Half Life 2 Spoilers Thread (Warning: Spoilers. Really.)
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- InnocentBystander
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Half Life 2 Spoilers Thread (Warning: Spoilers. Really.)
Perhaps they made the artistic decision that they didn't want us to know everything that had happened because, in truth, they honestly didn't like that story-line and couldn't come up with something that they felt comfortable with? Consider Breen's Public Service Announcement just passed the train where he talks about how people cannot reproduce anymore, and all that evolution of humanity stuff. If the aliens did come to prepare the world for their own habitation, or mine it up, why not just wipe out humanity right then and there? People are already hold up in cities, just wipe them out and get minning or whatever it is they want.
Spoiler, discussion of late game info that might shed light on things.
My little theories on the storyline beyind history.
Breen tells us that our contract is open to the highest bidder, the others have no idea what he's talking about other than the idea that breen wants gordon to betray his pals and stop the revolution.
Later we hear him talking about going through the Combine portal (though it seems his body cannot survive that enviornment, and he has to take a new body or something like that to escape alive. That isn't so important (though it does improve the "xenoform earth" back history theory. What is important is that he says "I can still deliver earth"
My feeling is that there are 2 alien powers at work here, One side being the G-Man's "people" and the other being the thing breen is talking to.
Spoiler, discussion of late game info that might shed light on things.
My little theories on the storyline beyind history.
Breen tells us that our contract is open to the highest bidder, the others have no idea what he's talking about other than the idea that breen wants gordon to betray his pals and stop the revolution.
Later we hear him talking about going through the Combine portal (though it seems his body cannot survive that enviornment, and he has to take a new body or something like that to escape alive. That isn't so important (though it does improve the "xenoform earth" back history theory. What is important is that he says "I can still deliver earth"
My feeling is that there are 2 alien powers at work here, One side being the G-Man's "people" and the other being the thing breen is talking to.
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Actually... the G-Man said that you, Gordon Freeman, were up for "the highest bidder" at the end of the game... could it be that Breen was aware of this relationship between Freeman and the G-Man, and, in fact, was trying to hire him away to prevent Freeman from being drafted to do something horrible? After all, Breen, as bad as he is, feels he's doing what's best for humanity.InnocentBystander wrote: Spoiler, discussion of late game info that might shed light on things.
My little theories on the storyline beyind history.
Breen tells us that our contract is open to the highest bidder, the others have no idea what he's talking about other than the idea that breen wants gordon to betray his pals and stop the revolution.
My feeling is that there are 2 alien powers at work here, One side being the G-Man's "people" and the other being the thing breen is talking to.
As for what the Combine are, my theory is that they are a conglomorate of alien species from various universes that have become incorporated into the service of one master race, whatever Breen was talking to.
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I hate all this size 1, we really need a spoilers only thread but whatever...DPDarkPrimus wrote: As for what the Combine are, my theory is that they are a conglomorate of alien species from various universes that have become incorporated into the service of one master race, whatever Breen was talking to.
I don't think so, why do these aliens need breen "deliver" earth to them?
They already have earth (despite this uprising). I think someone, ie the alien who he talks to, wants earth, and is operating outside the Combine.
Let's say, for a moment, that G-Man works for the combine, right? He gets the idea in his head that breen is going to turn over Earth and all it's stuff to some insurgent alien. The combine obviously won't stand for that. However, rather than go through the trouble of starting a civil war or getting into legalities of proving Breen's plan or even expending the troops necessary to deal with the situation, simply put the right man in the wrong place, and let Gordon and the human resistance do all the work. Earth returns to self rule, for a time perhaps, and the combine doesn't have to get it's hands dirty dealing with internal troubles.
Just an idea...
InnocentBystander wrote:I hate all this size 1, we really need a spoilers only thread but whatever...DPDarkPrimus wrote:
As for what the Combine are, my theory is that they are a conglomorate of alien species from various universes that have become incorporated into the service of one master race, whatever Breen was talking to.
I don't think so, why do these aliens need breen "deliver" earth to them?
They already have earth (despite this uprising). I think someone, ie the alien who he talks to, wants earth, and is operating outside the Combine.
