Computer for college: which one?

[sketerpot]

I'm going to be going to college next year to major in computer engineering. What sort of computer should I get? Laptop or desktop? Any brands to stay away from (I've had nothing but trouble with Compaq, for instance)?

Special considerations:

• I want to be able to run Linux on it, preferably double-booting with Windows. Macs are cool, but there are a lot of programs that I want to use which don't run terribly well on them, and they tend to be expensive. Price is definitely a consideration.
• I have an 80 GB hard drive containing a bunch of rather large files which I'd like to hang on to. This might be a tad inconvenient with a laptop.

[Praxis]

I'm going to be going to college next year to major in computer engineering. What sort of computer should I get? Laptop or desktop? Any brands to stay away from (I've had nothing but trouble with Compaq, for instance)?

Special considerations:

• I want to be able to run Linux on it, preferably double-booting with Windows. Macs are cool, but there are a lot of programs that I want to use which don't run terribly well on them, and they tend to be expensive. Price is definitely a consideration.
• I have an 80 GB hard drive containing a bunch of rather large files which I'd like to hang on to. This might be a tad inconvenient with a laptop.

You absolutely sure on that? If you're absolutely 100% sure, fine, but consider that:
1) You can run Linux-PPC on a Mac
2) iBooks are very well priced, and with education discount you can get a PowerBook for a lot less and add an 80 GB hard drive.
3) iMacs are great for college if you're living at the college. The tiny footprint and all, 80 GB hard drive, 64-bit.


It just seems that if you're planning on running Linux anyway, the Mac would be good.

But ah well. If you're REALLY sure you don't want a Mac, then check out iBuyPower. You can get computers without Windows if you don't need it (while most places REQUIRE you to get windows with the computer), and the pricing on the computers are excellent.

http://www.ibuypower.com

Use the AMD Athlon XP DDR configurer. Athlon XP 2500+, Geforce FX 5200 128 MB, 80 GB hard drive, 512 MB memory, 80 GB hard drive for $450-$500.

[InnocentBystander]

I've found a laptop is definatly better than a desktop for college.

As far as who to buy from, I get my PC's from a similar company - www.cyberpowerpc.com

I honestly don't know the difference between ibuypower and cyberpower, there are many similar sites, and I've no idea if they just bought the same website design, or they are all owned by the same people or whatever, but my experience has been with cyberpower.

They are essentially the same price and use the same components.

Now I know very little about macs, truth be told, but I've always felt mac hardware was, on the whole, a bit more costly than standard pc equipment. I guess it depends on whether you want to play Half-Life 2 or not

On another note, I've no idea about this "education discount", I guess you have to purchase the computer through your school (no idea if all schools do that). However, some schools do sell computers at more affordable prices, often with lots of expensive software, so you might want to look into that as well.

[phongn]

If you're majoring in computer engineering you don't really need a fast computer. A laptop will come in quite handy. If a Mac is out of the consideration, there are a few brands you should consider:

1. IBM. Pricey, but see if you can get a student discount. These are some of the best laptops on the market.
2. Toshiba. Ignore their huge "consumer" line and look at their business-oriented laptops. They are of good quality.
3. HP/Compaq. As with Toshibas, run far away from their consumer line and look at their business line (the Evo series, IIRC).

Brands to be wary of:

1. Alienware. Overpriced, over-heavy and over-ugly. They're just rebranded Sagers, after all.
2. Dell. While their Inspiron 500M is actually a decent laptop and their Latitude series (business) is alright, I've heard too many horror stories about them.
3. Sony. Average build quality but absolutely horrible customer support. If you buy one, pray that yours won't break.

As for your HD, you can buy an external enclosure for it and hook it up to a laptop that way. The only processor for laptops that you should consider is the Pentium M. It is relatively cool and uses little power -- meaning that you'll be able to tote it around and use it where you can't find a convenient plug.

[sketerpot]

I've found a laptop is definatly better than a desktop for college.

How so?

