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When it comes to the hardware, we're pretty much set; we all now know the Zune inside and out. But how it interacts with the software, the marketplace, etc. -- that's where the magic happens. Or doesn't. We really wanted to give the Zune the benefit of the doubt. We hoped installing the Zune software and getting our player running would be as seamless and painless as getting iTunes and an iPod running on your machine, since that is, after all, what it's up against. (Granted, not even iTunes is bereft of major problems on major releases.) Unfortunately, the reality of our experience with the first version of the Zune software this afternoon is much like that of many version 1 software experiences. It sucks. Read on to see what happened.

Granted, this is just one reviewer's experience, but it still doesn't bode too well for Microsoft. It seems to me that Apple doesn't have too much to be worried about at this point.

Microsoft seems...well, downright insane.

The Zune is basicly the same price point and capacity as the iPod, with a bigger screen (at the same resolution) and WiFi. However, the WiFi is practically completely disabled (you can't use it for anything actually useful).

It's not PlaysForSure compatible so basicly anyone who is already using a music service has no use for it. That includes purchasers who use the MSN Music Store.

There is NO video content for it, and so far, no music content either (at least till the Zune Music Store launches).

And to get content providers to actually notice them, Microsoft is apparently bribing studios by giving them a few bucks for every Zune sold even if no one buys them music.

With the addition of WiFi, a bigger screen and some money going to studios, Microsoft is taking a loss on every player sold...it's not compatible with anything out there now and frankly there's nothing that especially distinguishes it from the iPod other than having less content.

See the last pic here

That lady looks ... absolutely orgasmic ... at the installation failure.

Are those two women next to her making out?

Yeah i've also been trying to determine what exactly that picture on the failure screen is supposed to represent. A bit of a marketing failure on MS' part, if you ask me.

Oh what could have been.
Hey, maybe they'll release a patch

I was thinking I might buy one of these when my iPod finally ran out of Warranty, but I guess I'll be going back to iRiver

I can't believe they think this garbage is actually going to compete with the iTunes/iPod combo. Even if we neglect the crashing, just how many install and setup screens was that? What a pain in the ass.

And has anyone seen the installation failure screen?



So is the girl getting raped by a bigger, butcher girl or something? Or does Zune software failure lead to inflamed genital herpes?

ThatGuyFromThatPlace wrote:Oh what could have been.
Hey, maybe they'll release a patch

I was thinking I might buy one of these when my iPod finally ran out of Warranty, but I guess I'll be going back to iRiver

What's wrong with iPods?

Was wondering the same thing. The iRiver is basicly the same thing, except heavier, and with less content and accessories available. Only advantage I can think of is FM Radio...

But iRivers have a retarded interface. A friend bought one (at the time they were cheaper/larger than the 4G iPods), but she ditched it almost immediately because it was just a pain to use.

On my iRiver H320 at least I can play my .ogg format files, my own videos, don't have to deal with any DRM crap, get fan-made mods and Rockbox runs on it too.
I don't need a multitude of accessories and it was far cheaper than any comparable iPod.

Jawawithagun wrote:On my iRiver H320 at least I can play my .ogg format files, my own videos, don't have to deal with any DRM crap, get fan-made mods and Rockbox runs on it too.
I don't need a multitude of accessories and it was far cheaper than any comparable iPod.

Creative Zens are far superior. The Vision:M I got supports most .avi video, and all the major audio formats. (Sorry, but .ogg is not a major format). I also don't have to put up with DRM crap, a convoluted interface, or bloated proprietary software to load music. Oh, and that marketing pic with the woman in the image Durandal posted looks like she's screaming in horror at something, or she just got shot by a bullet minus the bloody wound.

The iPod, however, is teh sexy. You're paying extra for useless spit and polish, but it's stylish spit and polish

General Zod wrote:

Jawawithagun wrote:On my iRiver H320 at least I can play my .ogg format files, my own videos, don't have to deal with any DRM crap, get fan-made mods and Rockbox runs on it too.
I don't need a multitude of accessories and it was far cheaper than any comparable iPod.

