Robotech Boardgame KS (the Cash Value of Nostalgia)

[Bob the Gunslinger]

There is a Kickstarter for a new Robotech board game/tabletop game. It looks like 80's nostalgia is pushing up beyond $1 million. The miniatures are also mostly in scale with Battletech and Epic. Mostly.

Here is the boxed set:


And here is the sweet-spot pledge level for OCD types like me:

[Stark]

Its a bit sad it looks mechanically like an 80s game too, and not a sophisticated modern game. Sort of a missed opportunity to do something actually good.

I know, I know, criticising a Kickstarter for selling on flash and not content is like kicking babies.

[Bob the Gunslinger]

Its a bit sad it looks mechanically like an 80s game too, and not a sophisticated modern game. Sort of a missed opportunity to do something actually good.

I know, I know, criticising a Kickstarter for selling on flash and not content is like kicking babies.

I understand the rules they demonstrated at Adepticon were streamlined and fun. Then Palladium Games demanded they make some changes...

Honestly, I never pay any attention to the rules discussion on a miniatures-related Kickstarter. There are so many free wargame rules for every scale available online that it won't cost me anything to find a set just right for me, whereas finding exciting models is more of a challenge. If the board game rules turn out to be decent, that's just a bonus.

Of course, I go into every miniature KS expecting two things: a 50% drop in quality from what is shown and a delay of 6 months or more. If the project still seems like something I want to support, then I feel they've got a product worth gambling on backing.

[Stark]

That's probably a good way to look at it; the miniatures are likely to be fine (assuming they deliver) regardless of the game, and they're a common scale.

If those guys aren't articulated though it'll kind of make me laugh. :V

Regarding board and minature kickstarters, I've always been pleased by how many there are (given that they don't actually require a huge investment, can be interesting, don't take three years like shit PC games etc). Do the physical components come out as poor quality? I understand many projects have used renders or higher-quality prototypes in their KS pages,

[Vendetta]

If those guys aren't articulated though it'll kind of make me laugh. :V

If they're in scale with Battletech they almost certainly won't be, because it's 6mm scale, so its robits are only a couple of centimetres tall. Trying to make something in that scale with significant articulation will just mean it will break. You'll get to choose how to stick the arms on, and if you're good at conversions you might be able to do something depending on what plastic they use.

[Stark]

Dude, I have 3-4cm gashapon that have actual joints. Cost two whole dollars, and thus actually cheaper than space marines. :V

It looks like they're legs + torso minis, though.

Given the KS marketing (ie lies) how likely is it in this scale that the detail will be like the renders? Like the gun barrels on the Defender; are they likely to actually be two distinct barrels?

[Ford Prefect]

This is like looking at zombies shambling into each other.

[Bob the Gunslinger]

That's probably a good way to look at it; the miniatures are likely to be fine (assuming they deliver) regardless of the game, and they're a common scale.

If those guys aren't articulated though it'll kind of make me laugh. :V

Regarding board and minature kickstarters, I've always been pleased by how many there are (given that they don't actually require a huge investment, can be interesting, don't take three years like shit PC games etc). Do the physical components come out as poor quality? I understand many projects have used renders or higher-quality prototypes in their KS pages,

It really depends on the Kickstarter in question. Renders generally result in more satisfying miniatures than projects sold on just the concept art and design sketches.

For example, the Sedition Wars Kickstarter performed extremely well because it was sold on the reputation of Studio McVey for quality miniatures. They had pics up of resin masters for most of the models, with concept art for the stretch goals. Unfortunately, they decided to have the manufacturing done by the same company that does the restics for Privateer Press, which means that most of the models are slightly warped, have some mold line issues, and for some models have softer detail than one would expect. Between that and the delays, the Kickstarter has really damaged Studio McVey's reputation. I personally don't feel ripped off or let down, though, because I was expecting restics to have some issues (as they always do).

The Dreamforge Games kickstarter used renders to demonstrate what the final product would look like, and the actual end result is fantastic. I really can't wait to buy more of their products.

Mantic just pulled the unconventional move of admitting they ditched the concept art they used to sell their stretch goal concepts during the Kickstarter and had the sculptors work from new, undisclosed concept art. You can imagine how this went down.
On the other hand, in their other Kickstarter, Mantic used renders for some concepts and followed the concept art on the rest, and everyone was pleased...until Mantic apparently sent the job to a certain restics manufacturer. Oops.

Generally, Kickstartered miniatures turn out decent, but not great. Every now and then there is a surprise, though.


As for articulation, it seems to be irrelevant to the majority of the market. Many of the players I know locally glue the articulated bits of their tanks, robits and flyers still, such as doors and turrets. They say it increases durability or makes them easier to transport or something. Personally, I love turrets that turn but find too much articulation to be annoying. I grew up with static models, I guess.

Ford, I don't understand your comment.

[Stark]

I only asked about articulation because they're renders and I was too lazy to look up the scale. :V I remember the old Btech minis, and I guess thats the sort of thing they're going for here. Next time I go to Taiwan I'll pump $20 into a gashapon machine and take a picture of what comes out. :V

Do you know much about it? I see it says 90 page rulebook; that seems pretty excessive for a miniatures boardgame. How involved is Palladium?

[Bob the Gunslinger]

I really don't know much about the rules. I tried playing some Palladium RPGs, including Robotech, a couple of decades ago and they were just terrible. Palladium does not produce good rules at all. However, some of the chatter I've read on the miniatures forums makes it sound like Ninja Division are mostly doing things their way, when they can. Paladium seems to have made a lot of demands about how the close combat rules work and how certain models are uh, protrayed? in the rules. I don't know the specifics, but I bet boardgame geek has pages and pages of analysis on the rules mechanics. Ninja Division have put up some videos. Do you want me to try and find them?