On another note, I've no idea about this "education discount", I guess you have to purchase the computer through your school (no idea if all schools do that). However, some schools do sell computers at more affordable prices, often with lots of expensive software, so you might want to look into that as well.

Thanks, I'll definitely look into that.

[Praxis]

On another note, I've no idea about this "education discount", I guess you have to purchase the computer through your school (no idea if all schools do that). However, some schools do sell computers at more affordable prices, often with lots of expensive software, so you might want to look into that as well.

I'm not sure about other companies. I know with Apple, all you have to do is tell them your name and what school you go to and buy directly from their website under the Education store, and you get the discount from them- no going through schools. Don't know about other companies though.

[2000AD]

I've chosen a desk top for the following reasons:

- My uni has plenty of computer clusters so if i need to use a computer at uni i undoubtably can, plus they've got a fast connection and access to a shitload of scientific journals and stuff online.

- It's much easier to take lecture notes on paper

- A guy can be in and out of my room with a laptop in ten seconds, you can't do that with a desktop. Same goes for carrying a laptop in a bag to uni.

- Unless you buy a mouse your stuck using that crappy pad thing on the laptop.

EDIT: Most laptops i've seen nowadays don't come with floppy disk drives, which are useful for getting small documents between uni and home, if you don't have a USB pen or simular, you don't want to waste a CD on something small and you don't have a net connection at home.

[phongn]

I've chosen a desk top for the following reasons:

- My uni has plenty of computer clusters so if i need to use a computer at uni i undoubtably can, plus they've got a fast connection and access to a shitload of scientific journals and stuff online.

Yes, but what if you want to write a report in the library? It is much easier to set up a laptop, grab your books and start typing that way.

- It's much easier to take lecture notes on paper

Absolutely. However, some professors publish their notes online (typically PDF or PowerPoint) and you can use a laptop to follow along. You can always print them out and annote, of course.

- Unless you buy a mouse your stuck using that crappy pad thing on the laptop.

IBM has the mighty TrackPoint.

EDIT: Most laptops i've seen nowadays don't come with floppy disk drives, which are useful for getting small documents between uni and home, if you don't have a USB pen or simular, you don't want to waste a CD on something small and you don't have a net connection at home.

Using floppy disks now is like playing with fire. Nobody makes them with any real quality control today. You might as well wait for a sale and grab a pen drive for cheap.

[InnocentBystander]

I've found a laptop is definatly better than a desktop for college.

How so?

Well, I take it home, I use it on the train when going home, I take it to class, I use it in class, I take it to friend's room and use it there... mobility is a wonderful thing.
On the other hand, be prepared to pay more, and if you like playing games, be prepared to replace them.

For myself, I'll be getting another one come the summer, and maybe even one more before I graduate (after that I'll have to re-evaluate the laptop as a dedicated machine). But I'm working every other semister and don't have to pay tuition, so I have that sort of luxury.

However, iF you want to play games, but know you won't have cash in the future, the desktop is definatly the way to go.

[2000AD]

Yes, but what if you want to write a report in the library? It is much easier to set up a laptop, grab your books and start typing that way.

Uni library has a (quite large) computer cluster. (Of course i can't say this about all universities, but then i'm giving my reasons for choosing a desktop.)

Absolutely. However, some professors publish their notes online (typically PDF or PowerPoint) and you can use a laptop to follow along. You can always print them out and annote, of course.

Point, but in my experience those that put notes online tend to give out a decent hand out and those that don't put them online don't give handouts (mainly the older lecturers).

IBM has the mighty TrackPoint.

Haven't seen that, is it as good as a mouse?

Using floppy disks now is like playing with fire. Nobody makes them with any real quality control today. You might as well wait for a sale and grab a pen drive for cheap.

Yup, but it would still come in handy for people like my flatmates.

Also, when i was looking laptops seemed to be more expensive than a desktop wiith simular capabilities. This might just be for the brand or store i was looking in though, how do laptops normally compare to desktops in terms of cost?

