Imperial era Airborne assault

[Simon_Jester]

Han would probably want to be able to come back to Tatooine without getting lynched some day. Even if the Falcon's engine exhaust plume on max throttle is quite capable of destroying buildings, it would make sense for him to keep it down to less energetic levels. The fact that he wasn't demolishing real estate around the spaceport doesn't prove much either way.
________

With respect to the rapid and ferocious responses to clueless comments:
I'm not particularly bothered by it; it still happens and I think it's worth being open about the fact that it does happen. I certainly don't expect the reaction of other people to what I say to be linearly proportionate to the number of flaws in it; people that predictable would be boring to talk to.

If anything, I see the fact that responses that get more ferocious rapidly as a function of the number of clueless remarks are a pattern is a relatively good sign. If Random Guy #14 says something someone doesn't like and gets a vitriol bath for it, the fact that the same thing happened to Random Guys #1 through 13 is a sign that it isn't just some demented "We Hate Random Guy #14" campaign- that #14 did in fact say something that most intelligent people in the vicinity disagree with.

Here, everyone can confidently expect to get dumped on for saying things that others consider clueless; that's the point. It says so on the label. So yes, people here do do that; expecting anything else would be absurd. I don't think I have to be fed up with the fact that it happens in order to say that it happens.

[Rogue 9]

Corellian CR-90 corvette?

Since this wasn't addressed: It was a CR70 shown landing on a planet in Revenge of the Sith, but the CR90 was a simple upgrade of that design (so simple, in fact, that CR70s are easily converted to the CR90 standard with a standardized upgrade kit) and I see no reason why they would lose the capability.

[Crazedwraith]

Oh, is The RotS canonicallyCorvette not the same as the ANH Corvette? I thought it was just an FX error.

[Rogue 9]

Oh, is The RotS canonicallyCorvette not the same as the ANH Corvette? I thought it was just an FX error.

The RotS Corvette is in fact the exact same ship as the ANH Corvette, pre-upgrade. Which, out of universe, is of course ridiculous handwaving to cover an FX error, but it's the explanation.

[Patroklos]

So, in all likelihood, the Falcon was well within repulsor range for the entire chase scene and trip to hyperspace. Only when he reached Alderaan would he have needed to use his reaction drive.

I would think that if the repulsors are pushing against a gravity well as a mechanism to function the efficiency of the repulsor would depend on the strength of that gravity. At six times the planetary diameter I would imagine the repulsors would be less than adequate to escape ISDs chasing you with all the power they can muster. Long story short, once you are outside the planetary atmosphere by any good distance I don't see repulsors being optimal for military type manuevering.

On a seperate note, has there been any real descriptions of tractor beams being used in atmposphere of from vacuum into an atmosphere. There is a lot of mentioning of "landing barges" which I always took to be unpowered drop type ships. Would it be possible to do the majority of your troop landings from unpowered reinforced barges nudged to the right location and even breaked by tractor beams?

[fractalsponge1]

There is a lot of mentioning of "landing barges" which I always took to be unpowered drop type ships. Would it be possible to do the majority of your troop landings from unpowered reinforced barges nudged to the right location and even breaked by tractor beams?

Why would that make sense? If it's an opposed landing (i.e by something like a v-150), you will need self-powered vehicles that can maneuver evasively and come down faster than at g, like the Titan AT-AT barge, LAAT/c/i, CC9799, or Sentinel. If it's an unopposed landing, then just use something like an Acclamator and debark heavy equipment directly via ramps and elevators. All of those can be re-used, help provide logistics once the troops are actually landed, and are much faster than a "nudged" unpowered barge.

I'm also not sure why you'd assume "landing barges" are unpowered, especially given the ubiquity of repulsorlift in SW.

