Sure you can. You can ban certain kinds of metagame. For example, if two people are friends, and one player decides to drop out, and surrenders his entire 2nd place empire to the 1st place guy giving him the win, that is just stupid. I don't see why we can't ban whining. In other words, what happens in the game is the game as long as it doesn't break rules (we've caught almost every bug and exploit now). Making deals to completely secure borders with people you know from other venues online is just another form of very annoying metagame. All decisions should be as if your empire met another empire, not as if you met a friend.
If you don't call that RP, fine. I call it RP, just freeform. I was not worried with the ST game because well frankly that shit didn't happen in the B5 game yet (it happened after.) Also the ST game didn't get very far, two months instead of more than a year. And was a total gip. You say it won't happen now, but it will, six months from now they'll be some big drama, some backstabbing. One person will say it was wrong another will say it was right. The chances are not likely for it to happen as much because this mod is balanced, but it could happen.
In short friendships should not be threatened if some backstabbing happens. You laugh but I can see it happening. This game seems to be taking off and will likely last a year or more, especially since there won't be two power blocks but five or six, and if one power block gets overwhelmingly powerful the others will move to curtail its domination. To be honest this game could last forever especially with the no-annihilation rules. This game is far larger, far more massive and far more strategic than anything we've ever done.
Whatever your objections, OOC deals are the antithesis of RP entirely. You can argue about whether the Federation is being IC or not IC, but the person can always say he was acting IC. Bad IC is still IC. You might think the Romulans should not do trade but other people can have a different vision for the Romulans. But OOC is completely out of character, completely non-RP. So banning them is a requisite of RP games in my opinion. All other objections are trivial compared to that.
Tuxedo you updating the logs and combat replay? I ran them this turn and sev desktopped, could be a glitch but who knows.
Space Empires V PBW game?
Moderator: Thanas
I'd rather the game be just a game, than some sort of bizzare half-game half-roleplay. You say your story is your own, but these are shared stories. OOC dickery can happen ICly, it's just disgused as bad IC. I doubt that anyone would feel any better having themselves be stabbed in the back and disgused as "poorly done self-serving non-character based actions that are wrote about from an in-character perspective" rather that just finding out that non-binding agreements between players are no more binding in SEV than they are in Monopoly.
You can't outlaw Drama, since it's a matter of someone's reactions. And if people are going to get that worked up over a game, and be so ridiculous as to need these complicated rules of engagement, then we really shouldn't play at all. If people aren't mature enough to just play the game as a game, and get all worked up, then I certainly know that I am feeling less interested already. Come on. Backstabbing like that is the sign of someone who plays the game so poorly that he doesn't even understand the merit of good sportsmanship in an alliance. But what's worse is getting so worked up about it that it overflows into drama.
I just don't see this as being a viable distinction. I refuse to stop discussing things OOCly until people are going to be held to some kind of IC standard. If someone can't make an OOC deal with me, player to player, and can't be trusted to remain the same basic temperment ICly, then that person is just beyond an alliance whatsoever. And that's fine. Not everyone is going to be your friend. Obviously, unless people plan to play "Space Empire Diplomacy Sim" there is going to be some conflict, and in those battles half of the people are going to lose.
I don't see what the big problem is with keeping RP in the game as good RP. It's all or nothing. We're not going to fudge the rules on this, or the rules don't mean a damn. If someone is IC until it would really benefit them, then I can't respect that person's character-holding capacity. And if they can't stay in character, then I won't bother being in-character to them.
I'm not a fan of "My version of IC is that I can do whatever I want and justify it any way I please" in a game like this. It's fine for a tabletop game where you're some kind of Chaotic personality. But Empires do not turn solely on the whim of a single mind, and it's disingenuous to manipulate the IC in that manner. If it's a role-play game then people need to chose their role and play it, not wear a thousand hats and change their temperment from day to day and act like that's in the spirit of the game either.
OOC hurts the game less than that. Unless we go fully IC, there's going to be OOC concerns. Winning the game is itself an OOC concern. And unless we acknowledge that taking care of these OOC concerns in an OOC way is sometimes the easiest and simplest way to do it, it's going to be incredibly silly. It makes more sense for me to work out something with a neighbor before I bring it IC, as it helps me get the story straight. I certainly think that talking to the other authors of this shared story is less damaging to the story itself than all of us writing our own version of a reality that doesn't even have consistancy.
