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What's the penalty for selling unclassified video games anyway?

Isn't that shooter, like, really old?

Or is it another case of people reusing old names for some unfathomable reason, like with the new Medal Of Honor?

PeZook wrote:Isn't that shooter, like, really old?

Or is it another case of people reusing old names for some unfathomable reason, like with the new Medal Of Honor?

This is a new AvP game, they just haven't given it a number, like they didn't with the first PC one.

Can someone lay out the reason why this happens to the aussies all the time ?

From what I vaguely remember. (might be total bullshit)

Australias classification board only goes up to certain category, which does not include or define stuff that you would find in an 18 rated computer game in say, the UK or US. So its not a case of the aussie guys involved being completely daft, they legally cannot certify a game like Left for Dead 2, New AVP etc, because the system doesn't have a definition legally available, i.e. 18+

So, presumably its just bureaucratic inertia that prevents an 18 rated certificate being added ?


Is this vaguely correct ?

Pretty much. There's no 18+ rating available and there won't be because the MPs in a position to change it don't see it as a problem.

Vendetta wrote:So, presumably its just bureaucratic inertia that prevents an 18 rated certificate being added ?

Bureaucratic inertia being Attorney-General Michael Atkinson in this case. Only one person needs to veto the addition of a new rating category. That person is Michael Atkinson. Every fucking time. (In my limited understanding of the whole matter)/

While it's funny to blame it on Atkinson, and it's broadly accurate, this doesn't really address theo ther problems that exist with the OFLC, like it's complete lack of internal consistency.

As an aside this game was pretty much ensured to be refused classification in Australia. Even the developers thought the decapitation animation was pretty ridiculous.

What's the penalty for selling unclassified video games anyway?

If I recall correctly, there's a pretty hefty fine involved in the selling of an unclassified game, much as there is a hefty fine for importing one. There's no penalty for possessing one, as I recall, though.

At least they refuse classification on grounds of brutality, rather than sexual content.

Ford Prefect wrote:While it's funny to blame it on Atkinson, and it's broadly accurate, this doesn't really address theo ther problems that exist with the OFLC, like it's complete lack of internal consistency.

I guess the fact that one person can stop the process is a symptom of the need for restructuring or revision of the system.

PeZook wrote:Isn't that shooter, like, really old?

Or is it another case of people reusing old names for some unfathomable reason, like with the new Medal Of Honor?

This new game is really more like Alien vs. Predator 3... having said that though, there are some fans who refuse to acknowledge the existence of the second game (can't see why, myself, I really enjoyed it at the time).

The second game was way, way better than the first one, IMHO. An actual plot? Levels that are more than straight corridors? Ability to save the game?

Oh noes! The franchise is ruined!

PeZook wrote:The second game was way, way better than the first one, IMHO. An actual plot? Levels that are more than straight corridors? Ability to save the game?

Oh noes! The franchise is ruined!

Hooray, a completely generic and poorly scripted experience with an art team that watches too much anime and and an animation team that wouldn't even be accepted on a mod team! It's like I'm not even playing a game set in the Aliens universe! Best AvP game! 10/10!

PeZook wrote:The second game was way, way better than the first one, IMHO. An actual plot? Levels that are more than straight corridors? Ability to save the game?

Oh noes! The franchise is ruined!

Levels were even more linear corridors in the second AVP. And the plot was not good enough to make up for how much the gameplay sucked in comparison. Take the predators cloak charge for example. Every few seconds you have to a lame repetitive animation where you pull out a charging devices and press shiny buttons. It was cool the first two or three times. But having to repeat it every time you have to fight got extremely irritating. AVP 1s auto charging power source was much more intuitive.

On the flip side though no more infinite spawning aliens. That is one HUGE improvement over the first. The battles against aliens are actually meaningful as every kill you make counts instead of reinforcements teleporting right into the next room....

Commander 598 wrote: Hooray, a completely generic and poorly scripted experience with an art team that watches too much anime and and an animation team that wouldn't even be accepted on a mod team! It's like I'm not even playing a game set in the Aliens universe! Best AvP game! 10/10!

Huh? You may not like the art or animations, but all these elements were even crappier in the first game. And I have to wonder: how does a genuine game set in the Aliens universe feel like?

And technically, yeah, it was the best AvP game so far, because the first installment was such a steaming pile of shit. It wasn't a very

Sarevok wrote: Levels were even more linear corridors in the second AVP.

They were pretty linear, but it also had open spaces and sometimes you could even take an alternate route

Sarevok wrote:And the plot was not good enough to make up for how much the gameplay sucked in comparison.

It was a rather generic Aliens plot, with stupid humans getting themselves murdered en masse due to their own massive dumbassness, but at least you had a sense of a goal, rather than AvP1's "move forward through random disjointed levels". For me at least, the first game felt like an acid trip.

Sarevok wrote:Take the predators cloak charge for example. Every few seconds you have to a lame repetitive animation where you pull out a charging devices and press shiny buttons. It was cool the first two or three times. But having to repeat it every time you have to fight got extremely irritating. AVP 1s auto charging power source was much more intuitive.