[Patroklos]

Why would that make sense? If it's an opposed landing (i.e by something like a v-150), you will need self-powered vehicles that can maneuver evasively and come down faster than at g, like the Titan AT-AT barge, LAAT/c/i, CC9799, or Sentinel. If it's an unopposed landing, then just use something like an Acclamator and debark heavy equipment directly via ramps and elevators. All of those can be re-used, help provide logistics once the troops are actually landed, and are much faster than a "nudged" unpowered barge.

Because like in real life there are not always specialized landing vessels like you describe available at every instance. Those would also obviously be far more expensive than more basic landing barges. I have no doubt that those options you mention may be used for the first wave to secure an LZ, but they are not necessarily the optimal choice for landing large scale formations as quickly as possible.

In any case it should not be assumed that "evasive manuevering" is a viable tactic. There is absolutely no reason to think that a computer of SW capability and their mechanical mastery could not produce a planetary defense weapon of the character of CIWS. Simply put there is no scale of physical manuever that can be expected to overcome SW level technology, ESPECIALLY in an atmosphere. The best way to avoid interception is either through counter battery fire or some sort of jaming, either electronic of decoy based, but most importantly by not being available to shoot down period. If that means shooting armored/shielded boxes at the surface as fast as possible with a few nudges inbound and a hard "catch" at the end from a tractor beam (or any number of breaking methods, possible repulsors) then whats the problem? Again, this is predicated on the question of whether tractor beams are useful in atmosphere or have the ability to be operated into the atmosphere from orbit. We know they have the range and power to do what I say from ANH and the Zahn trilogy.

I'm also not sure why you'd assume "landing barges" are unpowered, especially given the ubiquity of repulsorlift in SW.

The term barge almost always refers to an unpowered transport container pushed or pulled by another vessel. It would be very odd to assume that something described as a "barge" would operate under its own power.

This can very from where you are from. In North America powered barges are near nonexistant, while in Europe while still rare relative to unpowered barges they do exist in larger numbers.

[Norade]

So, in all likelihood, the Falcon was well within repulsor range for the entire chase scene and trip to hyperspace. Only when he reached Alderaan would he have needed to use his reaction drive.

I would think that if the repulsors are pushing against a gravity well as a mechanism to function the efficiency of the repulsor would depend on the strength of that gravity. At six times the planetary diameter I would imagine the repulsors would be less than adequate to escape ISDs chasing you with all the power they can muster. Long story short, once you are outside the planetary atmosphere by any good distance I don't see repulsors being optimal for military type manuevering.

On a seperate note, has there been any real descriptions of tractor beams being used in atmposphere of from vacuum into an atmosphere. There is a lot of mentioning of "landing barges" which I always took to be unpowered drop type ships. Would it be possible to do the majority of your troop landings from unpowered reinforced barges nudged to the right location and even breaked by tractor beams?

I said that he was in range, not that he was using them.

[bz249]

In any case it should not be assumed that "evasive manuevering" is a viable tactic. There is absolutely no reason to think that a computer of SW capability and their mechanical mastery could not produce a planetary defense weapon of the character of CIWS. Simply put there is no scale of physical manuever that can be expected to overcome SW level technology, ESPECIALLY in an atmosphere. The best way to avoid interception is either through counter battery fire or some sort of jaming, either electronic of decoy based, but most importantly by not being available to shoot down period. If that means shooting armored/shielded boxes at the surface as fast as possible with a few nudges inbound and a hard "catch" at the end from a tractor beam (or any number of breaking methods, possible repulsors) then whats the problem? Again, this is predicated on the question of whether tractor beams are useful in atmosphere or have the ability to be operated into the atmosphere from orbit. We know they have the range and power to do what I say from ANH and the Zahn trilogy.

Remember the F-117 shot down over Serbia? Well it was shot down since it was doing no evasive maneuvers, thus from the scattered data the SAM gunner was able to reconstruct a likely path and fire three missile to the calculated position.

Thus evasive maneuvers can be a vital add-ons to jamming. The more you zig-zag, the more effective the jamming is.

