Current SW Low End Calcuations

[Chris OFarrell]

Just poping in for a second. I FINALY got my copy of Isards revenge back. I was involved is a similar (I think) thread a while back about shield strength of an ISD II using it. It was rather clear that the quotes I had skiped rather importaint bits in the engagmenet so I decided to wait for the book to return before I said anything else. I'll have a look though these threads sometime tommorow, but consider this a placeholder for me finaly getting around to continuing that whole thing (assuming of course that I can actualy ADD anything).

[CmdrWilkens]

Just poping in for a second. I FINALY got my copy of Isards revenge back. I was involved is a similar (I think) thread a while back about shield strength of an ISD II using it. It was rather clear that the quotes I had skiped rather importaint bits in the engagmenet so I decided to wait for the book to return before I said anything else. I'll have a look though these threads sometime tommorow, but consider this a placeholder for me finaly getting around to continuing that whole thing (assuming of course that I can actualy ADD anything).

SO in other words you're just pumping up your post count for the hell of it

[Ender]

Just poping in for a second. I FINALY got my copy of Isards revenge back. I was involved is a similar (I think) thread a while back about shield strength of an ISD II using it. It was rather clear that the quotes I had skiped rather importaint bits in the engagmenet so I decided to wait for the book to return before I said anything else. I'll have a look though these threads sometime tommorow, but consider this a placeholder for me finaly getting around to continuing that whole thing (assuming of course that I can actualy ADD anything).

SO in other words you're just pumping up your post count for the hell of it

Don't ya just hate it when people do that?

[Chris OFarrell]

Just poping in for a second. I FINALY got my copy of Isards revenge back. I was involved is a similar (I think) thread a while back about shield strength of an ISD II using it. It was rather clear that the quotes I had skiped rather importaint bits in the engagmenet so I decided to wait for the book to return before I said anything else. I'll have a look though these threads sometime tommorow, but consider this a placeholder for me finaly getting around to continuing that whole thing (assuming of course that I can actualy ADD anything).

SO in other words you're just pumping up your post count for the hell of it

Yes

[CmdrWilkens]

Just poping in for a second. I FINALY got my copy of Isards revenge back. I was involved is a similar (I think) thread a while back about shield strength of an ISD II using it. It was rather clear that the quotes I had skiped rather importaint bits in the engagmenet so I decided to wait for the book to return before I said anything else. I'll have a look though these threads sometime tommorow, but consider this a placeholder for me finaly getting around to continuing that whole thing (assuming of course that I can actualy ADD anything).

SO in other words you're just pumping up your post count for the hell of it :)

Don't ya just hate it when people do that?

It can be a pain but at least it provides us with good grist for the mill, and it lets him know that poeple are watching his moves thus making him paranoid, and paranoid people are funny.

[Ender]

Ah, ok then

[Ender]

Alright fokes thought I'd do this today, been meaning to


Anyway, This is current SW Low End Calcuations on weaponry and shielding Strength, I'll update it on Hyperdrive speed and Com range soon, Though if you happen to have the Low ends handy, don't be afraid to post them

Current ISD shield strength Low end is 30TT or 30,000 Giga-tons

Source is Isards Revenge where two ISDs Fight each other, firing broad sides into each other and after five and a half(Roughly, we round it down) the shields Colapse and the ship starts taking damage

Now then because this is low end, we ignore Medium Guns and LTLs and the Captians Sneer at his punny enemys, basicly everything but the HTLS

Ok 5 Volllys,
30 Guns(Rounding down) For a Broad side of HTLs
So 30x5=150 Indivudal Shots times 200 Giga-tons=30,0000 Giga-tons or 30Teratons for an ISD MK II


Ok Minium Weapon Strength
Laser Cannons=6MT(ICS)
LTL=100 Megatons(Taking HTLs and dividing by alot, Also based on Torp Calcs)
MTL= 50 Giga-tons(Taking HTL and Diving by 2 then diving by 2 agian to be fair)
HTL=200 Gigatons(The Heavy Weapons on a 20 Year old Transport, ICS)

More to come

Hey bean, I found a major flaw in your work, both here and in the mid range calcs.

It took that much energy to bring down one section of the shields, not the whole shields. This means that you have to multiply it by 4 for all for sections, and since the TLs only impact against the ray shielding, by 2 to account fot the particle shields to get total shielding.

[Mr Bean]

See mid ranged for your answear Ender

[Master of Ossus]

ISD's have more sections of shielding than that. They also have dedicated shields to protect the hangars (ref. HttE, when Thrawn boosts shield power to all other areas while lowering hangar shields), bridge (ref. RotJ? An Executor class ship loses its bridge deflectors, and Zsinj's final death sequence), port and starboard (ref. Bacta War when an ISD rolls in order to present undamaged shields), and dorsal and ventral shields (ref. Solo Command, when an ISD is strafed along the dorsal areas, its shields in that area go down). Incidentally, I think it may also have front and rear shields, but I can't remember where I read that.

However, I find it likely that in Bean's calcs several shields were overloaded more or less simultaneously.

[seanrobertson]

I think you also may want this info:

Quote:

The Outrageous Okona

WORF: Captain, they have locked lasers.
PICARD: Lasers?
RIKER: Regulations call for a Yellow Alert.
PICARD: It's too small of a craft to be of any threat to us. Do you agree, Lieutenant Worf?
WORF: That won't even penetrate our navigational deflector.

Just to be nitpicky precise:

The actual episode's dialogue is different. There was no mention of
the ship's size, and Picard was the one who said the bit about the nav
deflector. He also said something about how they could "fire until
their lasers run dry and they wouldn't harm the Enterprise."