You can't outlaw Drama, since it's a matter of someone's reactions. And if people are going to get that worked up over a game, and be so ridiculous as to need these complicated rules of engagement, then we really shouldn't play at all. If people aren't mature enough to just play the game as a game, and get all worked up, then I certainly know that I am feeling less interested already. Come on. Backstabbing like that is the sign of someone who plays the game so poorly that he doesn't even understand the merit of good sportsmanship in an alliance. But what's worse is getting so worked up about it that it overflows into drama.
I just don't see this as being a viable distinction. I refuse to stop discussing things OOCly until people are going to be held to some kind of IC standard. If someone can't make an OOC deal with me, player to player, and can't be trusted to remain the same basic temperment ICly, then that person is just beyond an alliance whatsoever. And that's fine. Not everyone is going to be your friend. Obviously, unless people plan to play "Space Empire Diplomacy Sim" there is going to be some conflict, and in those battles half of the people are going to lose.
I don't see what the big problem is with keeping RP in the game as good RP. It's all or nothing. We're not going to fudge the rules on this, or the rules don't mean a damn. If someone is IC until it would really benefit them, then I can't respect that person's character-holding capacity. And if they can't stay in character, then I won't bother being in-character to them.
I'm not a fan of "My version of IC is that I can do whatever I want and justify it any way I please" in a game like this. It's fine for a tabletop game where you're some kind of Chaotic personality. But Empires do not turn solely on the whim of a single mind, and it's disingenuous to manipulate the IC in that manner. If it's a role-play game then people need to chose their role and play it, not wear a thousand hats and change their temperment from day to day and act like that's in the spirit of the game either.
OOC hurts the game less than that. Unless we go fully IC, there's going to be OOC concerns. Winning the game is itself an OOC concern. And unless we acknowledge that taking care of these OOC concerns in an OOC way is sometimes the easiest and simplest way to do it, it's going to be incredibly silly. It makes more sense for me to work out something with a neighbor before I bring it IC, as it helps me get the story straight. I certainly think that talking to the other authors of this shared story is less damaging to the story itself than all of us writing our own version of a reality that doesn't even have consistancy.
Damn this is turning into a drama on its own lol.
All I wanted to say is backstabbing is ok. Buyer beware. Nothing is what it seems.
You want to say backstabbing is ok, as long as it's in character. Well fine. But know this: the ambiguity you're leaving opens up a can of worms if anybody ever says something is ic and someone else disagrees.
All I wanted to say is backstabbing is ok. Buyer beware. Nothing is what it seems.
You want to say backstabbing is ok, as long as it's in character. Well fine. But know this: the ambiguity you're leaving opens up a can of worms if anybody ever says something is ic and someone else disagrees.
Yes, that's what I'd like to say. If someone wants to make OOC deals, then that's where the deal stays. If someone backstabs me in back-room dealings, I can be pissed, but unless I ask them to bring that bit of stuff IC, then it's like it never went public. If Saddamn and the US had a secret, backroom deal to pull out before we executed him, but the US decided to screw him... then well, thems the breaks.brianeyci wrote:Damn this is turning into a drama on its own lol.
All I wanted to say is backstabbing is ok. Buyer beware. Nothing is what it seems.
You want to say backstabbing is ok, as long as it's in character. Well fine. But know this: the ambiguity you're leaving opens up a can of worms if anybody ever says something is ic and someone else disagrees.
We can't force people not to be self-interested. But we can ask them to play their cards above the table. Buyer beware only benefits the cruel, as honest players don't need that rule to play honestly, and dishonest players only need that rule to escape punishment. IC punishment. For IC actions.
Unless you can develop, support, and honestly create a legitimate IC reason to do something then you shouldn't be able to use your IC forces to do it. So if you want to RP a palace coup, or a civil war, that's fine, that's RP. But if you want to attack me because my war is going badly, even though we have an alliance that has benefitted both our peoples and have previously RP'd the friendship, that's using IC assets for an OOC reason and is just as bad (or worse) than an OOC backstab.