Creative Zens are far superior. The Vision:M I got supports most .avi video, and all the major audio formats. (Sorry, but .ogg is not a major format). I also don't have to put up with DRM crap, a convoluted interface, or bloated proprietary software to load music. Oh, and that marketing pic with the woman in the image Durandal posted looks like she's screaming in horror at something, or she just got shot by a bullet minus the bloody wound.

See, I don't get where this stuff comes from.

How is the Vision M "far superior"? It's fatter, has the same size screen, the same price point, the same capacity, a shorter battery life, and less content and accessory support.

I don't know what "DRM crap" you're talking about; I think I have a total of ONE DRM-protected file on my iPod, which is the copy of Cars I bought off iTunes- all my other movies (including Phantom of the Opera, Spider-Man 2, etc) are regular MPEG-4 files I ripped with Handbrake or converted in one click with iSquint.

The interface is inferior and the only advantages I see are FM radio and the ability to playback avi files (I convert everything to MPEG-4 anyway).

Praxis wrote: See, I don't get where this stuff comes from.

How is the Vision M "far superior"? It's fatter, has the same size screen, the same price point, the same capacity, a shorter battery life, and less content and accessory support.

It might be bigger and have less accessories, but I bought it to play music and watch the occasional TV show on the go. It may or may not have a shorter battery life (12 hours of music from what I can tell, and 3-4 hours of video), but is that really a huge point? Who's going to listen to their music for more than twelve hours at a stretch without recharging?

I don't know what "DRM crap" you're talking about; I think I have a total of ONE DRM-protected file on my iPod, which is the copy of Cars I bought off iTunes- all my other movies (including Phantom of the Opera, Spider-Man 2, etc) are regular MPEG-4 files I ripped with Handbrake or converted in one click with iSquint.

Ever try getting music off of an iPod once you put it on? Huge pain in the ass. I like being able to transfer my files between machines as I want to while keeping the naming structures intact, and the M lets me do this with a simple drag & drop. Having to rely on a piece of bloatware (iTunes) to transfer files is annoying.

The interface is inferior and the only advantages I see are FM radio and the ability to playback avi files (I convert everything to MPEG-4 anyway).

I'm not sure how the interface can be seen as inferior except as a matter of personal preference. It's more intuitive than the iPod imo, and is simple enough to get used to after a few tries. As far as compatability, the M is compatible with DivX™ 4 & 55, XviD5, MPEG-1, MPEG-2, MPEG4-SP, WMV9, and Motion-JPEG. (Taken straight from the site). Which means far less work involved in having to convert files. The only real advantages I can see in having an iPod is with having a few extra gadgets for it, and the fact that it's smaller in size. Otherwise I'm just not seeing it either.

Jawawithagun wrote:On my iRiver H320 at least I can play my .ogg format files, my own videos, don't have to deal with any DRM crap, get fan-made mods and Rockbox runs on it too.
I don't need a multitude of accessories and it was far cheaper than any comparable iPod.

I guess for 95% of people with zero ogg files that's really useful. Also, I'm not getting the attraction of playing videos (of course, the iPod can play videos too), I have no idea what you're even talking about with 'DRM crap' as I've never encountered any, there are certainly fan-made iPod mods, etc.

In AU at least they're not that much cheaper (AU$20/30, out of AU$450ish for players), and iPods are well supported and have the best interface in the world. Oh wait, does that make me a brainless Apple fanboy?

Nooooo, I don't have a worthless voice recorder or FM tuner! Because I bought a 30,000 song MP3 player to listen to the radio right guys? Oh no, I use iTunes I must be a mouth-breathing Apple mindslave... it's not like people use iTunes even WITHOUT iPods because it's easy to use and built on the iLife interface standard or anything.

General Zod wrote:Ever try getting music off of an iPod once you put it on? Huge pain in the ass. I like being able to transfer my files between machines as I want to while keeping the naming structures intact, and the M lets me do this with a simple drag & drop. Having to rely on a piece of bloatware (iTunes) to transfer files is annoying.

