Need help configuring routers

[Sokartawi]

OK, I admit, I'm not a network expert. Bunch of PCs, one router, fine, got that running in no time. However, I have multiple PCs upstairs too now, and can only get one cable through the floor, so I need something else upstairs. Since I had a second router lying around, I decided to use that. I got it working, but there are still some problems.

Old setup:
Wan -> Router (192.168.0.1) -> PCs (192.168.0.2 - 192.168.0.5)

New setup:
Wan -> Router 1 (192.168.0.1) -> Group 1 (192.168.0.2 - 192.168.0.5)
..................|
..................L-> Router 2 (192.168.1.1) -> Group 2 (192.168.1.2 & 1.3)

This works fine to access the internet, and after some fighting I even got my ultima online server to work on 192.168.1.2 with messing a lot with the DMZ options in both routers, however no matter what I try, there are 2 annoying problems:
1) PCs in group 1 cannot see PCs in group 2 with network neighbourhood in explorer, and vice versa
2) On 192.168.0.2 there is a webserver hosting my forum and website, however if I goto my WAN IP adress from a PC in group 2, I get the configuration screen of Router 2 instead. If I type 192.168.0.2 in my browser, I can access it, however I won't get very far of course, since all links start with the WAN IP and thus do not work.

Someone said the problem is that I let both routers give out IP adresses with DHCP, however if I turn that option off and set the PCs to use a preset IP, then nothing works, cannot even access the router.

[Crayz9000]

1) PCs in group 1 cannot see PCs in group 2 with network neighbourhood in explorer, and vice versa

That's because both groups are separated by not one, but two routers and use the same IP range. NetBT just won't work over that situation.

Possible solution: change the IP ranges to something different for each network (e.g. 192.168.0.2-5 for the first, 192.168.0.6-9 for the second). Then set up crossforwarding between the two networks.

2) On 192.168.0.2 there is a webserver hosting my forum and website, however if I goto my WAN IP adress from a PC in group 2, I get the configuration screen of Router 2 instead. If I type 192.168.0.2 in my browser, I can access it, however I won't get very far of course, since all links start with the WAN IP and thus do not work.

You're getting the configuration screen because you have not set up port forwarding in Router 2. You need to forward Port 80 of the webserver to Port 80 of the router (this could cause problems with the router configuration server, so change that to a nonstandard port like 8000 or 8080).

[Sokartawi]

If I change the IP range router 1 may hand out, I get errors, and it no longer hands out any IP unless I change it back.

Can you be more specific with your solution for problem 2? Webservers don't do portforwarding, only routers do... And what do you mean with changing ports to non-standard ones?

[Crayz9000]

If I change the IP range router 1 may hand out, I get errors, and it no longer hands out any IP unless I change it back.

Have you tried changing the IP range for router 2?

Can you be more specific with your solution for problem 2? Webservers don't do portforwarding, only routers do... And what do you mean with changing ports to non-standard ones?

I mean that in router 2's configuration, you set it up to forward all requests to port 80 to the web server. At the same time, you will have to change its internal server port to something other than 80, since port 80 will be pointing to your webserver.

[Sokartawi]

If I change the IP range router 1 may hand out, I get errors, and it no longer hands out any IP unless I change it back.

Have you tried changing the IP range for router 2?

No, but the moment I did it for router 1 it screws up everything and both groups lose 'net access. And it wouldn't be wise to leave the possibility open that router 1 can hand out IP adresses that router 2 already uses.

Can you be more specific with your solution for problem 2? Webservers don't do portforwarding, only routers do... And what do you mean with changing ports to non-standard ones?

I mean that in router 2's configuration, you set it up to forward all requests to port 80 to the web server. At the same time, you will have to change its internal server port to something other than 80, since port 80 will be pointing to your webserver.

Can't change the port the router uses.

====

Came up with my own creative non-solution...
Plugged a second network card in PC 1 (running on win98) of Group 2. When I start this PC, I have the cable which runs from Router 1 to Router 2 plugged into networkcard 1 (minus the extension with crosscable of course, fortunately I linked two cables together so the cable going upstairs is a straightcable). I plug the cable going from Router 2 in networkcard 2. Once PC 1 has completed starting up, I disconnect the cable from networkcard 1, and plug it back into Router 2, so group 2 has internet access. If I need to share files or access my website, I unplug Router 2, put it back into networkcard 1, wait for a minute, then go mess with whatever I want. Once done, I plug the cable back, wait another minute, and everyone has internetaccess again... Not effective at all, but it works...

Would still like another solution...

[Vohu Manah]

Why not just setup a switch upstairs (as opposed to the router)?

[Sokartawi]

Why not just setup a switch upstairs (as opposed to the router)?

'Cause I don't have one, and I had this... thing lying around...

But if this really won't work I'll get one, yah...

[phongn]

Using a router upstairs as an ad-hoc switch will just lead to pain. Get a switch.

[Vohu Manah]

Why not just setup a switch upstairs (as opposed to the router)?

'Cause I don't have one, and I had this... thing lying around...

But if this really won't work I'll get one, yah...

Well, it might help to know the routers in question. My Linksys BEFSR81, according the manual, is able to operate in two modes, gateway and router. In gateway mode, it serves as host to my broadband connection. In router mode, it would operate as the go-between to the computers connected to it and the router serving up my connection. If one of your routers was capable of the same, it should be used as the second router in your scenario. Do you happen to know if this is the case (or could you simply provide the router model numbers so that we may check ourselves)?

[Sokartawi]

Why not just setup a switch upstairs (as opposed to the router)?

'Cause I don't have one, and I had this... thing lying around...

But if this really won't work I'll get one, yah...

Well, it might help to know the routers in question. My Linksys BEFSR81, according the manual, is able to operate in two modes, gateway and router. In gateway mode, it serves as host to my broadband connection. In router mode, it would operate as the go-between to the computers connected to it and the router serving up my connection. If one of your routers was capable of the same, it should be used as the second router in your scenario. Do you happen to know if this is the case (or could you simply provide the router model numbers so that we may check ourselves)?

Going to look for that option, but haven't seen it before.

Router 1: Sitecom DC-201
Router 2: Canyon CN-WR501

[phongn]

Windows NT-based operating systems can also act like routers. However, you'll have to brush up on how to set routing tables.

[Sokartawi]

Not going to do that as my servers run on win98 and I don't want yet another PC on 24x7 eating power and making noise.

[Seggybop]

win98... server... o_O

[Sokartawi]

I got a switch, problems solved.

win98... server... o_O

Uptime over 99% over the past year. In fact it has never been restarted, nor crashed, except when we had a powerloss a month ago, or when the router screwed up.

I'm hosting a 8GB database for the goverment, something to do with energy policies but I have no clue what exactly, and they pay me 10 Euros a month, which covers my powercosts. Of course they don't know it runs on Win98, but I was the lowest bidder

I also had an ulitma online server, has been up for 9 months or something, but I'm making new maps and contents and am modifying it for the next expansion, which is the reason it's off right now.