is WOTC trying to rip you off?

Shrykull · Post by **Shrykull** » 2003-07-06 01:37am

I heard they are coming out with a 3.5 and eventually a 4 of D&D soon, so you'll have to buy whole new rulebooks, are they trying to make it like magic and other CCG's where you have to keep up and get the new cards when they come out, wonder if people will start pirating them online soon, actually they already do, but to a greater extent.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2003-07-06 01:39am

I love WOTC and would gladly pay for the books... They have taken my soul...

I truly am addicted to D&D it is sad...

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-07-06 01:45am

If they go to a constantly updating style, then a lot of fans will say fuck 'em. It's not like the card games, where if you don't upgrade you're screwed in a match. A group of friends could just continue on with the same D&D rules for as long as they wanted, making whatever modifications they could agree upon.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2003-07-06 01:48am

Yeah, if they do it frequently I will pirate them... but every few years will not hurt... especially if the magic system gets tweaked... Mystra decide she wants to go back to a mana based casty system etc....

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-07-06 03:25am

Hopefully, the 3.5 edition rules haven't been changed that much.

SyntaxVorlon · Post by **SyntaxVorlon** » 2003-07-06 03:37am

I stopped playing these things when no one I knew at my new school played them, save for one person, and I beat him. So, confident in my winning streak I stopped playing. And in my idiocy, I bought several decks of Star Wars cards that I never ever played a game with. I even got a Darth Vader. But I guess I ought to sell them all. I'll get a card price guide and price them all, then sell them online. If anyone wants that Darth Vader card though I may be convinced to give it to them.

TheFeniX · Post by **TheFeniX** » 2003-07-06 03:51am

WotC is evil. What more in AD&D could there be to tweak? The rules are about as good as they're going to get. The older TSR 2nd edition books had much more thrown into them than 3rd edition. It's just an easy way to milk the loyal fans.

The jump in Shadowrun from 2nd to 3rd was like "yea, we decided to revamp a bunch of rules and make them 100 times better. Now when a .50 cal handgun round hits you in the head, you die instantly. And lets make the magic realm much more in depth and give our characters more detail."

The impression I got from the AD&D jump was "Um... mages get some more stuff, and we now have more pictures that look like they were drawn by a retarded 3rd grader, and....it costs a lot more. Buy it now, or we'll send ghouls to steal your soul!"

Hendrake · Post by **Hendrake** » 2003-07-06 06:49am

They are. That's why I prefer system with only one book to buy to use effectively.

Or free systems, there are good one out there.

Joe Momma · Post by **Joe Momma** » 2003-07-06 03:00pm

I got the impression (which could easily be wrong, I admit) that D&D 3.5 changes were going to be fairly minor. Mostly incorporating updates and errata and adding some optional bits like extra rules for using tabletop miniatures to map out battles.

FWIW, one of the recent D&D releases included a blurb box about making that release compatible with 3.5, and all it had were three skills whose names had been changed and two Feats that had changes to their prereqs.

I suspect that if you've kept up with the errata sheets and you're happy with the 3rd ed system, you can give 3.5 a pass.

Either way, I tend to look at it in terms of man-hours of entertainment provided for the money. $90 will get you the three rulebooks, 4-6 DVDs or 10 books. If I got at least 12-20 hours of entertainment out of the game, then it's no more expensive than other forms of entertainment. Cheaper in my case, since I just bought the third ed books for $10 a piece as people unload in preparation for 3.5.

-- Joe Momma

consequences · Post by **consequences** » 2003-07-06 03:55pm

Hell yes they're trying to rip you off. Screw em, I still have 2nd edition games I participate in that I enjoy more than their system.

Typhonis 1 · Post by **Typhonis 1** » 2003-07-06 03:56pm

why not set the books up in ring binder format so that new rules could be added as needed?

