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So, now that we've had time to absorb Oblivion, do you have hope that Fallout 3 will be good? Or will it suck ass, as many hardcore Fallout fans seem to think?

(Rants on the NMA forums are great in this regard)

It's going to be a console game. That alone will tell you that it's going to be VERY, VERY different from what we're used to.

Best Case? It beats the snot out of our expectations and takes them in a new direction.

Worst Case? It's utter trash that is dumbed down to hitting the X button and racking up bottlecaps.

I hadn't heard it was going to be on the consoles. That alone dims my expectations considerably.

Seriously, console?

Blech.

Still I have my Fallout 2. And while not ultra shiny, I still go back to it, and give it a whirl.

As for my expectations, they are honestly pretty high. Not graphics or sound, but actual gameplay and the little things that made Fallout 1 & 2 head and shoulders above most games.

Arthur_Tuxedo wrote:I hadn't heard it was going to be on the consoles. That alone dims my expectations considerably.

The version for PC died when Interplay went under. It looked very loyal to the classic Fallout, with modern updates like an adjustable camera. Same art style too, and a lot of fun ideas.

The current version is being developed by Bethesda, who do TES.

Bethesda have said they intend to make it a multi-platform game, but apart from PC, they haven't said what platform. They pointed to Morrowind on PC and XBox as refuting the criticism that you can't make a complex game for consoles.

Of course, this was before Oblivion, which is obviously more "console friendly" (ie. somewhat simplified).

Personally, I'm really worried. The game will certainly look like sex, but how will it play? What makes Fallout great is the sum of its parts. If they fuck with SPECIAL, it will suck. If they fuck with the combat system, it will suck. If they don't have gory death animations, it will suck (Bethesda has indicated they intend to keep these). If there's no profanity, prostitution, and drugs, it will suck. If they try the TES-style travel, it will suck. And so on.

Vympel wrote:Bethesda have said they intend to make it a multi-platform game, but apart from PC, they haven't said what platform. They pointed to Morrowind on PC and XBox as refuting the criticism that you can't make a complex game for consoles.

Of course, this was before Oblivion, which is obviously more "console friendly" (ie. somewhat simplified).

Personally, I'm really worried. The game will certainly look like sex, but how will it play? What makes Fallout great is the sum of its parts. If they fuck with SPECIAL, it will suck. If they fuck with the combat system, it will suck. If they don't have gory death animations, it will suck (Bethesda has indicated they intend to keep these). If there's no profanity, prostitution, and drugs, it will suck. If they try the TES-style travel, it will suck. And so on.

Morrowind is a lot different from fallout however. It was a lot more empty, and vacant. Less.. flavorful in places that I'd have preferred depth. It didn't grab me, like Fallout did. Fallout gave you some direction fo what to do. Morrowind seems to be a bit toooo open.

Vympel wrote:If they try the TES-style travel, it will suck.

Quick travel is pretty similar to how you traveled the overworld in Fallout.

The thing that makes Fallout, well Fallout, is the dialogue. Yes, the combat and the weird retro-future styling are very important, but the dialogue is what makes it all hang together in a cohesive whole. In the first two games, there was so much you could do with the dialogue and all the little jokes made it worthwhile to actually carefully read through every option and try and find out as much as possible about the post apocalyptic world as you can. I mean, who doesn't remember:

*woof**woof*
"What's that Laddie? You say you are Timmy were playing cowboys and Indians when Timmy fell down the well and you want me to use my rope to go down there and save him? (astonishing!)"

or:

"The guy you need to kill is Caucasian, brown hair, wears a dirty beige shirt"
"You know, that describes a lot of people I've met since leaving Arroyo."
"Heh... yeah, know what you mean, there's only like seven different people out there. Personally I think there was a big cloning accident back before the bombs dropped."

Plus perhaps the most critical atmosphere device other than good dialogue was the music. It's meant to invoke a feeling of cloistered solitude, like you're out in the middle of some hellish wasteland with nothing around you but blowing sand and the ghosts of the past, but its claustrophobic because you have to wrap up against the invisible radiation that despite your best efforts is surely shaving years off your life. Or you're in some monument to the hubris of the past, technological marvels that could save thousands but they've either been destroyed by the ravages of time or are actively trying to kill you. The music is thinking music, meant to slowly creep you out, not excite your bloodlust because while combat is important, there should always be another way to accomplish the mission.

Anyway, those are the two things that I think are most important, dialogue and music, with hopefully the rest of the atmosphere following by necessity.

Bethseda can do good dialouge. I have no worries about that.

Personally, I wouldn't mind it if they had some music that was more than just almost pure ambiant SFX like the original games.

I'm personally worried, I love the games but Bethesda has not impressed me plot wise.
They don't have the intricate layered plots or quests of BioWare/Black isle or Obsidian and if they want to have spoken speech for every line in the game like in Oblivion they we may have a rehash of almost no dialogue options and identicial lines from the civilians.
What made the Games was the dialogue and plot as well as the atmosphere, I trust Bethesda with the atmosphere, it's the dialogue, 50's style, plots and humour that worry me.
My wet dream would be for them to subcontract it to Obsidian while still using the Oblivion engine but theres no chance of that happening...