Let's say, for a moment, that G-Man works for the combine, right? He gets the idea in his head that breen is going to turn over Earth and all it's stuff to some insurgent alien. The combine obviously won't stand for that. However, rather than go through the trouble of starting a civil war or getting into legalities of proving Breen's plan or even expending the troops necessary to deal with the situation, simply put the right man in the wrong place, and let Gordon and the human resistance do all the work. Earth returns to self rule, for a time perhaps, and the combine doesn't have to get it's hands dirty dealing with internal troubles.
Just an idea...
An idea I have is that the Combine haven't fully perfected the technology to teleport between universes. I guess therefore they can't come in full force and properly conquer Earth, and instead have to erect the citadels as a sort of "beachfront". They want Breen to keep Earth and its populace in line in the meantime.
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It was said at one point that the Combine could teleport in, but local teleportation wasn't possible at that pointShinova wrote: An idea I have is that the Combine haven't fully perfected the technology to teleport between universes. I guess therefore they can't come in full force and properly conquer Earth, and instead have to erect the citadels as a sort of "beachfront". They want Breen to keep Earth and its populace in line in the meantime.
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all that means is they can easily get into our universe, but once they are here, they have to rely on local transportation (cars, planes, space ships, whatever). Which is why "local" teleporation technology is so valueable to them.Sharp-kun wrote: It was said at one point that the Combine could teleport in, but local teleportation wasn't possible at that point
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If that was the case, why didn't they start vaping the population shortly after they won? Why bother keeping garrisons and dealing with the underground and that shit, move in, get a surrender, then start bulldozing the city, it's not like the citizens have weapons to fight back with (like they do after all this time of resistance work).Shinova wrote: An idea I have is that the Combine haven't fully perfected the technology to teleport between universes. I guess therefore they can't come in full force and properly conquer Earth, and instead have to erect the citadels as a sort of "beachfront". They want Breen to keep Earth and its populace in line in the meantime.
Half Life at least had a sense of resolution in that by the end of it you got wise to what was going on. HL2 tells you sweet fuck all:
- Vortigaunts: why? Hell, they don't even fight next to you.
- City 17: what is this place? Why does it exist? Where is it?
- Dr. Wallace Breen: what deal did he make with "the Combine"?
- The Combine: what is "the Combine?". We see some freakish looking guys walking around in the last level, but that's it. What is it's purpose?
- Eli Vance/ Dr Kleiner: Why the research into teleporters?
- Dr Mossman: Why so eager to have Eli Vance participate in research for the Combine? What research was the Combine doing? Why?
- Why are there head crabs and other such pests everywhere?
- Why is the Combine Civil Protection taking people away at the start of the game?
- Why does Breen go on and on about saving humanity from extinction?
- Where the hell was Gordon Freeman before this started? Some sort of stasis?
- Just who the fuck does the G-Man work for?
Half Life 2's plot is far too vague to be satisfying.
- Vortigaunts: why? Hell, they don't even fight next to you.
- City 17: what is this place? Why does it exist? Where is it?
- Dr. Wallace Breen: what deal did he make with "the Combine"?
- The Combine: what is "the Combine?". We see some freakish looking guys walking around in the last level, but that's it. What is it's purpose?
- Eli Vance/ Dr Kleiner: Why the research into teleporters?
- Dr Mossman: Why so eager to have Eli Vance participate in research for the Combine? What research was the Combine doing? Why?
- Why are there head crabs and other such pests everywhere?
- Why is the Combine Civil Protection taking people away at the start of the game?
- Why does Breen go on and on about saving humanity from extinction?
- Where the hell was Gordon Freeman before this started? Some sort of stasis?
- Just who the fuck does the G-Man work for?
Half Life 2's plot is far too vague to be satisfying.
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We really need a spoilers thread.
For example, we know that the Vortigaunts were slaves, that have now been freed and judging by what we see in Nova Prospekt and the citidel it appears as though it's our turn.
It's very similar to the way HL1 panned out, when you get to Xen you see other scientists in HEV suits dead on the way, you see barrels of some stuff being processed. There's a lot there that isn't readily explained, it just needs to be worked out.
The death of Nihilanth freed them. I'm guessing they were more of a worker race rather then a warrior race, although I agree it would have been nice to see some of them fighting.Vympel wrote:Half Life at least had a sense of resolution in that by the end of it you got wise to what was going on. HL2 tells you sweet fuck all:
- Vortigaunts: why? Hell, they don't even fight next to you.