So, really, bring it IC. Like in a D&D game. You need to Roleplay a class shift. You don't just DO it because "Lol my guy wants an instant feat". You need to roleplay the person's gradual shift, until it makes sense for the change to happen. If someone wants to say "This was IC," then it should have clearly been DEMONSTRATED in the roleplay. No hidden thought processes. No latent insanities. No invisible backroom dealings that spring from nowhere. And no palace coups, unless---like Trog's---they are PLAYED OUT. That's good RP.
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Arthur_Tuxedo
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 5637
- Joined: 2002-07-23 03:28am
- Location: San Francisco, California
I have nothing to add except that I don't support any rules to try and force a desired behavior from players. I don't think either of you were actually advocating that, but just wanted to make it clear.
As for the B5 game, the problem with that game was Kojiro, plain and simple. No Kojiro, no problem. I have no fear that anything like what happened in B5 will happen here.
As for the B5 game, the problem with that game was Kojiro, plain and simple. No Kojiro, no problem. I have no fear that anything like what happened in B5 will happen here.
"I'm so fast that last night I turned off the light switch in my hotel room and was in bed before the room was dark." - Muhammad Ali
"Dating is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a heart-pounding, stomach-wrenching, gut-churning exercise in pitting your fear of rejection and public humiliation against your desire to find a mate. Enjoy." - Darth Wong
"Dating is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a heart-pounding, stomach-wrenching, gut-churning exercise in pitting your fear of rejection and public humiliation against your desire to find a mate. Enjoy." - Darth Wong
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Kingside_Bishop
- Youngling
- Posts: 96
- Joined: 2007-05-03 02:19pm
- Location: Belen, New Mexico
My opinion on the matter is this: OOC chatter is necessary to the game, because it keeps things running smoothly. As long as we can talk to each other, as players, about what we're collectively doing, then we'll have an easier time coming up with a collective story. Which is especially important, in a game where no one will ever actually be eliminated. Granted, it'd be a pretty crappy thing to do, saying one thing IC and doing something else, OOC -- I don't think people should do that -- but making a rule against OOC communication is, I think, going too far. I don't know if anyone's actually recomending that, but it would suck, that's for sure. That'd be cutting off our nose, to spite our face.
Anyway... oh, oh, gossip! What happenned in the Babylon 5 game?
And, by the way, nice D&D reference, Covenant. Adventure on, brutha. I don't suppose you're registered on the Wizards boards, are you?
Anyway... oh, oh, gossip! What happenned in the Babylon 5 game?
And, by the way, nice D&D reference, Covenant. Adventure on, brutha. I don't suppose you're registered on the Wizards boards, are you?
~ Kingside_Bishop
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GuppyShark
- Sith Devotee
- Posts: 2830
- Joined: 2005-03-13 06:52am
- Location: South Australia
I think it is valuable to point out, especially as we have new players this time around, that just because someone PMs you a deal, doesn't mean they'll stick to it. Even I need to remind myself of that occasionally, and I've been burned more than anyone. 
With OOC negotiation there's always going to be an element of, "Blah wouldn't betray me, he/she's got too good a reputation" or whatever. When people PM each other OOCly they're including their own board reputation as insurance/leverage.
It's impossible not to metagame like this, at least subconciously.
I would personally prefer all private communications regarding the game be done IC, but I know that's a big ask.
With OOC negotiation there's always going to be an element of, "Blah wouldn't betray me, he/she's got too good a reputation" or whatever. When people PM each other OOCly they're including their own board reputation as insurance/leverage.
It's impossible not to metagame like this, at least subconciously.
I would personally prefer all private communications regarding the game be done IC, but I know that's a big ask.
Definately! If someone PMs you but does not RP it out, or make mention of it on the boards--like the Exiles and I have done in the RP thread for example--then there's really no way to assume they're going to follow through on it.GuppyShark wrote:I think it is valuable to point out, especially as we have new players this time around, that just because someone PMs you a deal, doesn't mean they'll stick to it. Even I need to remind myself of that occasionally, and I've been burned more than anyone.
This is one of the reasons I was so big into the "IC actions, IC consequences" side-effect of RP. Negotiating OOCly, and then deciding to make it IC and roleplayed out, is the best way to get a clear and understood agreement between people without mixing it up in IC stuff like "lolz i wuz lying" or "That leader was deposed last turn, as you saw, so that agreement is no longer binding!"
