Help with a possible new PC

[TheFeniX]

Ok, long story: I've got our old P4 Dual-core Poweredge 830 sitting in my computer room. My boss was going to throw it away, but I instead ran off with it and used it as an off-site backup for our files, but also in the event of a disaster, I could change a few DNS settings (or just give out the IP) and remote users would have access to our files. The VPN portion has been retired since we're now using some hosted backup/VPN solutions. I still use it to do a weekly "take-home" backup of all our files, but I can copy that over to any PC. There's no longer a reason I need an actual server.

I've been using it to run servers for different games, Teamspeak, print server, etc. But as said, it's getting old. Just recently the dedicated server for 7daystodie is cratering both cores something fierce. God forbid a horde or 2 comes around. I was thinking about buying another server, but that's overkill considering we don't need a warm-site anymore.

Anyways, my thinking was get me a new PC to replace my i7, give the i7 to the wife (because it's still pretty beefy), and use her little i5 Dell as a server since all I really need is a better CPU and the thing already has a fair amount of RAM in it. Sure, I'll lose a server OS, but I really don't need anything but W7.

I'm way out of the loop on building. The last PC I built was an Athlon64 3000+ overclocked to the melting point. My current PC is an ASUS pre-built I've made a few additions to. So, my first go was looking at other pre-builts. I've come across two as I'm a huge ASUS whore:
Windows 8 with more RAM
Windows 7 with less RAM

Now, the GT740 is garbage, which doesn't matter as I'll be yanking my GTX660 and 2 SSDs and using those, and give my wife the 740. But there's a few concerns I had with my current ASUS. The original PSU was pretty cheap and had to be replaced and the mainboard wasn't exactly high-end, but it's done the job very well over the past 5 years. I'm just not crazy about building from scratch again, and don't mind paying a bit of a premium provided I'm getting at least quality parts.

The i7 is basically overkill, but i5 pre-builds get shorted in other areas. Does anyone see any problems with either of these PCs? Are they too marked up to consider over building my own? I just... damn I don't want to build another PC. Not just for the labor required, but also making sure I don't screw myself, being so far behind on what's what.

[rapidsquirrel]

I'm not sure the 8GB of extra ram justifies the Windows 8 one, but I'm not a huge fan of Windows 8..... Actually I should clarify, I've never used a windows 8 machine. I'm not a huge fan of the Windows 2012 GUI, which is the same as Windows 8.

Unless you run things that are very memory intensive, you are probably better off saving a bit of money and going with the Windows 7 one. If you are running things that are very memory intensive, you are probably better off getting the windows 7 one and using the money you saved to buy more RAM.

Otherwise, I see no issue with being an ASUS whore. They tend to make quality components.

[TheFeniX]

I've read W8 has a very minor performance increase over W7 for gaming and the compatibility is about the same. Going to hit up Fry's this Friday and see what they've got for boxed sets. I would prefer to stick with W7, but you never know what they've got laying around.

[Arthur_Tuxedo]

Windows 8 "problems" are a complete non-issue. Even if you detest the Metro interface (and who doesn't?), it takes 5 minutes to download and install ClassicShell and you'll never see it again. Most overblown tech gripe of the decade.

[The Vortex Empire]

Windows 8 "problems" are a complete non-issue. Even if you detest the Metro interface (and who doesn't?), it takes 5 minutes to download and install ClassicShell and you'll never see it again. Most overblown tech gripe of the decade.

I can back that up, just got Windows 8.1 myself and was a bit concerned about it, but with ClassicShell it's literally just a better Windows 7 that uses a bit less system resources.

[TheFeniX]

Windows 8 "problems" are a complete non-issue. Even if you detest the Metro interface (and who doesn't?), it takes 5 minutes to download and install ClassicShell and you'll never see it again. Most overblown tech gripe of the decade.

I've read about that and had plans to install it on my laptop to test, but I actually like portions of the metro interface when I have a touch-screen, so I just made some changes to the W8 desktop and it works just fine.

Fry's had an ASUS W8, 12gigs of RAM, with integrated graphics for a good price, but I can't find it on the website today. My only worry is that it may not have enough power connectors (or power in general) for my 660. However, I've got an Enermax PSU I can pull out of my current PC, so that shouldn't be an issue.

I've been looking into more i5s, but those I can find are in the 3.4Ghz range and aren't really any cheaper than the i7s being offered. The i7 I'm looking at is 4.0Ghz boosted, and even though it's massive overkill: having that extra clock on the 1-2 cores games will actually use will probably extend the life of the system by more than a few years. For instance, FFXIV will top out 2 cores (leaving the others for Windows to do whatever with) on my current 2.6Ghz i7. I figure an extra 1Ghz should solved any problems of that nature for the foreseeable future.

I'd rather cough that up now.