Somewhere in Eastern Europe, probably somewhere near the baltic. There's cyrillic writing on some of the flyers.- City 17: what is this place? Why does it exist? Where is it?
"I'll make sure humanity is useful to you as long as you don't make us all extinct...oh and I want to be their overlord with a corner office in the citidel."- Dr. Wallace Breen: what deal did he make with "the Combine"?
Alien government of sorts, the only thing we know for sure about them is that they're from another universe. Those freekish looking guys from what I can tell are humans that have been converted into slaves. Hence all the canisters of people being moved around.- The Combine: what is "the Combine?". We see some freakish looking guys walking around in the last level, but that's it. What is it's purpose?
That's what they were doing in the original Half-Life. They wanted to continue the research so they could smuggle people out of the city without having to use the railroad. I imagine teleporters would probably also be instrumental in retaking Earth.- Eli Vance/ Dr Kleiner: Why the research into teleporters?
Because he's good at it and she figures that if he takes part willingly that he'll be spared just like her and Breen.- Dr Mossman: Why so eager to have Eli Vance participate in research for the Combine? What research was the Combine doing? Why?
They would have started popping up after the Black Mesa incident. Also, the combine were using the headcrabs as bioweapons (see headcrab loaded rockets)- Why are there head crabs and other such pests everywhere?
So they can be taken to Nova Prospekt, processed, made slaves and then shipped off to the citidel.- Why is the Combine Civil Protection taking people away at the start of the game?
A mix of propaganda and to do with the deal he made. Obey the combine or they'll make us all extinct and we'll have only ourselves to blame.- Why does Breen go on and on about saving humanity from extinction?
Apparently.- Where the hell was Gordon Freeman before this started? Some sort of stasis?
An as yet unnamed entity that is known to Breen and the combine although it is unknown as to whether or not they are allied, enemy or neutral. Breen and the combine seemed to think that Gordon's contract was up for grabs, although this seems doubtful given that the G-man was responsible for Gordon's placement on the train and subsequently the events that followed.- Just who the fuck does the G-Man work for?
It's Valve's story telling style. They don't like to sit a character down and have him explain everything starting from the beginning. They present you with all the results of recent events and all the plot elements and leave it to the player to figure out.Half Life 2's plot is far too vague to be satisfying.
For example, we know that the Vortigaunts were slaves, that have now been freed and judging by what we see in Nova Prospekt and the citidel it appears as though it's our turn.
It's very similar to the way HL1 panned out, when you get to Xen you see other scientists in HEV suits dead on the way, you see barrels of some stuff being processed. There's a lot there that isn't readily explained, it just needs to be worked out.
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While berating the transhuman security forces in Nova Prospeckt over the PA system, Dr Breen mentions that Gordon Freeman "has been in a condition which precludes any training in covert skills for some time", or words to that effect. It would seem that Breen knows somehow that Freeman was kept on ice between Black Mesa and the Combine attack.
(3.13, 1.49, -1.01)
Well, at the end he referrs to Gordon's 'contract'. I'd say he knows exactly what's going on. Infact, this is probably how he found out:
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City 17 Personal ads:
- Need a highly trained Merc. for all you rebellion formenting/supressing needs?
- Someone who won't talk back?
- Is unswervingly loyal to his em-em-ployers?
- Doesn't know what the fuck's going on?
- Is an MIT graduate?
- Won't sleep on the job? Infact, noone is more deserving of a rest?
- Is damn handy with a crowbar?
Look no further! Here at G-Man enterprises we provide the one-and-only Gordon Freeman in the flesh, or rather in the Hazard suit*!
Price negotiable.
Don't call us, we'll... See you up ahead.
Live demonstration coming soon to a city near you!
Yes, you, Breen. I know you're reading this.
*Hazard suit not included
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Everyone, have a look at this most excellent analysis of the Half Life story so far: http://members.shaw.ca/storage_4/hl2story/
Great stuff there.
Great stuff there.
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Yep, it's a member of the Combine species. Here's a screenshot of it from the editor: pic
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No wonder they need a transhuman force. Those slugs probably have advanced mental powers and can communicate telepathically which explains why Breen wasn't getting any lingual responses. It could also mean that they have advanced telekinetic powers or solely rely on technology as their means of conquering. Perhaps they are able to operate vehicles, but they definitely aren't capable of outperforming humans/transhumans when it comes to infantry forces. That single picture of the Combine alien makes it much more clear why humans are so valuable to them.