There is software available that lets you do this with an iPod without much trouble. And, iTunes is bloatware? What are you talking about? Almost everyone I've talked to or read has nothing but praise for iTunes, is there something specific you see as a problem?

SeeingRed wrote:

General Zod wrote:Ever try getting music off of an iPod once you put it on? Huge pain in the ass. I like being able to transfer my files between machines as I want to while keeping the naming structures intact, and the M lets me do this with a simple drag & drop. Having to rely on a piece of bloatware (iTunes) to transfer files is annoying.

There is software available that lets you do this with an iPod without much trouble. And, iTunes is bloatware? What are you talking about? Almost everyone I've talked to or read has nothing but praise for iTunes, is there something specific you see as a problem?

I prefer being able to do that without having to hunt down obscure third party software. As far as bloatware, I've used iTunes and generally dislike the interface as a whole. I also find that it's a good deal slower than other players I've used and doesn't give me nearly the range of customization I'm used to.

I may be talking out of my rear, but who knows. I vaguely recall Microsoft getting slammed for trying to compete in the console market against Sony and Nintendo, and now they're actually doing pretty decently.

Microsoft seems to have this tendency to be able to wedge itself into wherever it chooses to go.

All the reviews of the Zune that I've seen have slammed the software, but think that the physical interface is actually better than the iPod. I'm guessing that in two or three years, Microsoft will manage to improve the software sufficiently that Zune will be a serious competitor with Apple in the MP3 player category, which seems to be the whole point for them.

I already own an iRiver 128 and am a fan.

I also dislike apple (but not actively hate...yet)

and finally, I have .ogg files I'd like to play on my iPod but can't, and an FM tuner is something I look for in an mp3 player. I only use my iPod because it was Teh Fr33 and I can carry around my iRiver 128 for radio listening.

It terrifies me that you simply 'hate Apple', but you own a 128Mb player to listen to the radio.

MoO, I think it's funny that once MS sinks enough money into MP3 players to dominate, everyone will simply 'hate MS mp3 players' for obscure reasons that don't affect 99.9% of people. It's cool to hate the market leader, you know.

Master of Ossus wrote:All the reviews of the Zune that I've seen have slammed the software, but think that the physical interface is actually better than the iPod. I'm guessing that in two or three years, Microsoft will manage to improve the software sufficiently that Zune will be a serious competitor with Apple in the MP3 player category, which seems to be the whole point for them.

I think that falls into the category of "problems we'd like to have". The question is, if things continue this way, will the Zune even be AROUND in 2 or 3 years? I doubt MS will be willing to sell the devices at a loss for that long, though I may be wrong (does Ballmer really want a piece of the iPod market that much?).

As for the Zune being a competitor to Apple, considering the advances that Apple has made in the iPod line recently, against the amount of time and hype that was directed towards the development and launch of the Zune, you'll forgive me if I along with many others choose to take MS' claims with a few grains of salt.

Master of Ossus wrote:All the reviews of the Zune that I've seen have slammed the software, but think that the physical interface is actually better than the iPod. I'm guessing that in two or three years, Microsoft will manage to improve the software sufficiently that Zune will be a serious competitor with Apple in the MP3 player category, which seems to be the whole point for them.

That's assuming that Apple does nothing with iTunes in those 3 years.

And the flashy interface is probably why the Zune's battery life sucks. It may look nice, but animating all that shit isn't cheap, neither is video playback or wireless transfer.

So the Zune, which won't be released here for a year for no apparent reason, has already uphelp the most common stereotyping of MS. How? Just how do they pull this shit off?

I'm not a fan for so-chic-it-hurts Apple and their million and one iPods of varying quality and value, but this "iPod killer" is looking ever more the joke I was expecting, however unrealistic I thought that expectation was a few months back.

What about those Oprah Winfry audience members that got a Zune free then? They all fucked as well?