Jadeite · Post by **Jadeite** » 2003-07-06 04:02pm

Iv seen some of the changes, PlanetAdnd.com's forums have a list of them. Gnomes favorite class has been changed from Illusionist, to Bard. WTF? There where a bunch of other changes that pissed me off, wizards and fighters sorta suck now compared to the other classes, from what I heard on it.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2003-07-06 04:26pm

that.... is frelling wierd...

TheFeniX · Post by **TheFeniX** » 2003-07-06 07:33pm

Typhonis 1 wrote:why not set the books up in ring binder format so that new rules could be added as needed?

Same reason laptops aren't modular, and 98SE was released as an OS and not a Service Pack: the company makes more money if you have to buy a completely new book/computer/OS.

lance · Post by **lance** » 2003-07-06 08:27pm

Changing the Gnomes favored class from illusionist to bard actually makes sense. It's being changed from a path of a class to an actuall class, that keeps in with the same flavor.

Damaramu · Post by **Damaramu** » 2003-07-06 09:08pm

Heh....that's why I still play 2nd Ed. Didn't see a reason to get 3rd Ed. at all.....

Kelly Antilles · Post by **Kelly Antilles** » 2003-07-06 09:30pm

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, as a long time avid gamer, WOTC can go screw themselves. First they had to go and buy TSR out and screw up everything. Now they are tring to gouge everyone worse than they already are!

Post by **weemadando** » 2003-07-07 09:44pm

Alyrium Denryle wrote:I love WOTC and would gladly pay for the books... They have taken my soul...

I truly am addicted to D&D it is sad...

You should really be shot for all of those comments... Bring back TSR and goddamnit - bring back 1st Ed!

Kelly Antilles · Post by **Kelly Antilles** » 2003-07-07 09:46pm

weemadando wrote: You should really be shot for all of those comments... Bring back TSR and goddamnit - bring back 1st Ed!

YOU GO ANDO!

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2003-07-07 09:58pm

eh*shrugs* I like 3rd edition... More mage friendly

Actually I pirate most of my books....

Archaic` · Post by **Archaic`** » 2003-07-08 12:17am

TheFeniX wrote:
Typhonis 1 wrote:why not set the books up in ring binder format so that new rules could be added as needed?
Same reason laptops aren't modular, and 98SE was released as an OS and not a Service Pack: the company makes more money if you have to buy a completely new book/computer/OS.

IIRC, weren't parts of 1st & 2nd Ed (Specifically, the Monstrous Compendium's) released in Ring Binder format?

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-07-08 12:34am

My personal feeling is that 3rd ed is superior to 2nd ed, but '3.5'? That's fucking insane.

generator_g1 · Post by **generator_g1** » 2003-07-08 01:14am

Hmm... I still remember the days where people played for ante...didnt WOTC buy out both Decipher and ICE to get the Star Wars, X-files and LOTR CCG's?

Post by **Edi** » 2003-07-08 04:30am

Kelly Antilles wrote:Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, as a long time avid gamer, WOTC can go screw themselves. First they had to go and buy TSR out and screw up everything. Now they are tring to gouge everyone worse than they already are!

WotC is a ripoff outfit, pure and simple, but if they hadn't bought T$R out, there would be no D&D of any kind anymore. TSR had fucked up everything that can be fucked up, and they had done it so well the mess was nearly unsalvageable in the first place. 1st Edition AD&D was pretty nice, and a 2nd Edition modified with a lot of stuff from the 1st (i.e. the stuff they cut out) was better.

But the game systems that I hold a lot dearer to my heart are Star Frontiers, and Dragon Quest, which TSR acquired from SPI's bankruptcy. And I'll never forgive them for killing it. Fortunately the 2nd Edition (Bantam print version), from SPI and before TSR corrupted it, is available online, if one knows where to look...

Edi

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-07-08 05:11am

HemlockGrey wrote:My personal feeling is that 3rd ed is superior to 2nd ed, but '3.5'? That's fucking insane.

I've heard that Games Workshop is considering to follow in WoTC's footsteps by publishing a "3.5" edition of Warhammer 40K....