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He leaves out a great deal of information obtained about Race X, G-Man, the level of knowledge that humans had about the aliens, Barney Calhoun, and other events (the nuking of BMRF, for example) from Opposing Force and Blue Shift. How could he base his assumptions on Half-Life 2 on a chronology that has two big, gaping holes in it that are Opposing Force and Blue Shift? What's more scary is that Marc Laidlaw, the author of the Half-Life series' story, supposedly said that the site has a mostly correct chronology. Hopefully this is false.Oberleutnant wrote:Everyone, have a look at this most excellent analysis of the Half Life story so far: http://members.shaw.ca/storage_4/hl2story/
Great stuff there.
Also, there is a whole bunch of stuff he claims is in Half-Life 1 and 2 that I never saw or read about before:
1. What the fuck is the "Air Exchange Program"?
2. Where does he get those screwy years from? Half-Life 1 is in 2000? I thought it was in 1998, the year the game was released. The world falling into disarray with the Portal Storms in 2002? The Combine invading Earth in 2004? Gordon waking up in 2010? What evidence is there for these years?
3. What evidence is there to support his claim that the Citadel is not the only one?
4. Where does he get that the Combine invaded and controlled Xen before the Resonance Cascade? If so, then why didn't we see any of the Combine's technology? The Xen aliens never used any vehicles aside from the flying transports and never used any sort of technological weapons of any kind. The only thing I could see that would kind of make sense, but not really, is the alien grunt being a genetically mutated version of the Vortigaunts. They both have a third arm in the middle of their torso. But then, that doesn't really make much sense as the alien grunt does not have the abilities the Vortigaunt has of using energy.
Also, if they really were controlled by the Combine, why didn't we see any of the more deadlier aliens in use by the Combine in Half-Life 2? No Gargantuas? Those big blue bastards could tear apart Striders like tissue paper. No tentacles in the sand? They are nigh-invulnerable. No flying Xen Controllers? They would have been ideal guards in the Citadel.
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You know, looking at the Combine Advisor, I noticed something -- "he" has arms that terminate in large blades, just like some of the Race X aliens.
Of course, the rest looks absolutely nothing like the rest of the Race X aliens, but it's interesting nonetheless.
Of course, the rest looks absolutely nothing like the rest of the Race X aliens, but it's interesting nonetheless.
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He says the following about Opposing Force and Blue Shift at the end of his page:IRG CommandoJoe wrote:He leaves out a great deal of information obtained about Race X, G-Man, the level of knowledge that humans had about the aliens, Barney Calhoun, and other events (the nuking of BMRF, for example) from Opposing Force and Blue Shift. How could he base his assumptions on Half-Life 2 on a chronology that has two big, gaping holes in it that are Opposing Force and Blue Shift?
"Q: Are you planning on adding the events of Opposing Force (Adrian Shepard) and Blue Shift?
A: For the time being, no. If and when I deem the events of OF and BS critical to the telling of the saga, I'll add them. For me, they only simply flesh out the events of Black Mesa - that is, they don't tell us many new things plot-specific. However, if I come across some important facts that further the telling of the overall HL saga, I'll add them. Right now this saga deals with Gordon's journey only, and I feel that's sufficient."
I strongly disagree with him, though.
AFAIK it was mentioned in the game that the Combine is altering Earth's atmosphere.1. What the fuck is the "Air Exchange Program"?
It was stated in the manual of the original game (again, AFAIK) that Freeman was offered a position position at Black Mesa in 2000. He received his doctorate from MIT in 1999.2. Where does he get those screwy years from? Half-Life 1 is in 2000? I thought it was in 1998, the year the game was released.
None, I believe.The world falling into disarray with the Portal Storms in 2002? The Combine invading Earth in 2004? Gordon waking up in 2010? What evidence is there for these years?
Based on the photo of Eli, his wife and Alyx (who is just a child in it) and that Eli says "That photo and Alyx were the only things I could carry out from Black Mesa" (meaning that Alyx was indeed quite young when the resonance cascade occured), we can assume that roughly ten to twenty years have passed since the events of the first game.