[Jub]

Windows 8 "problems" are a complete non-issue. Even if you detest the Metro interface (and who doesn't?), it takes 5 minutes to download and install ClassicShell and you'll never see it again. Most overblown tech gripe of the decade.

I work tech support and it's really not some minor issue for me. The average joe hasn't installed ClassicShell, has no idea what a hot corner is, and couldn't find what passes for a control panel in that heap with both hands and a map. With any other version of windows I can just say start menu, control panel, and then have them look for the correct option.

[Edi]

Windows 8 "problems" are a complete non-issue. Even if you detest the Metro interface (and who doesn't?), it takes 5 minutes to download and install ClassicShell and you'll never see it again. Most overblown tech gripe of the decade.

I work tech support and it's really not some minor issue for me. The average joe hasn't installed ClassicShell, has no idea what a hot corner is, and couldn't find what passes for a control panel in that heap with both hands and a map. With any other version of windows I can just say start menu, control panel, and then have them look for the correct option.

This.

Fortunately, Windows 10 reverses some of the bullshit that was Windows 8/8.1 interface and should probably appear sometime next year. It keeps some of the features, but rolls back quite a few back to a more recognizable form.

[TheFeniX]

Fry's was a wash. Didn't have much of anything in stock rather than a $1500 ASUS with a GTX 770. Moot point because I couldn't get anyone to help me either way. I may wait for a black friday sale or just order something off newegg. At this point, I may just got old school and part something out.

Two things: Are stock Intel coolers that shitty or is that just people being dumb? I ran watercooling for several years, so my whole bit was "water block fits = buy." And I need a motherboard and case with room to expand. If ASUS makes it: it's what I want. I need to dig around Directron's site in the next few days or so.

[Jub]

I can't help much with which parts to get, but I'd go with building from scratch if you feel comfortable doing it. You might wait a bit longer for the bits to arrive versus buying one at a Black Friday sale, but you can usually snag better prices (that is assuming the online retailers you favor also have black Friday sales) and, YMMV, I find building a PC can be fun and rewarding.

[TheFeniX]

I was building my own rigs since I was around 15. Would have been earlier, since I modded the Packard Bells my parents handed down to me (yea, Packard Bell...) but they weren't blowing their own money on a bunch of parts, so I had to score my own by helping dad at work during the summer. I built my first Intel 440BX system by laying miles of PVC pipe for an air injection system at a remediation site.

I used to be one of those "overclock it till it explodes" crazies back in around 2000. I wasn't crazy enough to deal with stand-alone watercooling, but I was onboard when Koolance released their integrated system. I had that thing so streamlined it would still pull 50-60FPS, with moderate drops, on Bioshock and Team Fortress 2 on a Athlon64 3000+ and an AGP 8x slot when PCI-E was everything. Still have it sitting around at the office. I think my co-worker would have thrown it out by now, but I don't think she can lift it.

I just couldn't bring myself to break it down and do another complete hardware swap. I had just beaten so many builds (for me and friends) with a hammer for so long, I was over it. That and the 360 was out and all my other friends were getting in on the action.

It might be about time. Directron is having a black friday sale: flat 10% off your order. I always liked them because they were local. You could go in and say "this part is DOA" and they walk to the back and get you another. Hell, sometimes if that isn't in stock, they'll get you something a bit better for no charge. That's been years ago though.

My current rig is just fine and I could pop the 7 days to die server on two of my off cores and see what happens. Push comes to shove, my laptop has an i7.

[TheFeniX]

So, ASUS just didn't have jack. Most of their pre-builts had low-end boards or not enough RAM, or storage, etc. I stumbled across an iBuypower build on newegg during the black Friday sale. I didn't know much about them, but an old gaming buddy said he had one and they weren't terrible, but they weren't the best. Reviews were back and forth but the primary complaint was the mark-up vs building your own (which is always an issue).

I parted it out and ended up around $1150, not including the case and it's weird proprietary water-cooling system for the CPU. At $1600, the thing was a complete rip, but at $1300 I only took it in the shorts a fair amount, which I'm ok with.

The big thing was the 120GB SSD (AHCI enabled from the factory, thank God) so I didn't have to fuck with anything. Windows 8.1 with classicshell is stupid fast on boot and everything else. FFXIV has gone from struggling to maintain 60FPS, to pulling ~134FPS when not vsynced.

There's a couple of points. It's a low end PSU, but the weight isn't bad considering what it is. Honestly, it's well above the stock PSU that came with my ASUS pre-built. The SSD it came with has to be the cheapest feeling thing I've laid hands on. Seriously, it's like if someone made a "SSD for Kids" toy at Wal-Mart. I parted it out at $40 and feel generous doing so. Works fine though. The case isn't the highest quality I've run across, but it has loads of room for expansion and is solid enough.

