StarDestroyer.Net BBS

This is supposedly a minor patch, with the major, much larger one (with fixed videos and higher quality music) coming out in a couple of days.

Go to www.obsidianent.com

Not a single mention of Dantooine. Color me underwhelmed.

Bleh. Apart from a few minor issues (like certain quests not clearing from the log), this doesn't affect my problems at all. There's also still no sign that a proper ending is coming.

ATi claims that the Dantooine bug is fixed with Catalyst 5.4, but I've found that it's mostly ineffective -- instead of a framedrop to ~3-4 FPS, it's around 8-9 FPS instead. Hacking in the 4.3 or 4.11 Catalyst OpenGL driver is still the best bet, though this results in glow effects being disabled.

And X-BOX still gets stiffed, makes me not want to get JadeEmpire.

I hate the feeling of getting cheated.

Well, technically, Bioware didn't make KOTOR2, it was another development house. I don't see why one developer's fuckup should detract from another developer's game.

It's like playing Homeworld Cataclysm and getting upset at Relic for the bugginess and the horrible patch support, and thus refusing to buy HW2...

I should think that a fixed KOTOR 2 X-Box version needs to be released and given for free to X-box owners of KOTOR 2.

Faram wrote:And X-BOX still gets stiffed, makes me not want to get JadeEmpire.

I hate the feeling of getting cheated.

Jade Empire is nothing to do with Obsidian.

And most importantly, it's nothing to do with Lucasarts.

The problems that KOTOR 2 is experiencing stem mainly from the rushed release (well, that and the general PC developer mentality of release first patch later, but that's a whole other story.)

KOTOR2 is unfixable on the Xbox, it doesn't have any netcode, it can't access Live to download content, nor is there a menu option to make it do so in the first place.

Vendetta wrote:Jade Empire is nothing to do with Obsidian.

And most importantly, it's nothing to do with Lucasarts.

The problems that KOTOR 2 is experiencing stem mainly from the rushed release (well, that and the general PC developer mentality of release first patch later, but that's a whole other story.)

KOTOR2 is unfixable on the Xbox, it doesn't have any netcode, it can't access Live to download content, nor is there a menu option to make it do so in the first place.

Okay good, then there might be hope for Jade.

The shit that is Kotr2 made me mad.

It's so fucking sad to release half a game and cheat your customers.

Alyeska wrote:I should think that a fixed KOTOR 2 X-Box version needs to be released and given for free to X-box owners of KOTOR 2.

That would be the sensible thing to do, given that X-box Live now makes this actually feasible. It will not, however, come to pass. Probably because Microsoft refuses to give a shit.

Alyeska wrote:I should think that a fixed KOTOR 2 X-Box version needs to be released and given for free to X-box owners of KOTOR 2.

I can think of at least one game that was swapped for a newer version because it was incompatible with Windows after Win95 (Interstate 76, I mailed the old copy and Interplay sent me a new one for free, well except for international costs ) so at least it's not completely impossible for X-Box owners to be served this way.

Unless the company just says "fuck'em" of course. Or who knows, maybe they won't even release a "full content" patch for either X-Box or PC, so the X-Box unpatchability issue would be moot.

SirNitram wrote:That would be the sensible thing to do, given that X-box Live now makes this actually feasible. It will not, however, come to pass. Probably because Microsoft refuses to give a shit.

They can't do anything via Live for KOTOR2. It's not Live aware. In order to get any kind of Live service out of a game, the game itself has to know how to connect to the service and download content. There's no content download option in KOTOR2's menu, even if the content were there, there's no way to load it into the game via Live.

They'd have to release any patch on a disc, like the Dead or Alive 3 booster pack.

Vendetta wrote:

SirNitram wrote:That would be the sensible thing to do, given that X-box Live now makes this actually feasible. It will not, however, come to pass. Probably because Microsoft refuses to give a shit.

They can't do anything via Live for KOTOR2. It's not Live aware. In order to get any kind of Live service out of a game, the game itself has to know how to connect to the service and download content. There's no content download option in KOTOR2's menu, even if the content were there, there's no way to load it into the game via Live.

They'd have to release any patch on a disc, like the Dead or Alive 3 booster pack.

Then I'll have to sit back and laugh. Sorry, but I gotta, hearing this.

If it makes me laugh it's only in a fatalistic kind of manner.