It was mentioned in the game that Citadels appeared simultaneously in several major cities around the world, after Xen wildlife started to teleport into the countryside. (Just to be on the safe side, I'd like to add a third AFAIK.)3. What evidence is there to support his claim that the Citadel is not the only one?
I think his theory makes plenty of sense in this regard. Nihilanth was clearly controling Xen and the Xenians, but he, too, had masters of his own much like Doctor Breen. Among the things Nihilanth says to Gordon at the end of the first game is: "Their slaves . . . we are their slaves . . . we are . . ."4. Where does he get that the Combine invaded and controlled Xen before the Resonance Cascade?
Nihilanth's gruesome appearance is also strikingly similar to the modified humans used as Combine's slaves:
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/manu-site/half- ... ilanth.jpg
http://members.shaw.ca/storage_4/hl2sto ... talker.jpg
Coincidence?
Perhaps Breen simply underestimated the human resistance and felt that more protection was unnecessary in the City 17? After all, he was confident that everything was under control.If so, then why didn't we see any of the Combine's technology? The Xen aliens never used any vehicles aside from the flying transports and never used any sort of technological weapons of any kind. The only thing I could see that would kind of make sense, but not really, is the alien grunt being a genetically mutated version of the Vortigaunts. They both have a third arm in the middle of their torso. But then, that doesn't really make much sense as the alien grunt does not have the abilities the Vortigaunt has of using energy.
Also, if they really were controlled by the Combine, why didn't we see any of the more deadlier aliens in use by the Combine in Half-Life 2? No Gargantuas? Those big blue bastards could tear apart Striders like tissue paper. No tentacles in the sand? They are nigh-invulnerable. No flying Xen Controllers? They would have been ideal guards in the Citadel.
Well, to be honest, without Freeman the resistance would've been hopeless against the Combine. It was his arrival that sparked the open revolt in the first place. And as the game makes it clear, for the resistance members Gordon "Free Man" has become a messiah-like figure whom they all follow into battle.
edit:
Spyder wrote:(on the location of City 17) Somewhere in Eastern Europe, probably somewhere near the baltic. There's cyrillic writing on some of the flyers.
There's also Finnish and Swedish writing on the gas pumps, as well as adverts for "Baltic Café". Much of the architecture reminds me of the Latvian capital Riga, a city that also happens to have a river passing through it.
No doubt "Somewhere in Eastern Europe" is as close as we are ever going to get.
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Information said by Eli, and also expounded on in greater detail in a cut-scene script in the Raising the Bar book.Oberleutnant wrote:It was mentioned in the game that Citadels appeared simultaneously in several major cities around the world, after Xen wildlife started to teleport into the countryside. (Just to be on the safe side, I'd like to add a third AFAIK.)IRG CommandoJoe wrote:3. What evidence is there to support his claim that the Citadel is not the only one?
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I read all of that, and yes, I also strongly disagree with him.Oberleutnant wrote:He says the following about Opposing Force and Blue Shift at the end of his page:
"blah blah blah"
I strongly disagree with him, though.
I completely missed that one. Is it actually called the "Air Exchange Program"?AFAIK it was mentioned in the game that the Combine is altering Earth's atmosphere.
Aha...yes, it does say that, doesn't it?It was stated in the manual of the original game (again, AFAIK) that Freeman was offered a position position at Black Mesa in 2000. He received his doctorate from MIT in 1999.
None, I believe.
Based on the photo of Eli, his wife and Alyx (who is just a child in it) and that Eli says "That photo and Alyx were the only things I could carry out from Black Mesa" (meaning that Alyx was indeed quite young when the resonance cascade occured), we can assume that roughly ten to twenty years have passed since the events of the first game.
He should have put question marks or a spread of years that the events could have happened in. Then I wouldn't mind so much. But the fact that he just comes out and states a bunch of years without proof annoys me.
Argh....I also missed that one entirely. Then how do we know that Breen was controlling all of the Combine on Earth and not simply City 17? Besides, where does he get the authority to surrender for Earth? He's not the President or President of the U.N. or any other nation's leader. He was just the administrator of the BMRF, which leads me to believe he was striking a deal with the Combine before the Resonance Cascade ever happened. In fact, he probably wanted it to happen. Then I wonder how the G-Man relates to Breen and the scientists in HL 1?It was mentioned in the game that Citadels appeared simultaneously in several major cities around the world, after Xen wildlife started to teleport into the countryside. (Just to be on the safe side, I'd like to add a third AFAIK.)