[The Cleric]

Laptop. By far, they are much much nicer to have at uni.

And I have an HP Pavilion. It had a defective graphics card when I first got it, but I called their tech support (which is awesome) and they speed-built and rushed me the same one. I had it in 3 days (ordered it Friday, got it Monday).

[phongn]

Uni library has a (quite large) computer cluster. (Of course i can't say this about all universities, but then i'm giving my reasons for choosing a desktop.)

My university has computer labs everywhere, but it is still more convenient to tote a laptop along much of the time. In addition, virtually all of the public computers are ridden with spyware.

IBM has the mighty TrackPoint.

Haven't seen that, is it as good as a mouse?

No, but it is much better than a trackpad.

Also, when i was looking laptops seemed to be more expensive than a desktop wiith simular capabilities. This might just be for the brand or store i was looking in though, how do laptops normally compare to desktops in terms of cost?

Laptops will always cost you more. It is the price of miniaturization.

[Vertigo1]

Haven't seen that, is it as good as a mouse?

Its basically an eraser in the middle of the keyboard that you move the mouse pointer around with. It will get you around word and the like, but its definitely NOT for any kind of gaming.

Since you decided to go desktop, care to give us a budget?

[Howedar]

I've been perfectly 100% fine with using a desktop. I borrowed a laptop from my dad's work for a week or two to see if it made things easier, and honestly it didn't. I prefer paper, and I don't really do homework on campus anyway.

Maybe if I was doing oodles of research papers I'd think about it, but a desktop has been fine.

[2000AD]

Since you decided to go desktop, care to give us a budget?

Well i had quite a bit due to having a part time job and not pissing all the money away.

The PC i've got now cost between £700 ($1300) and £800 ($1464) and came with (off the top of my head):

- AMD Athlon XP 2600+
- 512 MB Ram
- Nvidia Geforce 4 MMX 400
- DVD-ROM
- CD re writer
- 15" flatcreen monitor
- 5.1 Surround sound speakers (+ compatible sound card)
- Scanner
- Printer
- over £100 worth of games
- Some funky insurance deal on top of the standard warranty
(the flatscreen monitor, games, printer and scanner were an upgrade i paid about £100 for, this is included in the price at the top)

So far the only thing i'm annoyed at is the graphics card, as when i bought Deus Ex: Invisible War the guy in the shop said that if i can run Farcry (which i can) i could run that, but it turns out DE:IW doesn't support MMX.

Also one of my friend pointed out he could have bought the components and built it much cheaper, and i've no doubt he could, i just prefer trained people to put my PC togerther rather than a friend who drinks vodka instead of water.

[Vertigo1]

So far the only thing i'm annoyed at is the graphics card, as when i bought Deus Ex: Invisible War the guy in the shop said that if i can run Farcry (which i can) i could run that, but it turns out DE:IW doesn't support MMX.

Umm....MMX is a set of CPU instructions (that was introduced when the first Pentium 2 came out), not a video card. You mean MX. At any rate, the MX is the "budget" line of nVidia video cards. That card you have is basically a redressed Geforce 2.

Also one of my friend pointed out he could have bought the components and built it much cheaper, and i've no doubt he could, i just prefer trained people to put my PC togerther rather than a friend who drinks vodka instead of water.

Those trained people do it on an assembly line dude. Quite a few times they do make mistakes. Furthermore, a do-it-yourself job will definitely have better airflow. You would be suprised how big a mess you'll find if you tear apart a pre-built box. Dell is famous for horrible airflow problems. To them, one fan is all you need, and its for out-take only. HP likes to cram things as close as possible without regard for airflow or the need for room to move your hands about when servicing it. Compaq is in the same boat with Dell....only you're lucky if they give you a fan. The only pre-built system I've seen with any forethought put into it is by IBM. The last machine I worked on was obviously worked on by an actual engineer because the wiring was tucked away nicely, no ribbon cable obstructed any source of airflow, and when it came to servicing it was like working on a system I built myself. Everything was easy to get to, and I never had to fumble around with my hands just to hold something up or remove it.