It's a symptom of the problem that's been endemic in PC games development for years, the fact that code houses seem incapable of turning out finished product. (seriously, How many PC games can you think of that haven't had at least one patch released). When people like Obsidian, who are talented enough creatives, come to make games for consoles for te first tie, they fail to take into account that the product is pretty much fixed once released, and unless really thoroughly tested, it can end up seriously broken.

The Xbox version doesn't suffer from quite the same technical glitches that the PC version does, since it's a fixed platform, but it's still not acceptably finished as a product.

All this said, nothing could have saved KOTOR 2. One year is not enough time to put a completely new game on the shelves unless you're an Insomniac. And people shouldn't try and copy them, it doesn't work.

Well, in all fairness, the only people to blame at Obsidian are those who negotiated the contract with Lucasarts.

Vendetta wrote:
Jade Empire is nothing to do with Obsidian..

Indeed, it also rocks.

White Haven wrote:Well, in all fairness, the only people to blame at Obsidian are those who negotiated the contract with Lucasarts.

True that, Obsidian's full of ex-Black Isle people, the folks behind Baulder's Gate and the Fallout series. If Lucasarts hadn't rushed the deadline things would be a lot different. What Obsidian do need to start doing though is start making their own games, try to ween themselves off Bioware's hand-me-downs.

I'm gonna take the unpopular route and point the finger somewhere else: US.

If gamers weren't whiney, demanding little pukes that leapt all over announcements and press releases like pedophiles on Shirley Temple, we wouldn't see marketing gimmicks and rushed releases.

If gamers didn't constantly demand The Bestest Best Game EVARRZZZ!!!one with every single product released, there wouldn't be the necessity in the industry to hype up products.

If gamers didn't have a massive entitlement complex, there would be no petty rivalries in the industry that are based more on silly, superficial "features" as opposed to gameplay.

Every symptom has a cause. In this case, the cause is the fact that the gaming audience responds so well to the trite marketing that developers and publishers use.

While obviously its a problem of the buyer/producer interaction, the devs and marketers spend all their time CREATING that preconception and desire. That's why games are hyped, often for years, before release. The pressure they're under because of gamer attitudes were created by them, or other similar groups.

Vendetta wrote:

SirNitram wrote:That would be the sensible thing to do, given that X-box Live now makes this actually feasible. It will not, however, come to pass. Probably because Microsoft refuses to give a shit.

They can't do anything via Live for KOTOR2. It's not Live aware. In order to get any kind of Live service out of a game, the game itself has to know how to connect to the service and download content. There's no content download option in KOTOR2's menu, even if the content were there, there's no way to load it into the game via Live.

They'd have to release any patch on a disc, like the Dead or Alive 3 booster pack.

They could do that, or they could also pack it in with a content download for another game or something to that effect.

I don't think it's our fault at all- it's LucasArts bullshit pushing for a holiday release rather than releasing the game when it was ready. In that case, whiney fanboys who want their KOTOR 2 fix would buy it whenever, holidays or not. I certainly don't give a fuck about the holiday season, I buy the game I want when it comes out.

Vympel wrote:I don't think it's our fault at all- it's LucasArts bullshit pushing for a holiday release rather than releasing the game when it was ready. In that case, whiney fanboys who want their KOTOR 2 fix would buy it whenever, holidays or not. I certainly don't give a fuck about the holiday season, I buy the game I want when it comes out.

It's not just selling the game that's the concern. The whole point of releasing it in a rush for Christmas was to stampede PC users who don't have Xboxes into buying or begging for them.

They probably did get something of a sales spike from that, and they could give a shit about engendering ill will over the shitty game quality, because likely the majority of people who have the console will get other games for it.

Vympel wrote:I don't think it's our fault at all- it's LucasArts bullshit pushing for a holiday release rather than releasing the game when it was ready. In that case, whiney fanboys who want their KOTOR 2 fix would buy it whenever, holidays or not. I certainly don't give a fuck about the holiday season, I buy the game I want when it comes out.

You have to realise, though, that you are an insignificant segment of the market. The committed gamer who will buy new games as and when they are released is a tiny part of the market with very little impression on any one company.

Games sales overall are much higher at christmas, which is why they wanteed to push the Xbox version, which has a wider target base anyway, out early so that they could partake of that. They want to attract all the millions of people who don't buy games whenever they are released. There are more of them, but they buy less games each, so companies fight harder for their money.

And the CorpWhores apparently don't grasp the concept of 'reputation' (Reh-Pew-Tay-Shun), and its effects on future sales. Stupid fuckers.