I remember a lot of the things he said came under a lot of scrutiny since the voice was distorted. Has Valve ever released some sort of guide as to what the Nihilanth actually said, or is this going by the voice sounds only?I think his theory makes plenty of sense in this regard. Nihilanth was clearly controling Xen and the Xenians, but he, too, had masters of his own much like Doctor Breen. Among the things Nihilanth says to Gordon at the end of the first game is: "Their slaves . . . we are their slaves . . . we are . . ."
I think so. We see a great level of variation in appearances among the lifeforms we know the Combine altered, such as the Striders and those weird four-legged things in the Citadel at the end of the game and the human slaves. If all of the alien lifeforms the Combine altered are diverse in appearance, why should the vaguely-similar appearance of the Nihilanth and the human slaves signify anything?Nihilanth's gruesome appearance is also strikingly similar to the modified humans used as Combine's slaves:
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/manu-site/half- ... ilanth.jpg
http://members.shaw.ca/storage_4/hl2sto ... talker.jpg
Coincidence?
If so, then why didn't we see any of the Combine's technology? The Xen aliens never used any vehicles aside from the flying transports and never used any sort of technological weapons of any kind. The only thing I could see that would kind of make sense, but not really, is the alien grunt being a genetically mutated version of the Vortigaunts. They both have a third arm in the middle of their torso. But then, that doesn't really make much sense as the alien grunt does not have the abilities the Vortigaunt has of using energy.
Also, if they really were controlled by the Combine, why didn't we see any of the more deadlier aliens in use by the Combine in Half-Life 2? No Gargantuas? Those big blue bastards could tear apart Striders like tissue paper. No tentacles in the sand? They are nigh-invulnerable. No flying Xen Controllers? They would have been ideal guards in the Citadel.
We've seen the level of destruction that Gordon Freeman was capable of in HL 1. Breen obviously knew about it as well. And yet he still belittled his forces for not being able to apprehend an untrained scientist. So if he thought that Gordon Freeman was no threat and realized the level of damage he's caused in HL1, why shouldn't he have used the more powerful Xen aliens in subduing Earth? We already knew that the Xen aliens were capable of teleporting into Earth. So why not?Perhaps Breen simply underestimated the human resistance and felt that more protection was unnecessary in the City 17? After all, he was confident that everything was under control.
So once the resistance sparks, why not bring in the heavy stuff to quell it unless they simply do not have it?Well, to be honest, without Freeman the resistance would've been hopeless against the Combine. It was his arrival that sparked the open revolt in the first place. And as the game makes it clear, for the resistance members Gordon "Free Man" has become a messiah-like figure whom they all follow into battle.
I wonder if all of the people in the game are relocated from North America or if we're supposed to assume that all of the dialogue is simply translated into English. But then again, Father Gregori had a European accent, and Dr. Breen, Judith, Eli, and Alxy were all from the first BMRF, so perhapds all of the people in City 17 were relocated from North America after all. Perhaps North America had become too infested with Xen and Race X aliens and that is why they shifted everything into Europe?snip
No doubt "Somewhere in Eastern Europe" is as close as we are ever going to get.
??? Under Combine control? Where is that?Luzifer's right hand wrote:It seems not all Vortigaunts are free.
One of them is sweepings the floor at the begining of the game.
Also, there is a scene in the game where the Vortigaunts do attack Combine soldiers. After the Combine starts raiding East Black Mesa and the rubble separates you and Dog from Alyx, you can hear a Vortigaunt attacking and killing Combine soldiers. I haven't no-clipped it to see what's going on, but I think the audio is enough evidence.
Who's the more foolish, the fool or the fool who follows him? -Obi-Wan Kenobi
"In the unlikely event that someone comes here, hates everything we stand for, and then donates a big chunk of money anyway, I will thank him for his stupidity." -Darth Wong, Lord of the Sith
Proud member of the Brotherhood of the Monkey.
"In the unlikely event that someone comes here, hates everything we stand for, and then donates a big chunk of money anyway, I will thank him for his stupidity." -Darth Wong, Lord of the Sith
Proud member of the Brotherhood of the Monkey.