Force Repeling

[Darth Yoshi]

So these things developed their Force nullifying to prevent predators from using the Force to find them. Wouldn’t that work against them, to some degree? If you’re a predator, and suddenly you lose your connection with the Force, then you pretty much know a ysalamari is close by. It’s kind of a dead giveaway, isn’t it?

Not if the whole forest is teeming with ysalamiri that creates a null zone extending with a 12km radius.

[Molyneux]

So these things developed their Force nullifying to prevent predators from using the Force to find them. Wouldn’t that work against them, to some degree? If you’re a predator, and suddenly you lose your connection with the Force, then you pretty much know a ysalamari is close by. It’s kind of a dead giveaway, isn’t it?

Not if the whole forest is teeming with ysalamiri that creates a null zone extending with a 12km radius.

That actually seems to imply that the ysalimiri's ability is a fairly recent development...if they're a primary prey source for vornskrs, who hunt with the Force, then it must be a new tactic (relatively speaking) if the vornskrs don't yet have an evolutionary response to it.

[Lord of the Farce]

One thing I seem to recall quite vividly from the last time I read the Thrawn Trilogy: Vornskrs could still sense Luke and Mara quite readily, despite being in the middle of a Ysalamiri infested forest. In fact, didn't Karrde's tamed Vornskrs still focused on Luke, despite them being on the surface of Myrkr?

I would argue that this, along with the quote provided by gladius, indicate that the Ysalamiri's Force-Null is definitely an innate Force ability of some sort, and that they don't/can't truly cancel out the Force all together in their "bubble".

Throw in the fact that it seems to be possible for Force users to learn to sense the Vong, despite their apparent absence from the Force, and it is quite conceivable that a Force users can also learn to bypass the Ysalamiri.

[Jason]

I wasn't aware that they had that type of range on their nullifying power. 12km is a lot of distance, and would definitely be an advantage.

[Perseid]

I wasn't aware that they had that type of range on their nullifying power. 12km is a lot of distance, and would definitely be an advantage.

Thats the range that a planets worth of ysalamiri can project a Force null field. A single ysalamiri can project a field of about 3 metres IIRC, and the more there are of them the larger and area the field covers.

In the movies, the force is Black and White, good vs. evil however in EU the force is a friggen rainbow of colors (just ask the biotch Vergere...I hate that character with a passion) so, because they have lost their belief in the force, and are trying to spin the force around their personnal beliefs rather than just trusting the force, it makes their bond weaker, thereby, meaning that the slugs and lizards 'seem' to be so powerful.

Vergere, whilst annoying, is trained in the way of the Unifying Force. The Unifying Force doesn't recognise the Light or Dark sides only the emotional state of the person within the Force. Luke himself states, in internal monologue in one of the NJO books (forget which one), that he has become more of a Master of the LIVING Force, which IIRC the jedi of the Old Republic were masters of (ref Qui Gon Jin in TPM).

[Noble Ire]

Thats the range that a planets worth of ysalamiri can project a Force null field. A single ysalamiri can project a field of about 3 metres IIRC, and the more there are of them the larger and area the field covers.

An average adult Ysalamiri actually generates a field 10 meters in diameter.

[Darth Yoshi]

Throw in the fact that it seems to be possible for Force users to learn to sense the Vong, despite their apparent absence from the Force, and it is quite conceivable that a Force users can also learn to bypass the Ysalamiri.

Aside from Anakin and Tahiri, who grew a "Vong-sense" of sorts, didn't most Jedi simply look for Force-empty regions when scanning for Vong?

[Lord of the Farce]

Aside from Anakin and Tahiri, who grew a "Vong-sense" of sorts,

Jacen too.

didn't most Jedi simply look for Force-empty regions when scanning for Vong?

I am aware of that. My point is that it is possible for Force users to learn "Vong-sense", even if the vast majority of them don't have the slightest clue on how that is possible.

