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Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 05:36pm
by [R_H]
Failure Rate
Microsoft argues, though, that it warranty makes failures only a minor inconvenience

Last week, GameInformer released a survey of 5,000 gamers that claimed the Xbox 360 console had a failure rate of 54.2, and a secondary failure rate much higher than that of other consoles. The survey looked at the entire run of the Microsoft console -- so it isn't necessarily representative of Microsoft's latest less-failure-prone version of the console.

Microsoft has issued a statement about the report according to Paul Thurrott's SuperSite for Windows. Interestingly, Microsoft does not deny that the failure rate is that high. It also does not deny claims that consoles frequently take a month or more to be fixed.

Writes Microsoft:

Microsoft stands behind the Xbox 360 as a superior entertainment console with one of the best warranties in the industry. We are constantly improving the design, manufacture and performance of the console through extensive testing of potential sources of any problems. Xbox 360 is pleased to maintain the title of 'most played console' and the vast majority of Xbox 360 customers have enjoyed a terrific gaming and entertainment experience since their first day, and continue to, day in and day out.

Microsoft's response boils down to two things. First, Microsoft argues that as its warranty covers many basic repairs, their console's quality problems aren't as a big an issue. Secondly, the statement references the numerous design improvements that Microsoft has rolled out since the console's introduction, including the Falcon platform, which included a 65 nm die shrink for the CPU, greatly reducing failure rates.

Fans of the Xbox 360 point to Microsoft's lower price than rival Sony as a key selling point. They also point out that the console's online network leads the industry and that the console boasts the highest attach rate (number of games bought per console) of the next generation consoles.

Detractors, however, point to the high failure rate and cases like one user who had eleven consoles fail on him. Thanks to their vocal criticism, the phrase RROD ("red ring of death") has entered gamers' colloquial vocabulary (when the Xbox 360 fails, three red LEDs light up, illuminating the ring-shaped power indicator red, hence the RROD).

Microsoft has reportedly spent over $1B USD to repair defective consoles, since the system's launch in November of 2005.
:shock: Incredible. IMO, Xbox Live Gold membership just increases the inconvenience (you've paid for access, even though you can't play).

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 05:53pm
by Stark
This is really no shit. They had terrible hardware problems due to design errors for years, and second consoles were heavily re-furbs (with the same design flaws). It'd be far more meaningful to look at the reliability of the current hardware; everyone I know went through MANY (ie 3+, I went through 5) older 360s, but I've never heard of a Falcon-or-later version failing in the typical ways.

A survey among 'gamers' to find how many have had consoles fail is pretty hilarious. It's like that article a month or so ago where someone did a survey of 1000 forum members to PROVE guys want games more than sex. Remember that? SDN forum polls should be news too! 50% OF B5 FANS PREFER ANAL! :lol:

It's amusing to think how much greater the 360 dominance would be without the stupid mistakes they made which led to reliability issues.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 06:13pm
by The Vortex Empire
I must be lucky, because I've had my 360 since Christmas 2006, and it hasn't had any problems except for a disc tray that occasionally gets stuck for a few seconds.

This poll would be more accurate if it only measured current generation 360s, with the new hardware. Polls are meaningless.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 06:40pm
by CaiusWickersham
I've had mine for almost a year now and I've only had one problem when the power cord came loose. Easily fixed & hasn't happened again.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 07:06pm
by DaveJB
Stark wrote:This is really no shit. They had terrible hardware problems due to design errors for years, and second consoles were heavily re-furbs (with the same design flaws). It'd be far more meaningful to look at the reliability of the current hardware; everyone I know went through MANY (ie 3+, I went through 5) older 360s, but I've never heard of a Falcon-or-later version failing in the typical ways.
The failure rate for the Falcon design was about 10% at the start of last year. (Source) Assuming that still holds true, and they haven't started dying en masse since then, that gives it about the same failure rate as the PS3.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 07:27pm
by Stark
Lol. If only they hadn't totally fucked up the design in the first place?

STAND IT ON IT'S PRIMARY COOLING VENT KIDS!

Ironically, one of my mates was on his third old 360 when it died the day after 3 years wore off... so he just bought an arcade + 120gb drive (for $30 less than a pro). Now he's got a revised, non-broken one, and he figures in previous generations he would have bought a new console by now anyway.

I mean the alternative is buying a PS3 and playing the no games? :)

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 07:52pm
by Vympel
I mean the alternative is buying a PS3 and playing the no games?
Err- besides Halo and GoW, what (decent) games are on X360 that aren't on PS3?

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 07:54pm
by Stark
Besides nothing (arguably Infamous) what good games are on PS3 that aren't on 360? LOL

At least you guys have achievements now. :)

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 07:55pm
by Losonti Tokash
[R_H] wrote: :shock: Incredible. IMO, Xbox Live Gold membership just increases the inconvenience (you've paid for access, even though you can't play).
When I got mine back, they gave me a card with a free month of Live and another one for 800 points?

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 07:59pm
by Stark
Yeah, but that's a policy - you don't get more if it takes longer, AFAIK.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 08:02pm
by Losonti Tokash
I guess. I've never had it take more than 2 weeks.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 11:07pm
by Vympel
Stark wrote:Besides nothing (arguably Infamous) what good games are on PS3 that aren't on 360? LOL
Well despite the fact you don't think any games are any good, I'm going to say Gran Turismo, MGS4, Killzone 2 and Little Big Planet, for starters.