No OOC agreement is binding. None! But I would like the IC ones to be.
What are the most common OOC agreements? "I won't attack you" or "Let's get that guy" or "If he attacks me, will you help out?" Think about it. Which of these are just OOC versions of IC agreements? All of 'em! If you make these, and your ally agrees, make it IC. If your ally doesn't want to make it known, then how can you be sure it's binding? You can't. If he won't publically admit to it, maybe he's doing it because he's lying, and is working against you.
Or maybe because he's trying to betray his ally in secret. That's the real kicker. When people work together in secret against someone and try not to be found out, that's the only use of OOC I can think of that leads to hurt feelings and CANNOT be brought IC. And I don't feel real bad for people who can't do that in private. If you want to betray your ally, please do them the human dignity of trying to RP it out. A nation of millions of billions of people do not all decide to hate their neighbors and strong allies for the past ten years at once. It's extremely bad RP to claim that they would, or that the people are merely complicit, or that there wouldn't be resistance to those orders. If you want to betray someone who you have no reason to betray except for OOC reasons, at least spend a few turns making poses about it.
That doesn't mean an alliance of convenience can't come apart at the seams and break into fighting. But I don't think it's very fair, or very IC, for previously friendly Civs to break into fighting for gamey OOC reasons. That's all I ask. A few turns of RP, at least, to demonstrate a shift in mood. Otherwise, meh, I'd like the leader in charge to be deposed by his generals for being an insane person. It'd be like Bush screaming for an invasion of Canada without even bothing to claim they have WMDs.
Anyway, I know some people don't really want to RP that much, and I suppose we can't force them to. In which case, we really aren't going to be able to keep any degree of IC accountability in the game, so the whole issue is rather fruitless. It's hard for some of us to be rigorous RP'ers while others are just being gamey. Trying to play the game to win isn't a bad thing, but we really can't mix RP and non-RP people. I'd love to keep it an RP game, but I don't know how I can afford to if other people won't keep to the same standard.
And I don't want to sound angry, but we have two different camps here, with me kinda in the middle, and I just want to know what's expected of me without either being considered gamey or being taken advantage of. Either this is a strategy game with an RP thread or an RP game with a strategy engine.
And I don't want to sound angry, but we have two different camps here, with me kinda in the middle, and I just want to know what's expected of me without either being considered gamey or being taken advantage of. Either this is a strategy game with an RP thread or an RP game with a strategy engine.
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Arthur_Tuxedo
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 5637
- Joined: 2002-07-23 03:28am
- Location: San Francisco, California
Actually, there was one rule that we were forced to implement before, and I think it's a good one. You can't make up total bullshit in your RP to fake people out. Like, writing a post about how you send your ships to a specific system when your ships are actually being sent to a different system. Of course, that may be another one of those things that's more of a people problem than a rule problem, and we seem to have a good crew for this one.
You can read all the sordid details firsthand by searching for the thread for the game, but basically there was this guy who wanted to play the Vorlons, by far the most powerful race along with the Shadows, promising to use behind-the-scenes manipulation like the ones in the show. Instead he conquered and glassed planets left and right and was probably the most aggressive of all players, but he was so incompetent about research and ship design that many of us could eventually beat him easily, even with far inferior tech. Whatever the standout feature was of the ships we were pasting him with, he would complain and say we were cheating, always with some half-baked reason why something was an 'exploit'. This from someone who traded tech against the rules, made OOC deals with a real life friend, all the while intending to stab him in the back, and wrote intentionally misleading RP. No rule can save a game with a player like that (and the game did in fact ultimately self-destruct rather than being resolved), which is why I say that certain things are a people problem and not a rules problem.Kingside_Bishop wrote:Anyway... oh, oh, gossip! What happenned in the Babylon 5 game?
