The Karen Traviss Database

Imperial Overlord · Post by **Imperial Overlord** » 2006-07-29 04:15am

Connor MacLeod wrote:
Edit: Its also rather sad when you're out-scaled by a mere RPG reference. Of course why should Traviss pay attention to what other people write in Star Wars?

Considering how the RPG tends to err on the side of minimalism, calling it "sad" is an massive understatement.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2006-07-29 06:18am

Imperial Overlord wrote:
Considering how the RPG tends to err on the side of minimalism, calling it "sad" is an massive understatement.

Actually, that would be more WEG than WoTC.

Their minimalism so far applies only to the Jedi and other force related matters, as well as a tendency to focus on "known" planets.

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2006-07-29 06:28am

Really, minimalism in the WotC SW RPG, mind pointing it out for me? I have the RCRB, PotJSB, DSSB, UAd, HG, and UAA; and for the life of me I can't remember anything, so if you could point it out in those or in the books I don't have, where's the minimalism?

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2006-07-29 06:29am

I have to say, the WOTC stuff is generally slightly better than the older WEG, they even note differences between SSDs, which is an accomplishment in and of itself. :P

Imperial Overlord · Post by **Imperial Overlord** » 2006-07-29 07:44am

Oh its not as bad as WEG stuff, make no mistake about that. But say the airspeed of starships, the population of Coruscant, the resources abilities of the Crime Lord and Sith Lord, and the afformentioned Jedi nerfing are all examples. They realize a galaxy is a big place, they just don't grasp how big it is.

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2006-07-29 08:08am

Then again, this is Star Wars using the rules for D&D as a playable RPG, if it went by the movies, only pure roleplayers would consider playing anything other than a Jedi Counselor or Guardian. As for population, I'm assuming that's from Coruscant and the Core Worlds. As for resource abilities, let's take the newest rendition of Palpy shall we?

This gives Palpatine (20x(D20+3)x50) 4000-23000 credits (Average 13,500) depending on what he gets on his charisma check, remembering that this is readily available (IE Not a lot of hassle), and remembering that this is also per game session. This is not taking into account his noble levels which give him a further 240-1380, which is 1/day.

For the speed, an X-wing in space can move a good 5,000 meters (Ramming Speed 10 squares, on a grid 1 square=500 meters.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-07-29 08:27am

Er, no. Only stupid dickless fifteen year old virgins would rape the 'super' classes: actual RPers, who y'know, want to play a game and have fun would do whatever. There are actually people out there who roll a character and play it, regardless of how poor it is numbers wise, because it's not a wargame, it's a role playing game.

Grr. People like that are why games have stupid rules restricting starting equipment and builds etc: if everyone is highend, it's a highend campaign, no problem. RPing should be Diablo-style 'I want to level my planetary governor' or 'I need to upgrade my shirt' rubbish. GRR!

Sorry. I'm having flashbacks of some retard looking at an equipment list for a realistic, contemporary setting FOR THREE HOURS. UGH.[/i]

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2006-07-29 08:58am

Yeah you know what, just shut the hell up if the only thing you can contribute is your bitching and moaning about powergamers, why don't y'know, DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT! You aren't going to be able to do anything about Powergamers anyhow, hell TSR boards have Character Optimization boards, which we term the Powergamer Boards, though at least try for all the whining you're doing. Like I said pure roleplayers, apparently you can't read either, no wonder you're still stuck on Diablo.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-07-29 09:01am

Riiiiight. Sorry, only retards play pen and paper RP with munchkin builds, that's why munchkin is a pejorative. Lame 'chase the item' or 'zomg I finally have a good gun' RP is *bad*. If the game has Jedi, Jedi should be highend: the idea of crippling Jedi to force players into standard D&D situations is absurd. What kind of campaign lets players take famous characters anyway, outside of a tournament setting?

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2006-07-29 10:09am

No, forcing them into D&D situations is a bit off, sense the Challenge Ratings (CR 1-20+) are gone replaced with Challenge Code (CC A-F), the highest I've seen in SWRPG is the Greater Krayt Dragon with CC F. Secondly, no mechanical traps, and the HP system is replaced with Vitality Points/Wound Points (VP measures how well you can dodge before becoming tired, WP measures how much actual damage you can take), in D&D a critical just meant you take more HP damage, in SW RPG you take WP damage (You only get as many as your constitution score, which normally means anywhere from 3-18 on 3d6 stat generation system or 8-18 on the point buy system), meaning a Stormtrooper can kill you with a single lucky shot.

Once again, I agree with you, in that we shouldn't have to worry about munchkins, meanwhile back here in the real world they exist, and your belief amounts to the same as George Lucas' wish for a benevolent dictator. IE not gonna happen

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2006-07-30 05:10am

Actually, the easiest way to balance munchkin is to simply make balanced classes.

Anyway, it still has absolutely nothing to do with how the Jedi are miminalised, and not just in force abilities. For example, we learn from the New Jedi Order sourcebook that Republic Jedi must undergo a trial prior to them being accepted as a Jedi Knight. Their suggested scope for such a mission is a journey into Coruscant underground, and it focuses on the physical manifestations of it, as opposed to the Decipher CCG spiritual underlyings.

In terms of scale, that has to be absurd. A single lone mission? To recover and protect somebody from Coruscanti gangs and the like?

This also changes the underlying meaning of the Jedi trials considerably. Instead of it being a test of how mature a Jedi is in the Force, the RPG focuses it to become on how "good" a Jedi is and his ability to fight for the Republic. Considering that Luke trial was to meet and defeat Darth Vader.......................

The resources available to a Jedi is also significantly nerfed, this as compared to how much we see them get in the canon. For example, Obiwan mission to purchase a Sekotan ship had over a billion credits to support it, and it was only a few percent of an account which supports Jedi missions.