So you're wrong. :P

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 11:48pm
by Losonti Tokash
Ah, Gran Turismo. Like Forza, only not as fun.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 11:49pm
by Stofsk
Not to burst your bubble, but you seem to like Mass Effect a huge lot, and guess what platform it came out on originally...

EDIT: I was talking to Vympel, damn instaposting!

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 11:49pm
by neoolong
Don't forget Uncharted.

I guess it's a testment to the strength of the system though, that even with such a failure rate, it's still doing pretty well. Imagine if other products had that kinda failure rate.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-25 11:49pm
by Starglider
Stark wrote:It's amusing to think how much greater the 360 dominance would be without the stupid mistakes they made which led to reliability issues.
Well yeah, I guess, but if you're going to play that game with Microsoft, you might as well ask how well Sony would have done if that hadn't actively pissed off most of their fans and developers, loaded the console down with pointless crap that raised the price and made it harder to develop for, and initially treated it more as a weapon in Blu-Ray vs HD-DVD than as a games machine. Sad to say, only Nintendo got everything right; the glaring deficiences of their hardware were carefully judged not to matter to casual gamers, and to translate into production savings that enabled massive profits.
Vympel wrote:I'm going to say Gran Turismo, MGS4
You mean Gran Turismo Teaser Edition Because We Still Can't Be Bothered To Release GT5 And You Chumps Keep Lapping Up Our Half-Finished Betas, and Endless Cutscene Hell 4? :)

I did enjoy my brief go on LBP, but if I could pick one PS3 game to be ported to the 360 I'd pick Flower. Though it would actually be better with a Wii controller. :)

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-26 12:08am
by Stark
Vympel wrote: Well despite the fact you don't think any games are any good, I'm going to say Gran Turismo, MGS4, Killzone 2 and Little Big Planet, for starters.

So you're wrong. :P
Hey I liked Viva Pinata buddy! :P

It's kinda funny that 360 was rushed to market to get there first (which paid off) but at the cost of terrible design flaws and a huge warranty bill... but the PS3 is a Sony 'we never learn' overengineered super-expensive waste when there isn't enough to choose between the two. If PS3 had really been dramatically technicalyl superior to 360 it might have been different but that might have just led to heaps of really disappointing ports to PS3 and it's a nightmare to port to already.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-26 12:24am
by Vympel
Stofsk wrote:Not to burst your bubble, but you seem to like Mass Effect a huge lot, and guess what platform it came out on originally...
But it did come out on PC, so it doesn't count anymore. :)

And luckily ME2 is coming out on PC simultaneously with the X360 release.
Stark wrote:It's kinda funny that 360 was rushed to market to get there first (which paid off) but at the cost of terrible design flaws and a huge warranty bill... but the PS3 is a Sony 'we never learn' overengineered super-expensive waste when there isn't enough to choose between the two. If PS3 had really been dramatically technicalyl superior to 360 it might have been different but that might have just led to heaps of really disappointing ports to PS3 and it's a nightmare to port to already.
Yeah, they fucked up. Maybe they'll build some momentum now with the Slim-PS3.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-26 05:06am
by [R_H]
Losonti Tokash wrote:
[R_H] wrote: :shock: Incredible. IMO, Xbox Live Gold membership just increases the inconvenience (you've paid for access, even though you can't play).
When I got mine back, they gave me a card with a free month of Live and another one for 800 points?
Ah, my mistake.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-26 11:53am
by TheMuffinKing
Bah, all you folks are jealous because Killzone2 offers the pinnacle gaming experience! The PS3 allow Kz2 to dickslap you with its superior, issue free multiplayer experience, while simultaneously immersing you in the most well written single player experience since Mario Brothers! Gears of War? More like Gears of Crap! Halo? FailO! Mass Effect? More like ASS EFFECT!

Glorious Leader says the PS3 has %100 reliability rate, ignore any yellow lights and all detractors are sent to the work camps!

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-26 02:31pm
by Vendetta
Stark wrote:Besides nothing (arguably Infamous)
Which is indistinguishable from Prototype anyway...

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-26 02:45pm
by Vain
I have both a PS3 and a 360, both of which I bought a couple of months after launch. They've both failed and been repaired under warranty, once each. I own a lot more games for the 360, though, and play it a lot more. In fact, I play games with my old PS2 (solid as a rock) more than the PS3. In hindsight, I probably shouldn't have bought it at all.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-26 03:05pm
by General Zod
Vendetta wrote:
Stark wrote:Besides nothing (arguably Infamous)
Which is indistinguishable from Prototype anyway...
Besides the slower combat and clunkier controls?

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-27 05:42pm
by Stargate Nerd
The hardware reliability issues are really what kept me from getting a 360 along with the notable games also being on PC or coming later on.

It's nothing short of amazing how many major issues the 360 had over the years. From the RROD epidemic, to the disk eating/scratching drives and finally the more recent e74 disaster. It really makes the PS2 look like a modern marvel of quality manufacturing. A 3 year extended warranty in no way makes up for that.

Re: Microsoft Doesn't Deny Xbox 360 Has 54.2 Percent Lifetime...

Posted: 2009-08-27 05:57pm
by Stark
At yet it's never really been challenged by the PS3. These days, decent BR players are even so cheap it's hardly worthwhile buying a PS3 for that (I understand the PS3 BR player was technically better than many cheap stand-alones initially). The idea that all the good games on 360 eventually came to PC is ridiculous, and the number of games that do so is likely to decrease over time.

Is Ultimate Anal 2 cross-platform? I think it's only PS3 and 360 at first. It's happening, right outside your door. Now testify!