Bethesda? Good dialog? Apart from some believable exchanges in the main plot, no way.

This may be because apart from Patrick Stewart, Sean Bean and Terrence Stamp, they literally only hired a handful of other actors. Gets kind of boring hearing the same people again and again. I prefer Fallout's approach- spoken dialog for important/cool characters, text for everyone else.

THere's going to be a fallout 3?

2000AD wrote:THere's going to be a fallout 3?

Yup, Bethesda are making it using the Oblivion engine, they bought the rights from Interplay.
I'd have been happier if Interplay had had the Halfdone "Van Bueren"/original FO3 finished via Obsidian or even bioware with this game by Bethesda being a new one. Still no chance of that happening now that the rights have been fullly sold and development begun.

Bethesda? Good dialog? Apart from some believable exchanges in the main plot, no way.

Agreed, there were'nt even real dialogue threads, or more than maybe 1-2 options to complete a quest.
A far cry from the massive variety of options in The Fallout games, expansive dialogue trees and even quests that could be done without violence or Science [Though this would have been built on more in FO3].

Out of curiosity, who here goes to No Mutants Allowed? I visit the site once in a while but I'm not a forum member.

2000AD wrote:There's going to be a fallout 3?

Se this press release from Bethesda.

Little is known about the project, but the folks over at No Mutants Allowed have got quite some information although some of it may be a bit speculative.

EDIT: It seems death has answered the question raised better than I have, so move allong...

Worst Case? It's utter trash that is dumbed down to hitting the X button and racking up bottlecaps.

Bottlecaps are gone, they had money in Fallout 2 .

I don't think Fallout 3 should pick up in the same location where Fallout 2 is. Ditch California, make it in China or Europe or Canada, I want to see the world. By Fallout 3 California would be developed, the vaults open, the mutants under control. That's no fun.

What made Fallout 2 so awesome was even though there was a set story, there was no set way to accomplish it. One game I went in with a pure ranged character, got a whole trunk full of every single .223, magnum and rocket ammo in the whole game (I drove around and bought every ammo I could get my hands on and stuffed my trunk full of it), brought 3 pack mules to the island and killed everybody in it (yes, every single Enclave soldier). Another time I went sneaky.

The best was max/minning my character. I had a max/minned ranged character, and my brother made a max/minned melee character and took out the whole Enclave with a mega-power fist... target critical to the eye, punch, guy's head explodes lol...

...and of course the gore---a laser/projectile minigun kill was always immensely satisfying.

Of course keep in mind this was when I was like what, 15, 13, so maybe my tastes have changed since then lol.

Brian

Vympel wrote:Bethesda? Good dialog? Apart from some believable exchanges in the main plot, no way.

This may be because apart from Patrick Stewart, Sean Bean and Terrence Stamp, they literally only hired a handful of other actors. Gets kind of boring hearing the same people again and again.

Oh, I'm so very sorry that you meant to say VOICE ACTING instead of DIALOUGE.

DPDarkPrimus wrote:
Oh, I'm so very sorry that you meant to say VOICE ACTING instead of DIALOUGE.

The two are not mutually exclusive. When you make the design decision to have full spoken dialog by every major character, it's incumbent on you to do it right. Dialog that may have sounded good if spoken a different way is still shit dialog if spoken the wrong way. The idle conversation in Oblivion is especially stilted.

Vympel wrote:The idle conversation in Oblivion is especially stilted.

No argument there.

After Oblivion, I think there's precedent for Beth doing everything wrong on a cross-platform Fallout game. At least I get another game to add to the 'great game ruined by cross-platformage'.

If its anything like the Elder Scrolls I will fucking kill Bethseda. No ifs, no buts. Dead.

Whats worse, they seem to imply in one of their "nothing is yet set at this time" that they will make the game first/third person since the overhead view is not their thing...

I really, really hope they decide to do it properly on the PC rather then the watered down console crap that crept itself into Oblivion.

Funny how whenever someone brings up this point they point out Morrowind which was ported onto the Xbox after the project was well under way instead of showing off their flagship product, the consolitis stricken Oblivion.

I can forgive a first person perspective if they retain the essence of Fallout combat- but I don't see how that can be done. It's radically different- will first person perspective and targeting people in the eyes, kneecaps etc really work? I hope so. There's a lot of potential for the game if they put work into it- imagine shooting someone in the eyes and they run around screaming how they're blind, as opposed to the original games where we just had to pretend

I loved Fallout 2, so here is hoping Fallout 3 lives up to it.

Vympel wrote:I can forgive a first person perspective if they retain the essence of Fallout combat- but I don't see how that can be done. It's radically different- will first person perspective and targeting people in the eyes, kneecaps etc really work? I hope so. There's a lot of potential for the game if they put work into it- imagine shooting someone in the eyes and they run around screaming how they're blind, as opposed to the original games where we just had to pretend