"I'm so fast that last night I turned off the light switch in my hotel room and was in bed before the room was dark." - Muhammad Ali
"Dating is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a heart-pounding, stomach-wrenching, gut-churning exercise in pitting your fear of rejection and public humiliation against your desire to find a mate. Enjoy." - Darth Wong
"Dating is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a heart-pounding, stomach-wrenching, gut-churning exercise in pitting your fear of rejection and public humiliation against your desire to find a mate. Enjoy." - Darth Wong
Damn I shouldn't have brought up B5 at all. Gossip blows. I'm sure Kojiro would disagree with the finer points of that, especially "most aggressive player" (Marxis probably was) and misleading RP (I don't remember that but maybe my memory sucks.) And Kojiro is not here to defend himself so let's not talk about old dead shit. I'm sorry I brought it up.
Forget the old, in with the new. Where the hell are you Keevan, turn apparently churns in less than 3 minutes? Did you change the time on him Tuxedo?
I am thinking that Keevan e-mailed and it didn't get accepted damn. I'm going to try one more pm, don't run it for 30 minutes if you could.
Forget the old, in with the new. Where the hell are you Keevan, turn apparently churns in less than 3 minutes? Did you change the time on him Tuxedo?
I am thinking that Keevan e-mailed and it didn't get accepted damn. I'm going to try one more pm, don't run it for 30 minutes if you could.
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Arthur_Tuxedo
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 5637
- Joined: 2002-07-23 03:28am
- Location: San Francisco, California
I didn't change the time, I had simply forgotten to change it earlier, but I stated in this thread that the churn time would be the same as it was before the replacement turn. I'll run it a little late tonight.
Anyway, you're right that it's not fair to talk about someone who's not here to respond, but the question was asked with expectation of an answer, and it was relevant to what I was talking about in terms of RP rules.
Anyway, you're right that it's not fair to talk about someone who's not here to respond, but the question was asked with expectation of an answer, and it was relevant to what I was talking about in terms of RP rules.
"I'm so fast that last night I turned off the light switch in my hotel room and was in bed before the room was dark." - Muhammad Ali
"Dating is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a heart-pounding, stomach-wrenching, gut-churning exercise in pitting your fear of rejection and public humiliation against your desire to find a mate. Enjoy." - Darth Wong
"Dating is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a heart-pounding, stomach-wrenching, gut-churning exercise in pitting your fear of rejection and public humiliation against your desire to find a mate. Enjoy." - Darth Wong
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ColonialAdmiral
- Padawan Learner
- Posts: 183
- Joined: 2007-05-03 11:01pm
I'll be roleplaying, but I wan't to wait untill my empires a bit bigger.
"Captain Blythe stared at the vast expanse of space before him. Truly, the Lemurians were the one and only race in existance. The colony ship moved towards planet X, and then activated its braking systems. It slowly managed a parking orbit. Blythe smiled. He was going to be a new Colonial Govenor. Everything he had worked for at the academy would finaly be paying off. He would be able to support his disabled brother, and put his parents into a fine retirement home. He would have the wealth and prestige, He would get married. He would set up a line of decendents that would bring greatness to the Lemurian Commonwealth. He began activating the colonization procedures, and just when the pre-fabricated structures were about to deploy and enter the atmosphere, a message came up on his console. "We cannot colonize Planet X as there is already a colony there."
"Fuck." said Blythe. He pulled out his sidearm and shot himself, his blood forming a red pool floor, a pool as red as Planet X itself."
See how boring that is?
See, I haven't met aliens yet. When I do, I can roleplay.
"OMG da Alienz are attacking!"
Pretty sweet no?
"Captain Blythe stared at the vast expanse of space before him. Truly, the Lemurians were the one and only race in existance. The colony ship moved towards planet X, and then activated its braking systems. It slowly managed a parking orbit. Blythe smiled. He was going to be a new Colonial Govenor. Everything he had worked for at the academy would finaly be paying off. He would be able to support his disabled brother, and put his parents into a fine retirement home. He would have the wealth and prestige, He would get married. He would set up a line of decendents that would bring greatness to the Lemurian Commonwealth. He began activating the colonization procedures, and just when the pre-fabricated structures were about to deploy and enter the atmosphere, a message came up on his console. "We cannot colonize Planet X as there is already a colony there."
"Fuck." said Blythe. He pulled out his sidearm and shot himself, his blood forming a red pool floor, a pool as red as Planet X itself."
See how boring that is?