I expect most of the people who care about the rules more than the models will either not pledge or just pledge for models they can already use in games they currently play, like Battletech.

The rule book is probably overly large in order to contain RPG teasers, like scenarios, background or more complex stats and tables. I would be surprised if Palladium didn't mandate some extra RPGness there.

I wish I had access here to the same cheap, well designed Japanese robit kits, but I haven't seen any that fit my scale or price range. Hopefully I'll be able to take the little one to Little Tokyo or Little Saigon soon and look into the more import-heavy shops.

[Stark]

Yeah when you mentioned that they made their proposal and Palladium had a list of requests that was a bit strange. I played that old rpg too, and it was hells bad. Being a boardgame, this will certainly be faster. I'm curious where they'll pitch it playwise though - the old rpg was very much 'near invincible VF-1s versus unlimited waves of utterly useless Regults' and I'm not sure that is what they'll do here (at least going by the stats visible and the miniatures ratio).

In a thread I made a while ago about my ignorance of plastic man technology, it almost seemed that 'model' scales and 'minature' scales were intentionally different, which makes it hard for this sort of thing. The gashapon guys I have are much too large for a hex-based wargame, for instance, although you could use them in a Flames of War sort of thing if you could get enough of the same type (or didn't care about homogeneity).

[Ford Prefect]

Ford, I don't understand your comment.

Palladium RPGs

Robotech

Have I been caught in a time warp?

[Stark]

Like the OP says dude - kickstarter. If it was a good, bankable idea, they wouldn't be here. :V

Bob, in your knowledge, is the buzz for this game mini based or game based or sort of 'wow Robotech' based?

[Bob the Gunslinger]

From what I've seen on the miniature sites, it started out with about $100,000 worth of "I looooove Robotech!", which unlocked some stretch goals and started getting the miniatures-obsessed interested. Some of the comments make it seem like there's a big set of RPGers/boardgamers who are going in for the game out of brand nostalgia ("I always wanted a Robotech boardgame/miniatures!") with a side of "I also love Battletech." The more stretch goals unlocked, the more mecha-mini fans who don't care about Robotech start to become interested. It helps that the series is available to watch on Youtube. I haven't seen anyone pledge just for the rules.

But I don't read forums that dwell on the game mechanics, so my impression is probably skewed.

[Stark]

That's a really interesting life cycle... has this been going for a while? I'll have to have a look at the KS page, but I remember hearing about something like this ages ago.

[Bob the Gunslinger]

Well, it finished with more than 1.4 million dollars. At the end, Battlecry was a very good deal for anyone who wanted fancy robits in scale with Battletech, EPIC or other popular systems.

[Kojiro]

Since I'm relatively cash strapped at the moment I made a deal with a friend. Joint ownership of the models/rules (and they live at my place) if I paint them. He told me yesterday he's spent close to $600 and I have more than 320 models to paint.

This game better be awesome.

[Bob the Gunslinger]

Ford, I think I get what you mean now.
Oddly enough, the head of Palladium just announced that he was confident that the Robotech stuff would hit the shelves early--by November at the latest! The Ninja Division guys actually making the game were ominously quiet.

Stark, if you like watching how Kickstarters unfold, check out Thon or Gates of Antares. They were real roller coaster rides that went off the rails and into the dirt. Wyrd's Through the Breach Kickstarter was even stranger--they started out with thousands of dollars pledged on day one by their hardcore fans and then did everything they could to lose money for the rest of the month. And Reaper's Bones Kickstarter was the best example of a slow burn into a fiery inferno of success--the single most successful miniatures Kickstarter ever based upon turning old metal model lines into new plastic ones.


Kojiro, I hope it is awesome, too, but if it isn't there are a lot of free mecha-based wargames people seem to love out there, so it won't be a total loss. Personally, I hope I will get to play the game with my son when he's old enough, but I fear he won't have the same interests as I do. One of the reasons I pledged for it was because I have fond memories of building models (including Robotech jets) with my dad, as well as loving the cartoon, and I hope to share those kinds of experiences with my son. The other reason is, of course, lots of cool models for not too much money (by local wargaming standards).

[madd0ct0r]

At the other end of the funding scale (but ironically, at the same 6mm scale) there is this crowdfunder: http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/6mm-s ... /x/3280652

the owner announced it casually halfway down a forum thread. Since then he's had guys sending him art, offering to make videos, anything just to make it look a bit more flashy. He seems to just be concentrating on the minis though.

[Stark]

If this was 1/285, wouldn't the figures be like, 5cm tall? They look the size of 40k mans.

[madd0ct0r]

are you talking about my post or the robotech ks?

[Bob the Gunslinger]

I've been following that indiegogo, too. I won't get anything until they split the sprues, though, since I don't like orks.

Stark, the individual figures in the indiegogo are supposed to be 6mm tall. For Robotech, the cockpits for the Veritechs should hold a 6mm man, but the Zentraedi should be roughly the size of a 28mm space marine because they are huge.

[madd0ct0r]

a 2nd mecha kickstarter may be brewing - you heard it hear first: http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/ ... 8&start=15

[Stark]

I've been following that indiegogo, too. I won't get anything until they split the sprues, though, since I don't like orks.

Stark, the individual figures in the indiegogo are supposed to be 6mm tall. For Robotech, the cockpits for the Veritechs should hold a 6mm man, but the Zentraedi should be roughly the size of a 28mm space marine because they are huge.

A VF1 standing up should be maybe 14-15 meters tall, and in 1/285 that's 4.5 centimeters (or as I call it, gashapon size :v). Maybe they're just bigger than they look.

Hey maddoctor what if nobody heard it here first? What if we knew?

[Kojiro]

If this was 1/285, wouldn't the figures be like, 5cm tall? They look the size of 40k mans.