Are Acclamator's obsolete?

[Vympel]

Perhaps, but that depends on assuming things about the Clone Wars which we don't know. Judging from Episode II, the war was going to span some 10,000 systems. You need way more than a paltry 2,000,000 'units' (could this mean an army, division, regiment etc?) for a war spanning even a fraction of those systems.

[Sea Skimmer]

Some thoughts of a sleep deprived mind..

Acclamators strike me as being somewhat unbalanced. There lack of fighters and limited point defenses make them unsuitable for space combat, while much of their armament is not of much use for supporting troops. The result is that you still need quite a few escorts and you troop transports are hauling around a lot of expensive redundant weaponry and reactor space to power it.

Its better to have some real warships as escort which can also perform a BDZ if needed, and then strip the heavy guns off the troop transports to make them cheaper or have greater capacity. This seems to be what was done in the Empires days, with a troop line having several 16,000 man transports escorted by a couple Strikes.

Specialization won out over having a limited multirole capacity. Given the Empires need for a vast fleet of new ships, the lower individual cost and resulting faster construction times would be a plus.

This is what I believe happened. Rothanas yard also may have been attacked and put out of action during the war as well. Kuat's support to have a big fleet protecting them but we don't know the full extent of the Separatists fleet.

[Vympel]

Their point defenses aren't really limited. 24 laser cannons.

Their armament can be used for supporting troops- but really they're carrying a fully equipped air-mobile force- infantry with full air, armor and artillery support.

Also, seeing the large, visible guns on the Acclamator in context, they're not very impressive. The heavy turrets on Imperator's are much larger. If anything, they are after-thought armament that isn't really useful for heavy ship to ship combat.

Specialization doesn't seem to have won out- it could be said that the Imperator is the ultimate expression of jack-of-all-trades. Capable of ship-to-ship combat, a plentiful array of fighters, some 9,000 men etc. Remember that the Imperator is the smallest canonical Imperial warship we see on screen and Dark Empire gives us a view of much larger Imperial warships- which is really only to be expected. WEG's stupid little crappfied ships are just special pleading by an el-cheapo bureaucrat (Saxton rules hehehe).

[NecronLord]

{Modifying SW Rebellion to remove the WEG ships}

How about an

Acclamator II we know the VSD needs a refit to compete, why not the Acclamator?

[Spartan]

Sea Skimmer wrote:

Some thoughts of a sleep deprived mind..

Acclamators strike me as being somewhat unbalanced. There lack of fighters and limited point defenses make them unsuitable for space combat, while much of their armament is not of much use for supporting troops. The result is that you still need quite a few escorts and you troop transports are hauling around a lot of expensive redundant weaponry and reactor space to power it.

In the Clone War's LuscasArts game, some of the AMT's are loaded with Aethersprite starfighters. Clearly there is no reason to believe that none of the AMT's at Genosis carried fighters, they certainly have the space to do so. The ATOC graphics novel shows hoards of droid fighters in the early part of the battle. So they were undoubtly participated in the space battle as well. So we are left with two possibilities, the fighters were not a significant threat to the AMT's (similar to TPM), or they carried fighter support to the battle with them. Remember we didn't see the space battle.

Its better to have some real warships as escort which can also perform a BDZ if needed, and then strip the heavy guns off the troop transports to make them cheaper or have greater capacity. This seems to be what was done in the Empires days, with a troop line having several 16,000 man transports escorted by a couple Strikes.

Heavily armed escorts would insure they arrive to make the landing. But the AMT is designed to start a surface assault while the space battle is still rages. In the face of heavy planetary batteries, battlestations, and remaining enemy fleet assets. You will want those guns; and remember the money you save skimping on armament will, be far less than the amount needed to replace an ill prepared vessel.

Specialization won out over having a limited multirole capacity. Given the Empires need for a vast fleet of new ships, the lower individual cost and resulting faster construction times would be a plus.

The only canon specialized ships that we see are; the commandship and the communication ship in ROTJ. All the others ie. Star Destroyers are multirole, there are very few specialized are seen.

This is what I believe happened. Rothanas yard also may have been attacked and put out of action during the war as well. Kuat's support to have a big fleet protecting them but we don't know the full extent of the Separatists fleet.

Rothan is a subsidiary of KDY, for all we know it could have been a recent acquisition at the time; and latter they just decided to use the Kuat name only.

[omegaLancer]

That Acclimator were most likily were alldestroyed during the Clone war.. Remeber we saw only one battle where the ships were uncontested. Kuat may not had manfacture many of these vessels, since they where developed in secert.

And a more powerful ship ( the Victory Stardestroyer ) may have already been on the Drawing board.

It doubtful that the Seperatist and their force would be taken by surprise again. Many of the Seperatist systems were highily industrialized world and would have been in the process of building defensive fleets to insure that the repblic would not have been able to attack their system.

[His Divine Shadow]

Eighteen years is nothing considering the useful life of even a surface navy vessel, in space away from corrosive elements, and gravity a starship could easily still be fucntioning

The CSA has a navy consisting of refitted ships that are over 3000 years old, they kinda suck still compared to any modern ship but thats impressive nonetheless.

[Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi]

That Acclimator were most likily were alldestroyed during the Clone war.. Remeber we saw only one battle where the ships were uncontested. Kuat may not had manfacture many of these vessels, since they where developed in secert.

And a more powerful ship ( the Victory Stardestroyer ) may have already been on the Drawing board.

It doubtful that the Seperatist and their force would be taken by surprise again. Many of the Seperatist systems were highily industrialized world and would have been in the process of building defensive fleets to insure that the repblic would not have been able to attack their system.

According to stats, the VSD has a lower troop capacity, and is more like a predecessor to the ISD. We don't see an Acclamators in the OT because we don't see any instances where such a number of troops needed to be called in. The 9700 aboard an ISD were sufficent to guard Endor, search for droids on Tattooine, or take over Echo Base.

Are there any instances in the EU where such a transport would have been more efficent?

[Soulman]

That maybe part of the reason, but the main reason is stated in SW2ICS. Repulsorlifts can't pass through shields; its also why there were no TIE's present during the ground battle, even though we know they participated in the space battle.

Simply fit the fighters/gunships with wings so they can switch the repulsors off and glide through the shield, problem sorted...

[hvb]

Of course wings are rather an expensive add on for a space fighter, especially one with repulsorlifts: Seldom needed and costs a lot of mass, so not cost effective at all!
Why not just free fall, or better yet use space (ion) engines, from above the shield to below it and run on normal space (ion) engines? Are there environmental concerns? If not it would be the way to go.

[hvb]

To get back to the subject at hand:
I would guess that if they still have 16k man troop transports, then these could very well be the Acclamator, possibly in a revamped version given the lessons of the clone war.
Given the imperial perchant for multirole craft, I would expect the modern Acclamator to retain at least some of its orbital fire support/self defence capability, and likely carry at least 4 TIE fighters as part of its defences/ground support.

This is of course very subjective, but when you don't have any data go by feel, and I am "feeling" a very minimalistic ISD ground assault capability, with none of the warship feel: A ground attack jack-of-all-trades.

[Knife]

Got me thinking. The first Acclamator-class vessel entered service 18 years before A New Hope. In modern naval terms, an 18 year old ship (unless we're talking aircraft carriers which can last for half a century in service) is just over halfway through it's service life. We know that Dreadnoughts are far older than this- and are still in service in large numbers.

Is it likely that the Acclamator class is still in service, seeing as its a troop carrier? What about the LAAT, AT-TE, etc?

I don't see why it would be obsolete, its a troop carrier not a ship of the line. They probably still exsist in one form or another in the Imperial Fleet. Keep in mind that the armament on the Acclamators seem impressive to maybe SW vs ST or such, but for a SW ship of that size the weapons implacements are so-so. They're probably meant to engage static defenses of a target planet as the ships prepare to land.

[Spartan]

HVB wrote:

Of course wings are rather an expensive add on for a space fighter, especially one with repulsorlifts: Seldom needed and costs a lot of mass, so not cost effective at all!
Why not just free fall, or better yet use space (ion) engines, from above the shield to below it and run on normal space (ion) engines? Are there environmental concerns? If not it would be the way to go.

Actually the wings have nothing to do with it, any body that's not grounded (ie. out of contact with it), such fighters and repulsor craft ground out when they contact the shield. The power flowing through the sheild arcs through them causing damage. The fact that the TIE or what ever has wings is irrelevant if their conductive and not grounded they fry.

[Spartan]

Sorry hvb That quote was from soulman

[Soulman]

Actually the wings have nothing to do with it, any body that's not grounded (ie. out of contact with it), such fighters and repulsor craft ground out when they contact the shield. The power flowing through the sheild arcs through them causing damage. The fact that the TIE or what ever has wings is irrelevant if their conductive and not grounded they fry.

h, I thought there had to be something else. Couldn't they just land them and tow them through the shield then? TIE fighters would've been very useful on Hoth, no AT-ATs would've been lost then...

[Vympel]

A cutscene in the original 1993 X-Wing (it looks really bodgy now) depicts XG-1 StarWing Assault Gunboats aiding an AT-AT attack on a Rebel base; it also shows the Star Destroyers performing a light bombardment on the planet. So I assume there was no planetay shield in place.

In other words, I was just thinking out loud and wasn't really contributing to the LAAT/energy shield issue

But there we have it official evidence that XG-1s are used to support Imperial ground attacks. And remember that this is before the Battle of Yavin.

Mayhap their concussion missiles were used to bring down Rebel air support?

[Vympel]

I'm a gronk. Forgot the last part of my post.

Perhaps XG-1 StarWings are used to support ground attacks, having replaced the troop-carrying LAAT

*drum roll*

Much like the Mi-24D HIND-D, which is where the LAAT got its inspiration, was originally designed as a multirole troop carrier/helicopter gunship, the Red Army realized that the troop carrying function wasn't used very often, and so when the next generation were designed, the troop-carrying ability was lost; both the Ka-50 and Mi-28 are pure gunships. The Ka-50 is much cooler however.