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So, pray tell. What is your opinion of Kojima-san and his MGS series?

MGS 1 was great.

MGS 2 was utter shit. SHIT SHIT SHIT -- locking you into a pre-destined path; no being able to warn the marines that uh, gee, someone just killed your entire topside crew..isn't your mission to PREVENT metal gear proliferation -- and wouldn't someone trying to grab it from the USMC count as "prolifetation"?

After that, I never played his games again.

Stealth games? Sorry, isn't that a mini-game of some sort?

MGS3 is fantastic. One of the most cinematic and well made modern console games I've seen MGS1 is a great classic. MGS2 is... let's not talk about it again?

(Shep, go play MGS3, damn you.)

Why should I? I'm not wasting my time on Kojima's games again after MGS2.

MKSheppard wrote:Why should I? I'm not wasting my time on Kojima's games again after MGS2.

MGS3 is radically different in look and feel. I was floored at first in how different the game itself was from the first two, even with knowledge of when the game itself was set. Plus, you don't need to know anything about MGS2 to play through MGS3. It's more of a prequel than a direct sequel.

Kojima started out brilliant. But then, as the MGS series went on, he... wasn't anymore.

I really liked MGS1. It remains one of my favorite games. I may have groaned at the gene parts, but I could look past that.

MGS2 was okay. The stuff that Shep mentioned bothered me too, but overall, I still had fun playing it. Although, it was disappointing that I was stuck playing as Raiden for most of the game.

Actually, one of the worst parts about playing with Raiden was dealing with his girlfriend. Because, as we all know, during a dangerous mission is the PERFECT time to talk about relationship issues! (YOU'RE ROOM WAS EMPTY JACK! JUST LIKE YOUR HEART!)

I'm still trying to figure out the ending to this day.

MGS3 was just too damn preachy. I mean, the first two were also preachy, but MGS3 took it to new levels. I still remember playing for all of five minutes before I got a "battlefield" lecture from the WWII female comando whose name I can't remember. I've tried playind it a few times now, and I've still yet to get halfway through. I just get too damn bored, and this is coming from someone was usually entertained by the Codec conversations of the previous games!

I've played bits and pieces of MGS1, but I've gotten all the way through MGS2, and, damn, that's a lot of talking to say a lot of convoluted nothing. And the cutscenes! When would they end?

Temjin wrote:Actually, one of the worst parts about playing with Raiden was dealing with his girlfriend. Because, as we all know, during a dangerous mission is the PERFECT time to talk about relationship issues! (YOU'RE ROOM WAS EMPTY JACK! JUST LIKE YOUR HEART!)

Isn't that the truth?! In fact, I believe there's at least one "relationship defining talk" that you have while there's a gunfight happening right outside.

Also, Raiden whining everything really started to get on my nerves. It only got better when you had to rescue that girl, by swimming through the watery corridor, and OH NOES!!!1!, she's TERRIFIED of water, of course. I guess they couldn't have Raiden whine too much during that part, or it would have taken away from the impact of her whines.

Played all three... I think for what they are (a very arcadey take on stealth and political intrigue) they're all pretty good.

Though, it can be rather sad that the most fun you can have in a game that's supposed to award stealth & not killing enemies is to set up epic traps that the "AI" will wander into blindly.

Four... should at the least be interesting. Although the "commando" squad this time seems to be based around rehash and tits... They could still provide fun boss fights. (Which is where MG:S's strength tends to be.)

The story will likely be convoluted, yet strangely predictable, again. (Although, it hopefully won't be as horrible as MG:S2's... A little credence for it, as it stands at a 2/3 good rate.)

weemadando wrote:So, pray tell. What is your opinion of Kojima-san and his MGS series?

He's a good one for walking the fine line between genius and gibberish.

Metal Gear Solid had a good plot and was a fun game. A bit goofy in the way that Japanese games are but still quite good.