Now, here's a parts list I've drawn up for you that would easily work as a college rig and a killer gaming rig at the same time.

Case: Foxconn TH202 CaseEdge (Blue & Black) - $59 (comes in Red&Black, Blue&Black, and Green&Black)
Motherboard: Asus A7N8X-E - $87
CPU: AMD Athlon XP 3000+ (400MHz FSB, Barton core) OEM - $135
Heatsink: Thermaltake Volcano 12 - $31.99
RAM: 2x 256MB PC3200 Corsair Value Select DDR - $88
Hard Drive: Maxtor 160GB HDD, ATA133 IDE - $88.50
Video: Leadtek GF 6600GT 128MB GDDR3 - $195
CD/DVD: Lite-On 16X Double Layer DVD-RW - $78
Operating System: Windows XP w/SP2 Upgrade Academic - $82 (normally twice this price w/o academic discount)

That brings up the total to a whopping $649.29 USD. Add about $170 or so for a decent 19" CRT monitor and you have a complete system for well under your budget.

Now I highly recommend you get some kind of protection for your computer. Whether or not your college has decent wiring isn't an issue, but it only takes one time to turn your nice computer into an expensive doorstop. I highly recommend the APC 725VA BACK-UPS ES - $77.99

[phongn]

Dell accepts considerably higher thermal loads than most DIY builders but its actually pretty safe. They do know that they're doing. Gateway can be pretty good, too -- we have some ex-dot.bomb Gateway midtowers (P3) and the cabling was tucked away and organized.

IBM can be good, but their Aptiva home line had a well-deserved reputation for shoddiness.

[phongn]

I've been perfectly 100% fine with using a desktop. I borrowed a laptop from my dad's work for a week or two to see if it made things easier, and honestly it didn't. I prefer paper, and I don't really do homework on campus anyway.

Maybe if I was doing oodles of research papers I'd think about it, but a desktop has been fine.

I commute to campus with my siblings and can be at school for extended periods of time. Since I'm in the CS program, I find it much easier to tote around a laptop and do some programming rather than go to a public lab and open an XWindows session into one of the Sun servers.

[Vertigo1]

Dell accepts considerably higher thermal loads than most DIY builders but its actually pretty safe. They do know that they're doing.

That is until they start designing things. To my knowlege, they have yet to design a proper retention method for their boards. One good thump on the top and it falls right off. I know this for a fact because I saw it happen in-person. It didn't take alot of force either. That P4 fried itself in seconds. Still, its also fair to say that all DIY builds will all be problem free. I've been doing it long enough that I definitely know what I'm doing, but the same can't be said for others. It all depends on who's the one building it.

That being said, we could go on debating this till time ends, but we'll still have to deal with the human factor. Some get it right, some screw up royally. Its just luck of the draw.

[phongn]

Normally you don't thump a Dell box

[Praxis]

Normally you don't thump a Dell box

I believe you mean a Dull box. Or a Hell box.
Anything but a D(H)ell...

[phongn]

Do you have you anything of substance to add to the discussion, Praxis?

[Einhander Sn0m4n]

Thank you Vert; you have singlehandedly kickstarted my new shipbuilding project. Now all I need is a better source of funds...

[Tech^salvager]

Laptop, espically if you need to use a computer for your work most of the time. Also cause when you get used to certain programs they might not have at the computer labs to use that you use all the time. Like I like to use Dev-C++ over MSVC++ anytime, but when I go up to check in and they ask me if I want something certain, all i can say is C++ which gets me put on to a computer with MSVC++. Also if your lappy and the place has a wirless network you can use that which helps out alot.
Just my 2cents
Tech^

[Praxis]

Do you have you anything of substance to add to the discussion, Praxis?

Well, I'd still go with iBuyPower.com over D(H)ell any day. They've got very nice prices on their AMD systems, especially if you don't want Windows with the PC.