See, I haven't met aliens yet. When I do, I can roleplay.
"OMG da Alienz are attacking!"
Pretty sweet no?
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Nephtys
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: 2005-04-02 10:54pm
- Location: South Cali... where life is cheap!
Okay. Nothing I built last turn was produced. I designed like ten new classes, and now for some reason 7 of my queues are empty.
In fact, none of the designs I had being made exist anymore.
Something's massively wrong. :/
Everything else is there. All of my planets have been renamed, my research is changed... just nothing built. All my queues are empty.
In fact, none of the designs I had being made exist anymore.
Something's massively wrong. :/
Everything else is there. All of my planets have been renamed, my research is changed... just nothing built. All my queues are empty.
You can't do half your turn, save, and do the other half. I can duplicate the same error, clearing of construction queues and designs not existing as if I had never made them, if I do half a turn, reload, do the other half and process.
If possible get a new .plr file of your last turn to tuxedo this morning and he could rechurn it, a .plr file where you do the entire turn all at once.
Unfortunately, saving half your turn, reloading and resubmitting totally fucks the turn up. You did that last turn right, when we replaced 1.06 with 1.07? So you cannot just load your old saved game. You need to have the sdn3.gam file from last turn and use it and do the entire turn at once.
Annoying as hell bug, and it's such a simple bug (saved games not working) that it's stupid that they didn't catch it, but oh well. EDIT: If you don't have the sdn3.gam file from last turn, you could ask Tuxedo since he apparently archives them all. And apparently archives all the .plr files too, since it's supposed to delete them after each process but somehow Tuxedo saves them.
If possible get a new .plr file of your last turn to tuxedo this morning and he could rechurn it, a .plr file where you do the entire turn all at once.
Unfortunately, saving half your turn, reloading and resubmitting totally fucks the turn up. You did that last turn right, when we replaced 1.06 with 1.07? So you cannot just load your old saved game. You need to have the sdn3.gam file from last turn and use it and do the entire turn at once.
Annoying as hell bug, and it's such a simple bug (saved games not working) that it's stupid that they didn't catch it, but oh well. EDIT: If you don't have the sdn3.gam file from last turn, you could ask Tuxedo since he apparently archives them all. And apparently archives all the .plr files too, since it's supposed to delete them after each process but somehow Tuxedo saves them.
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Nephtys
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: 2005-04-02 10:54pm
- Location: South Cali... where life is cheap!
d'oh! I'd like to redo it ENTIRELY from scratch if possible. Blehs.brianeyci wrote:You can't do half your turn, save, and do the other half. I can duplicate the same error, clearing of construction queues and designs not existing as if I had never made them, if I do half a turn, reload, do the other half and process.
If possible get a new .plr file of your last turn to tuxedo this morning and he could rechurn it, a .plr file where you do the entire turn all at once.
Unfortunately, saving half your turn, reloading and resubmitting totally fucks the turn up. You did that last turn right, when we replaced 1.06 with 1.07? So you cannot just load your old saved game. You need to have the sdn3.gam file from last turn and use it and do the entire turn at once.
Annoying as hell bug, and it's such a simple bug (saved games not working) that it's stupid that they didn't catch it, but oh well. EDIT: If you don't have the sdn3.gam file from last turn, you could ask Tuxedo since he apparently archives them all. And apparently archives all the .plr files too, since it's supposed to delete them after each process but somehow Tuxedo saves them.
I think I have that turn lying around somewhere.-
Arthur_Tuxedo
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 5637
- Joined: 2002-07-23 03:28am
- Location: San Francisco, California
PBW's down, so I'll have to rechurn after work.
"I'm so fast that last night I turned off the light switch in my hotel room and was in bed before the room was dark." - Muhammad Ali
"Dating is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a heart-pounding, stomach-wrenching, gut-churning exercise in pitting your fear of rejection and public humiliation against your desire to find a mate. Enjoy." - Darth Wong
"Dating is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a heart-pounding, stomach-wrenching, gut-churning exercise in pitting your fear of rejection and public humiliation against your desire to find a mate. Enjoy." - Darth Wong
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Nephtys
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: 2005-04-02 10:54pm
- Location: South Cali... where life is cheap!