[Zwinmar]

In the movies, the force is Black and White, good vs. evil however in EU the force is a friggen rainbow of colors (just ask the biotch Vergere...I hate that character with a passion) so, because they have lost their belief in the force, and are trying to spin the force around their personnal beliefs rather than just trusting the force, it makes their bond weaker, thereby, meaning that the slugs and lizards 'seem' to be so powerful.

Vergere, whilst annoying, is trained in the way of the Unifying Force. The Unifying Force doesn't recognise the Light or Dark sides only the emotional state of the person within the Force. Luke himself states, in internal monologue in one of the NJO books (forget which one), that he has become more of a Master of the LIVING Force, which IIRC the jedi of the Old Republic were masters of (ref Qui Gon Jin in TPM).

It just seems to me, that everyone who Mastered the Unifying force was on a 1 to 10 power scale (1 low, 10 highest) they were at best a 6, were as those who follow the Good vs Evil are inherently more powerful, because their beliefs are so much stronger. There is no moral debate for them.

[Oskuro]

A couple ideas about the issue, although I must warn you people that I haven't read much of the EU literature. I know very little of the Vong, and the Ysalamiri I came to know about through the Jedi Knight game, and then on a comic starring Luke, Mara, Thrawn and C'baoth (The part where Luke faces his clone and such).

The idea that comes to mind when I read about this force-cancelling field is that The Force might be somehow polarized (or more precisely, it migh have diferent "channels", more on this later on). The Ysalamiri might have evolved to create a "negative" Force aura that negates the "normal" Force. This still would mean that a sufficiently powerful Force user could offset this negative aura, but it would mean that the Ysalamiri would need to make no special effort to maintain the null field, just by existing its natural aura would cancel out the surrounding ambient aura, or the auras of intersecting creatures.

As for those "channels" I mentioned, as far as I know, the Vong are extragalactic invaders, evolved far far away from the Star Wars galaxy. It is not unreasonable to think that, back on their galaxy, they might have an equivalent energy field to The Force, but maybe with a diferent "channel" (If we were to make an analogy and present The Force as a waveform, then we could say the Vong have a different frequency). This would render it mostly incompatible to SW Force.

Anyways, just some thoughts on the issue. I actually like a lot the subject of polarity in the universe

[Noble Ire]

As for those "channels" I mentioned, as far as I know, the Vong are extragalactic invaders, evolved far far away from the Star Wars galaxy. It is not unreasonable to think that, back on their galaxy, they might have an equivalent energy field to The Force, but maybe with a diferent "channel" (If we were to make an analogy and present The Force as a waveform, then we could say the Vong have a different frequency). This would render it mostly incompatible to SW Force.

That's exactly how it is described in Traitor, the Force being on different wavelengths, like light, and the Jedi being unable to "see" the wavelength the Vong and possibly even Ysalamiri are on.

[Zwinmar]

Actually, ive read the NJO series...the Vong had the force torn from them...or somthing like that..because of what they were doing, indicateing for arguments sake that the force is like a diety

[Darth Yoshi]

The Vong Force ability was removed by the parent world of Zonama Sekot. Not the by the Force itself. Although it can be argued that living worlds are like the Chosen One in their "being-created-by-the-Force-ness."

[The Grim Squeaker]

The Vong Force ability was removed by the parent world of Zonama Sekot. Not the by the Force itself. Although it can be argued that living worlds are like the Chosen One in their "being-created-by-the-Force-ness."

Or that it simply did what some jedi have been known to do (stripping another of the force as Nomi Sunrider did in the tales of the jedi comic), apparently the planet did that on a larger scale and the techniques effect may be hereditary (we cant know from prior examples), dont forget a planet that can use the force could lay a smackdown on wankatine/

[Darth Yoshi]

I know. I was simply responding to Zwinmar's implication that the Force stripped itself from the Vong as punishment.

[Zwinmar]

I realize that I can also understand how somthing that traumatic could lead to their culture.

For arguments sake however, I do precieve evidence that the force is almost sentient at least. How else to explain Anakin, Zenoma Sekot..etc?