Metal Gear Solid 2 had Raiden, a mind screw plot, a creeping over abundance of cut scenes which all made for fun game play but a distinctly less than satisfying story.

Metal Gear Solid 3 was an excellent outing. It's easily the best of the three. It actually balances game play with plot, has a very solid if Machiavellian plot, and is not too overwrought with the cut scenes. I've got to say I was blown away by how good the game actually was. The level of Casino Royale slash James Bond homage was pretty high; thankfully it was actually executed pretty well.

MKSheppard wrote:Why should I? I'm not wasting my time on Kojima's games again after MGS2.

Because by now you can find a used copy for fifteen to twenty bucks and it's actually a good game with out the things that made SoL suck so hard?

I love his games. Playing Raiden in the second game was a bit of a setback but, eh, it was a fun game anyways.
I imagine if you have a different type of humor you won´t be able to like the games that much (i thought the relationship problems in the second part were hilarious, for example). The plots are in general the best thought out plots you can find anywhere in computer games and the twists they take work pretty well in my oppinion.

Kojima is the worst part of MGS games. While I'm not a fan of the retro-8bit gameplay (which is still terrible, even in the better MGS3) removing the Kojima bullshit from the games would only leave the sneaking and the cool robots and art design, thus only the good bits would be left.

MKSheppard wrote:Why should I? I'm not wasting my time on Kojima's games again after MGS2.

MGS3 kicks the fucking shit out of MGS2. You will not be disappointed, I assure you.

Vympel wrote:

MKSheppard wrote:Why should I? I'm not wasting my time on Kojima's games again after MGS2.

MGS3 kicks the fucking shit out of MGS2. You will not be disappointed, I assure you.

I'll be honest here, I think Snake Eater is fucking aces. I seriously, say that you enjoyed Metal Gear Solid 2. You'll laugh.

The only thing that really bugged me in Snake Eater was the medikit bullshit. I think they should have simplified things and just let the player select one set of meds to repair one type of injury. It was quite annoying to click through 3 or 4 different items just to cure on single injury.

salm wrote:The only thing that really bugged me in Snake Eater was the medikit bullshit. I think they should have simplified things and just let the player select one set of meds to repair one type of injury. It was quite annoying to click through 3 or 4 different items just to cure on single injury.

It was an interesting idea, but it could have been left out. I just wished silencers were easier to come by during the game. You're given one to start with and then I was never able to find another. The whole "silencers only last a few shots" was kinda 'meh'. Otherwise everything else was great in that the game placed much more of an emphasis on actual stealth than technological gadgets.

Meh.

MGS1 was enjoyable, if not at points too much dialogue. One backstab...that made sense, not twelve because an ultra super conspiracy organization destined to rule the world fears my super solider style.

MGS2...Raiden wasn't that bad, but they way the story went, the bizarre tries at mindfucking and the whole "No, I am not the real enemy, the real enemy is this!", just drew out an okay story to inane levels of boring. After a while, I just didn't care who killed who, just wanted the game to fucking end.

MGS3 was eh. Some okay points, but Big Boss was nothing more then Snake with a bandaged eye. Even more ridiculous boss of inane tactics and solutions and in the end, a double double double cross because Kojima seems to masturbate at the thought of non sensical plot. At this point I longed for the days of the first two, where I get backstabbed once...not ten different ways, because my character is dumber then a wood pole.

MGS1 (which I have only played through the 'Twin Snakes' Gamecube remake) was excellent and I have sat down a played through the whole thing several times, and will certainly do so again.

MGS2 was just dull. None of the characters were anywhere near as interesting as those in the first game. The story became unbearably lame towards the end too.

MGS3 is my favourite. It had a really cool setting, that was very well realised (the radio chats about 1960's pop-culture were amusing). The characters were interesting again, and they actually literally sodomised Raiden. The art style of the game is also fantastic, it seems the games colour palette was set before they even started doing the art, and they don't break the pattern once the whole way through. The Shagohod is automatic win for me because of my hovercraft fetish.