Quote:

Loud as a Whisper

WORF: I'm reading laser activity in the Solari Solar System!
RIKER: How concentrated is the activity?
WORF: It is localized -- and very intense.
RIKER: So much for the cease-fire.
PICARD: Open hailing frequencies.
WORF: I can establish voice only.
PICARD: This is Captain Jean-Luc Picard, commander of the Federation starship USS Enterprise. If you continue to violate the rules by breaking the cease-fire, I will abort this mission.
FIRST LEADER: You have no jurisdiction here, Picard. Where is Riva?
PICARD: Riva is in charge of the summit. I command the ship that brings him. I will not endanger my ship under any circumstances.

The aired episode is consistent with this. However, IIRC, those ships
might've had other armaments...I could be thinking of another episode,
though, like "Suddenly Human" (which, IMO, isn't worth putting on the
"anti no lasers" argument list: the Talarians had rockets and particle
beams in addition to their X-Ray lasers).

One might also consider the fact that starship crews seem
painfully anxious when their ship is in potential danger. Michael
made this point especially clear in one of the photon torpedo threads...
namely, why would the crew be so scared of proximity-detonated torpedoes
when several direct hits won't destroy their shields ("Q Who?," "The
Nth Degree")? That they're concerned about damage doesn't
necessarily mean it's going to be a threat given said
funny attitude.

This proves that lasers CAN endanger the Enterprise D.
What more proof do you need?

Well, I agree with all of you to a great degree, and I certainly don't
think the nav deflectors--which, oddly enough, are supposed to
move small physical objects out of the ship's way--are "immune"
to laser fire. They shouldn't be able to stop lasers at all! That'd
be the function of dedicated shields.

Perhaps Picard meant that the lasers the E-D might encounter (a'la "Okona") put out so little comparative power that even a "shield" the size of a nav deflector could stop them. After all, nav deflectors are supposed to extend several kilometers in front of the ship itself, and we know that the bigger a shield's area is, the weaker it becomes ("The Defector").

One more word on lasers vs. E-D: the Borg didn't use them until *after*
the E's shields had been knocked down. Thus, the cutting beams have
never been observed to threaten the E-D's shields per se.

BUT...........

Remember when Worf and Data stole Locutus back from that cube
in "BOBW"? They flew in close to the cube in a shuttlecraft, grabbed
Picard, and beamed back.

Then they slowly moved away from the cube, and a Borg beam *identical*
in appearance to a cutting laser lances out and vaporizes the shuttle.
Of course, O'Brien had a transporter lock on the trio and managed to
beam them back the instant after the craft's shields failed.

Whoops...shuttles are supposed to have nav deflectors, too, and we
have one that was blown away. Hard-core Trekkies might tell you
that Data lowered the shuttle's shields to allow for transport, but there
are two fatal holes in that contention:

One, it'd be VERY dangerous to drop the shields altogether.
Besides, when the crew has needed to beam through shields
before they've managed to pull it off--especially when they
know the shield frequencies etc. w/ which they're dealing.
It wouldn't be as if they were beaming through shields w/
unknown "properties" as such.

Two, and by far the most important, *navigational deflectors have
never been an obstacle to transporters*, and nav deflectors ARE
what we're talking about here. Even if the shuttle foolishly lowered
its main shields for transport, those nav deflectors should've
still protected them from the lowly laser attack, eh?

Put that one in the archives

[Connor MacLeod]

I build on Ossus's statement by adding it can also depend upon how shielding is configured/deployed. We know it can be selectively reinforced/angled, and that even "layering" the plates does not provide perfect coverage (there can be some soft spots or weak points in teh shielding that can be exploited by extremely powerful, concentrated firepower - ie the kind of coordinated mass fire we typically see in fighters or cap ship combat) - Torpedo spheres are proof enough alone of this, but shield overlap can create small (but undetectable mostly) "seams" in shields or weak spots (New Rebellion.)

But beyond that, we have reason to believe that the heavy primary turrets (or heavy TLs) of an ISD-1 (if not the ISD-2) seem to be designed for the express purpose of overloading shields and punching through armor (the trilogy ICS describes them as being able to overload deflectors and punch holes in the most heavily armored spaceships) , which may mean that some capital ships mount weapons that have too much brute power to be easily stopped by shields (short of reinforcing them or re-angling against them, which creates gaps in defenses elsewhere).

(I should also point out this infers TREMENDOUS firepower for thoise six HTL turrets. IIRC the EGW&T correctly, even ground based turbolaser cannons require "sustained" volleys to punch through the shields and armor of an ISD, and thats only to puncture the reactor!)

[Darth PhysBod]

Late in the thread but I think its worth mentioning in light of what Connor mentioned about the primary weapons. IIRC it was along the lines of "overloading deflector shields and punching through the armour of the heaviest starships".

As I recall HisDivineShadow mentioned that using the RPG dice rolls the 60TL's on an Imperator mkI should have an output of ~2500GT per shot. However those are the Taim and Bak XX-9's (which according to the behind the magic CD are the smaller box turrets which appear on the Deathstar) not the primary turrets.

From the model dimensions in the SW/IJ Archive (assuming its to the same scale as the fighter models used) I estimated they are about (5m)^3. Now I could be mistraken, as there might be a picture showing them to be longer than an x-wing (i.e >10m in each dimension), but that is still far smaller than the Imperator mkI/mkII primary turrets.

If we assume the firepower scales with the turret size the primary weapons could have 30-160 times the firepower (Im not entirly sure if the XX-9's are >10m or ~5m ).

[Darth PhysBod]

Oops, the XX-9's are probably not 2500GT.

Rather from WOTC they have 2/3 the firepower of the Acclamator heavy weapons.

[Crayz9000]

OK, this is silly, having the SW midrange calcs in the PSW forum and the low-end calcs on the STvsSW forum.