Em, what's the link to the last turn (#11? Filename Sdn3_12.zip?)
I didn't know saving mid-turn doesn't work anymore. It was really handly in SE4. Em. Given that I don't have the very previous turn, hopefully the file I sent you will work. I loaded an old game's moves, and redesigned all the ships and queues there. So theoretically it should be okay...
I didn't know saving mid-turn doesn't work anymore. It was really handly in SE4. Em. Given that I don't have the very previous turn, hopefully the file I sent you will work. I loaded an old game's moves, and redesigned all the ships and queues there. So theoretically it should be okay...
Yeah it stinks heh heh.
I don't know if it works unless you use the original sdn3.gam. I wouldn't take the risk and try and find someone with e-mailed turns who's got turn 11. Tuxedo saves every single turn in his e-mail so you could ask him for it (I'm not sure if it's 11 or 12 or 13 the last one, but he will know.)
As buggy as sev is, the real time combat kicks ass. I wouldn't go back to seiv if you paid me. There's just no way that a fleet should be able to fire all its weapons and destroy a whole other fleet before they return fire -- it might make more "realism" or whatever but it's a fundamental flaw that can't be fixed in seiv except by real time combat in sev.
I don't know if it works unless you use the original sdn3.gam. I wouldn't take the risk and try and find someone with e-mailed turns who's got turn 11. Tuxedo saves every single turn in his e-mail so you could ask him for it (I'm not sure if it's 11 or 12 or 13 the last one, but he will know.)
As buggy as sev is, the real time combat kicks ass. I wouldn't go back to seiv if you paid me. There's just no way that a fleet should be able to fire all its weapons and destroy a whole other fleet before they return fire -- it might make more "realism" or whatever but it's a fundamental flaw that can't be fixed in seiv except by real time combat in sev.
All I know is this: if I do part of my turn, save it, start up sev later and do the rest especially construction queues and ship design in the second time, if I churn a turn the ship designs disappear as if I never made them and the construction queues turn out empty. I can replicate this bug, all the time.
Maybe it has something to do with the order I do things, maybe not. But I recommend to be safe everybody do their whole turn all at once. Annoying yes, but they shouldn't take more than 30 minutes.
What I do is look at my turn, then brood over it for a whole day. Once I've figured out exactly what I want, then I play my turn all at once.
EDIT: Maybe if you do your turn, save it, load it up later, and save it again before ending turn it'll work doing the turn in parts. Maybe when it generates the .plr file, it generates it from the saved game instead of the game that you're playing right that second. But still I wouldn't risk it.
Maybe it has something to do with the order I do things, maybe not. But I recommend to be safe everybody do their whole turn all at once. Annoying yes, but they shouldn't take more than 30 minutes.
What I do is look at my turn, then brood over it for a whole day. Once I've figured out exactly what I want, then I play my turn all at once.
EDIT: Maybe if you do your turn, save it, load it up later, and save it again before ending turn it'll work doing the turn in parts. Maybe when it generates the .plr file, it generates it from the saved game instead of the game that you're playing right that second. But still I wouldn't risk it.
It's probably just a bug. Since you saved and it worked, maybe saving, reloading, saving and ending works and saving, reloading and ending doesn't work. That would explain why your save worked and mine didn't.
All I know is I warned about it four pages ago happening to me, so I've done my duty.
Neph if you can try and save the turn before you send it to Tuxedo. Overwrite the old turn file. Maybe that will stop it.
All I know is I warned about it four pages ago happening to me, so I've done my duty.
Neph if you can try and save the turn before you send it to Tuxedo. Overwrite the old turn file. Maybe that will stop it.
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Nephtys
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: 2005-04-02 10:54pm
- Location: South Cali... where life is cheap!
It at least had to have partly worked. Half my ships moved, research shifted and my diplomacy was sent. Only the design and queue changes didn't. Maybe that isnt' saved...brianeyci wrote:It's probably just a bug. Since you saved and it worked, maybe saving, reloading, saving and ending works and saving, reloading and ending doesn't work. That would explain why your save worked and mine didn't.
All I know is I warned about it four pages ago happening to me, so I've done my duty.
Neph if you can try and save the turn before you send it to Tuxedo. Overwrite the old turn file. Maybe that will stop it.