Aaron Ash wrote: MGS3 is my favourite. It had a really cool setting, that was very well realised (the radio chats about 1960's pop-culture were amusing). The characters were interesting again, and they actually literally sodomised Raiden. The art style of the game is also fantastic, it seems the games colour palette was set before they even started doing the art, and they don't break the pattern once the whole way through. The Shagohod is automatic win for me because of my hovercraft fetish.

Having Revolver Ocelot's origins sprinkled throughout the game was the best touch about the whole as far character development goes as far as I'm concerned, though the pussification of Raiden was amusing.

Temjin wrote:I'm still trying to figure out the ending to this day.

My guess? The Patriots don't actually exist. They're just a widely-believed conspiracy theory that Ocelot latched on to in order to manipulate everybody (although even so 90% of what happened in MGS2 was completely unplanned by Ocelot. He just claimed otherwise so that people would think he was more competent than he actually is.) When the GW system was trying to rebuild itself after that virus Emma made ran its course it also happened across a series of articles on the PAtriots conspiracy and based its new structure around that.

The Rose that Raiden spoke to via codec was a simulation from the start. The real Rose was never involved with the mission.

Solid Snake was actually a modified clone of Jerry Lewis, but no one will tell him because they all think it's really funny watching him think that he's descended from Big Boss.

Vympel wrote:

MKSheppard wrote:Why should I? I'm not wasting my time on Kojima's games again after MGS2.

MGS3 kicks the fucking shit out of MGS2. You will not be disappointed, I assure you.

Shep is quite adamant in not playing it because MGS2 had a "LOLZ, MINDFUCK!!1" that if you played MGS3, is readily explained. All that's left is MGS4 to complete the circle, something I'll annoyingly have to wait for as I have no intention of getting a PS3 when they're still the best part of a grand.

I actually like MGS3 better than the original; which is way too short (the playable parts, that is) and scene-heavy for my tastes. Snake Eater had just enough story to tie the actual gaming parts of the game together, and what was left was very good. If you wanted more than that, *you* could call *them* on your unbelievably-small-for-1964 radio.

Admiral Valdemar wrote: Shep is quite adamant in not playing it because MGS2 had a "LOLZ, MINDFUCK!!1" that if you played MGS3, is readily explained. All that's left is MGS4 to complete the circle, something I'll annoyingly have to wait for as I have no intention of getting a PS3 when they're still the best part of a grand.

Even after MGS3, the second game still stands out as pretentious twaddle.

Vendetta wrote:

Admiral Valdemar wrote: Shep is quite adamant in not playing it because MGS2 had a "LOLZ, MINDFUCK!!1" that if you played MGS3, is readily explained. All that's left is MGS4 to complete the circle, something I'll annoyingly have to wait for as I have no intention of getting a PS3 when they're still the best part of a grand.

Even after MGS3, the second game still stands out as pretentious twaddle.

MGS2 had far more plot twists than I liked personally. The AI crap at the end felt really cheap and tacked on. At least with MGS3's plot twists they kept it to characters that had been in the game throughout the entire thing instead of introducing some random villain at the last minute.

I first read about MGS2 in an old issue of OPM that did a cover story on it. Looked totally awesome, and the review was summarized as "You must play this game". So I got it from the "Under $20" rack at a Virgin Megastore and played it. Beat it the next day and just decided "Meh".

I came into MGS3 with fairly low expectations because the preview and review were pretty much cut-and-paste from the MGS2 hype. Ironically, I picked it up in the exact same place as I picked up the previous game. I popped it in and fell in love. Took slightly longer to beat when I got stuck on that spider guy for a bit (I kept trying to tranquilize him before going "FUCK THIS!" and spraying him with an AK), but I found it genuinely my favorite of the series. Took me a full day to beat The Boss, however. And I LOVED the motorcycle chases.

My one problem? Ocelot doing the finger thing.