Yeah, the "charging device" was a horrible, horrible design choice. So were most other stuff, like hacking equipment, which was pretty much a nicely dressed button to press, and thus completely unnecessary.

My jab was directed more at the fanboys who thought AvP1 was the best Aliens game ever despite its massive, glaring flaws. Did you know not being able to save is an integral part of the Aliens experience?

They were pretty linear, but it also had open spaces and sometimes you could even take an alternate route

The outdoor sequences did convey the feeling of a barren desolate alien world. I played as predator first and the crappy graphics and weird alien landscape felt surreal and yet believable especially as I cycled through vision modes. I would have loved more levels like the first two. Its the claustrophobic indoor levels when AVP 2 is at it's worst.

It was a rather generic Aliens plot, with stupid humans getting themselves murdered en masse due to their own massive dumbassness, but at least you had a sense of a goal, rather than AvP1's "move forward through random disjointed levels". For me at least, the first game felt like an acid trip.

Personally both games felt like that for me. I primarily used the predator and I think it contributed towards the "pretend you are an extraterrestial hunter" experience.

My jab was directed more at the fanboys who thought AvP1 was the best Aliens game ever despite its massive, glaring flaws. Did you know not being able to save is an integral part of the Aliens experience?

In my opinion biggest problem with AVP 1 was poor level design. They could have done a lot more with the three races and unique arsenal of weapons. Yet the game was just designed to be a difficult shooting gallery instead of exploring, stalking, combating etc experience.

For me, where AvP2 really distinguished itself over the first game was the atmosphere it had - it was the first game that I remember feeling genuinely scared by when playing. AvP1 made a pretty valiant effort in that department (and was a decent game overall, actually), but didn't quite pull it off, IMO.

Of course, the Alien was absurdly overpowered in AvP2 (it might have been in the first game as well, I can't really remember), but then again the whole idea behind playing the Alien campaign is to slaughter everything en masse anyway.

PeZook wrote:

Commander 598 wrote: Hooray, a completely generic and poorly scripted experience with an art team that watches too much anime and and an animation team that wouldn't even be accepted on a mod team! It's like I'm not even playing a game set in the Aliens universe! Best AvP game! 10/10!

Huh? You may not like the art or animations, but all these elements were even crappier in the first game.

The animations in 2 were AWFUL. Everything looks so robotic in movement, and the worst part is: IT'S OBVIOUS. The art style was only an issue until someone modded in vastly better skins which made it not only look less like a cartoon but GASP, like AvP1. It literally changed the whole mood of the game.

And I have to wonder: how does a genuine game set in the Aliens universe feel like?

Drab, grungy, strobe lights, and PITCH darkness illuminated only by a very bright light at the far end of the hallway? Like the movies basically.

Of course, the Alien was absurdly overpowered in AvP2 (it might have been in the first game as well, I can't really remember)

Yeah, it was overpowered. You could dismember a whole group of humans in an instant. Of course, you were also insanely fragile as well, dashing around a corner fight in front of a sentry gun or Marine with a smart gun was a quick death and the former was a bit frightening if you weren't expecting it and your speakers were turned up.

If nothing else, the developers' response to the refusal is kind of funny.

In a statement released this morning by Rebellion's Jason Kingsley, concerning the Australian Classification Board's so-called "ban" of Rebellion's Aliens vs. Predator game, the CEO expressed his studio's disappointment with the board's ruling, but added, "as we understand the law in that country the authorities had no choice as we agree strongly that our game is not suitable for game players who are not adults."

The subtle swipe at the Australian ratings system, which tops out at an MA15+ classification, turned into a full-on blow as Kingsley concluded, "We will not be releasing a sanitized or cut down version for territories where adults are not considered by their governments to be able to make their own entertainment choices."

It's a good response. The game's adult content - that's all there is to it.

I still don't get what's the excuse to not have an Adults Only classification in Australia.

I also don't get the fines. Aren't ratings kind of an aid to customers in the rest of the world? How come down there they have legal status?


As for AVP2, I agree with its many flaws, but you have to admit that the first human level is pure awesome, building tension and scaring the shit out of you without ever throwing an Alien in your direction. Same with the first Alien (Facehugger) and Predator level, they make you feel as the character you're portraying (Having the Predator jump from treetop to treetop was missing from the previous game).
It unfortunately goes downhill as the game progresses, only the human campaign keeps decent towards the end, and that's because most of the job is done by the natural fear of being overrun by Aliens.

LordOskuro wrote:I still don't get what's the excuse to not have an Adults Only classification in Australia.

I also don't get the fines. Aren't ratings kind of an aid to customers in the rest of the world? How come down there they have legal status?

Because the Attorney General of one state doesn't like adult content. It's not actually a personal thing against video games though: he says that if he had his way, there'd be no R18+ rating for movies either, so at least it is somewhat consistent. He is also highly unpopular with everyone except the Premier, who's the only one with the authority to remove him. Unfortunately, the Premier is very popular and is a former publicity dude, so he knows how to milk the media, and the opposition party is a bunch of morons who couldn't find their arse if it was on fire.