My main concern is the board, but it's a mid-range full-sized ATX that I haven't found anything negative about, so I'm hoping it's good for the long-haul because I don't want to open that bag of cats. If the PSU ends up being garbage... well, I've been there before and that's an easy (if not annoying) fix.

All-in-all, I don't feel that ripped off, at least not anymore than I should for buying way more fucking hardware than I'll need in the next 5 years. I pulled my 240 SSD out of my old box after moving my Steam games back over to it's HDD, and everything is running smoothly. Haven't messed with the overclock yet, doubt I will as 4Ghz is way more than I'll ever need. I'm hoping to not have to touch this thing for a long time, when and if I do: I decided to bite the bullet and I'll be building my own again. It's about time. The one "upgrade" I may make is quality SSDs are dropping in price every day and my 240GBs is going fast. In a few months I'll look into getting the biggest SSD I can find for as cheap as I can.

I think it's about time to look into >1080p monitors. The whole 4k thing is out of hand right now. But what about 1440p? I've been looking around and stumbling across stuff like this ASUS. It's high on the price and TBH: I'm a bit annoyed ASUS is still bothering to put shitty speakers in their monitors AND they still have issues with dead pixels. At least the HDMI audio works. I want something at least 28" with low response times for gaming.

[TheFeniX]

This wife has been infinitely more understanding about my expenditures on PC lately since she's been blowing off a lot of steam on Xbone playing Titanfall with some buddies and yelling at the shitty controls of AssCreed: Unity.

Anyways, I bit the bullet and settled on an ASUS 28" 4K Monitor. I was apprehensive at first as there were some negative reviews about screen tearing and low refresh rate, but it turns out some people were using 1.1 displayport cables, rather than the 1.2 compatible ones. I really can't find anything negative about the monitor and it's price-point is excellent considering it's not a professional grade display and is marketed toward gaming. I have more anticipation about getting this monitor than I am about the computer since I haven't even seen anything >1080p and 1920x1080 has been around so long, I miss the days of resolution increases.

I remember the jumps from 320x240 to 640x480. Then to the "insanity" of 1024x768. Unreal Tournament looked like a completely different game. I know DR hits a lot harder, but I'm expecting something good. I think FFXIV is adding DX11 support.. today actually. And there's always the heavily modded Skyrim install to mess with. The current GPU I have barely gets touched running either at 1080p 60FPS, but I don't know what 4k will do to it. Either way, I don't mind gaming at lower resolutions.

[TheFeniX]

So 4K gaming isn't the graphical leap I saw in the late-90s, but it's still fairly impressive. At least it was when I remembered to actually get the monitor running at 60FPS. It ships from the factory with only Displayport 1.1 enabled for backwards compatibility. It looked good standing still, but was pretty blurry in motion and was choppy. FFXIV said it was running at 60FPS which, because I'm an idiot, it was because the game doesn't actually v-sync and will merely lock at 60FPS or 30FPS depending on your choice.

I finally checked my refresh-rate in Windows and saw 30Hz. I then remembered the review I read and made the changes in the monitor OSD to enable DP 1.2. The difference was substantial. While texture quality is the same, there no tearing I've noticed. Any issue with the textures, such is life in an MMO, is just as apparent at 1080p. The game just looks that much better, crisper. However, without true 4k support, the HUD is ridiculously small, even when bumped to the max of 140%. Still definitely playable, but text can be hard to read during cutscenes, for just one example. Still worth it.

At 1080p, I could pull ~130FPS in FFXIV. Trying out 1440p, I was still in the high 90s. At 4K, max everything, 34FPS. So.... yea. FFXIV isn't the most optimized game, but at least it will use your hardware. I ended up installing MSI Afterburner and I'm now pushing an extra 200Mhz out of my GPU core (which is where my bottleneck was). Temperature is stable even under numerous hours of gaming, but even that was only enough to get me up to about 50FPS. I had to mess with a few settings, such as reducing Ambient Occlusion and disabling rendering of objects outside my FoV. But now, unless it's a hunt where there's like 100 players in screen, I can keep up 60FPS pretty stable.

Anyways, Skyrim looks pretty damn good since I preloaded a lot of 4K (when available, otherwise there were 2K) textures. An odd little bug is that the default Skyrim HUD isn't 4K ready and will leave a "LEVEL UP" in the bottom right corner. My reading suggested resolution issues because the HUD is a flash applet or something (I have no idea). Anyways, Less-Intrusive HUD cleared that right up.

The big issue is that my monitor is almost a bitch to work on in 4K for things like Word and Excel. While I can increase font sizes and other things, ClassicShell does not want to make the Taskbar itself any bigger (other than just resize, which does nothing to increase the actual size). If anything, it's not hard to go down to 2560x1440 when not gaming.