[Eleventh Century Remnant]

Landing ships are available as part of the small craft complement of the Imperial class, although there seems to have been some retconning and confusion over the details of exactly what; and none of them have ever been described as unpowered.

Underpowered and prone to make the return trip a lot more slowly than the descent, yes, although that is a West End- ism, S canon, and may or may not match the physical possibilities.

I fundamentally disagree about the utility of unpowered drop craft- it seems nothing more than the equivalent of a human wave attack, throwing so many bodies at the defences they can't possibly hope to kill them all. This is not good for the bodies in question.

The supposed inutility of defensive maneuver in atmosphere is pure invention, and incorrect. Did you watch ESB? Remember those snowspeeders? Yes, those ones. Evasive manoeuvring isn't assumed or supposed- it's proven. Lining up and waiting to be hit is a self- imposed death sentence- it's vastly easier to trick the targeters than soak the hit.

It's much easier to come by a sufficiently powerful weapon than a targeting system- how many of these armoured boxes, these heavy, non- reusable, have to leave them littered across the landscape when you're done boxes, could stand a burst from a commercially available light turbo laser?

It's a ridiculously wasteful idea, guaranteed to result in heavy losses. Bad plan.

[Simon_Jester]

Among other things, if you don't dodge in atmosphere, the enemy may very well be able to line up a shot against you using the Mk I eyeball (or passive sensors), even if you're completely screwing over his active sensors.

[fractalsponge1]

Because like in real life there are not always specialized landing vessels like you describe available at every instance. Those would also obviously be far more expensive than more basic landing barges. I have no doubt that those options you mention may be used for the first wave to secure an LZ, but they are not necessarily the optimal choice for landing large scale formations as quickly as possible.

If that means shooting armored/shielded boxes at the surface as fast as possible with a few nudges inbound and a hard "catch" at the end from a tractor beam (or any number of breaking methods, possible repulsors) then whats the problem?

Yes, in real life, you could do amphibious landings against first rate opposition in a raft made of inflatable rubber duckies. Do you think that is a reasonable trade off in cost effectiveness? You think shooting a cargo of troopers or vehicles at the ground in a cheap armored box without power to maneuver, or point defense, and dependent on a mothership's tractor beams to decelerate is more survivable than a trip down in even a cut-price drop ship like a converted Gallofree? And as stated before, maneuvering obviously does help. How many tractor beams are you going to need for this? The mothership will be shifting tractor emitters like a plate spinner dealing with numerous pods, and what if you just happen to miss the timing on one?

Again, this is predicated on the question of whether tractor beams are useful in atmosphere or have the ability to be operated into the atmosphere from orbit. We know they have the range and power to do what I say from ANH and the Zahn trilogy.

OK, that's answered. Now, prove that unpowered drop solutions are common or typical in star wars. This is society where cargo haulers have repulsorlift drives to make orbit, and the technology is common enough to be used in consumer speeder bikes. Freaking escape pods have repulsorlifts to help with descent, and you think that dropping troops into combat in an unpowered box is going to be common?

[Transbot9]

Oh, is The RotS canonicallyCorvette not the same as the ANH Corvette? I thought it was just an FX error.

The RotS Corvette is in fact the exact same ship as the ANH Corvette, pre-upgrade. Which, out of universe, is of course ridiculous handwaving to cover an FX error, but it's the explanation.

It's not an FX error according to the RotS Artbook (p. 104, 207). Someone pitched the idea, Lucas thought it was cool, and what George Lucas wants in a Star Wars movie George Lucas gets.

On the discussion of Drop barges and landing craft, there are these deployed from this. Silly book people ignoring the games...Events and Story are Canon (The Battlefront games may be an exception), Game Mechanics aren't. Unless all those drop-pods are disposable, they'd have to be either repulsar-lifted back up or tractor-beamed up. Push or pull, it's still gravity manipulation.

[Rogue 9]

Okay, then it's ridiculous handwaving to cover a silly whim of the boss; completely rebuilding the engine block doesn't seem like a simple upgrade kit's work to me.