different feeling altogether. Technical wise, it's very different also, we're talking about an era where a graphics card meant something like a TNT2 or a 3DFX card, and where XP was still very new (I used Win98 well into 2004!) vs...well. now.


I think something of the same phenomenon was at work for SC2 - SC1 came out in what, 1998? I can recall calling my friend, setting up an agreement of when to call, then hanging up, connecting my modem and waiting for him to dial in - contrast to SC2 when everyone has always on internet and a cellphone.

You don't get that kind of feeling if you're comparing New Vegas to vanilla FO3.

[HeadCreeps]

I have no idea why you think nostalgia must span separate console generations.

This is kind of irrelevant though. Looks like Diablo 3 has turned out to be a decent game on its own merits even if the series history played a role in its initial hype. The casual non-dungeon crawler fans are bowing out of the game without finishing it, and the people who actually like those kinds of games are fairly positive. The casual non-dungeon crawler fans were the focus of me entering this thread.

That and asking how much of the data is stored server-side. If it's only character data, people will reverse engineer the game and pirate it for solo mode rather easily. If things like monster spawns and drop data are kept server-side, there will probably never be an accurate pirated offline version barring a full blown leak in server files. In terms of game preservation after the servers die, the former is preferred, but for anti-piracy, the latter is. Blizzard has a good history of keeping servers up, though, so game preservation isn't as huge of a concern unless something very bad happens.