How to think like a Jedi-hater

[Ghost Rider]

There are many kinds of possible vs arenas. If you want to assume it's one kind of arena first ask the TPer whether he agrees with you.

Oh, I see so let's go off on the "What type of vs?" tangent.

With that in mind anything involving everyone except two murderous villain archetypes should be thrown out because a bullshiting weasel could go "Because they would talk it through!" or pehaps "They wouldn't use full force!"

[Connor MacLeod]

I suspect Jodo may be trying to goad someone (like me) into another off-topic discussion regarding the BS logic employed by DBZ fans through the mention of Goku as an "example" (Misdirection is a rather common tactic isnt it? )

Not that I'm going to be tricked into doing that though.

[JodoForce]

Oh, I see so let's go off on the "What type of vs?" tangent.

With that in mind anything involving everyone except two murderous villain archetypes should be thrown out because a bullshiting weasel could go "Because they would talk it through!" or pehaps "They wouldn't use full force!"

That is a fault of the debaters, not a fault of the premise. Not to mention that Jedi cannot be murderous villains by definition

I suspect Jodo may be trying to goad someone (like me) into another off-topic discussion regarding the BS logic employed by DBZ fans through the mention of Goku as an "example" (Misdirection is a rather common tactic isnt it? )

How can you have a meaningful discussion of 'Jedi-haters' without talking about the characters they champion against the Jedi in vs debates?

[Ghost Rider]

I see evasion is your bullshit answer to everything eh?

[JodoForce]

Tactics can affect the outcome of fights. Being able to devise the ideal tactic against your enemy, and being willing to smash down on even the most pitiful-looking enemy with full force, can be considered abilities in their own right. (since you insist on drawing the 'sum total of their abilities')

And you are evading the fact that Luke will lose to [insert ruthless comic character here] especially if personalities are accounted for.

You say mentality and default tactics should be thrown out the window? Then in the Klingon vs Ewoks match the Klingons would flatten the Ewoks by shooting everything on sight. Yeah, sure

Or consider:
A troop of stormtroopers given UFP equipment (we'll give them the guns that you can aim through a sight, at least)
vs
An equal-sized troop of Klingons given Stormtrooper equipment (sans armor)

Who would win?

Don't tell me you aren't interested in considering mentality and tactics in this vs!

[Ghost Rider]

Now instead of pointless semantic bullshit...you now claim more then what is shown on screen(we'll include tactics they've never shown or even implied) and are literally claiming we should know Author's intent.

You really have no clue of Suspension of Disbelief.

[JodoForce]

Now instead of pointless semantic bullshit...you now claim more then what is shown on screen(we'll include tactics they've never shown or even implied)

When did I do that

and are literally claiming we should know Author's intent.

You don't need to know Author's intent to know that Klingons won't go in guns blazing at just a bunch of furry Ewoks if they are acting in character.

[JodoForce]

Now instead of pointless semantic bullshit...you now claim more then what is shown on screen(we'll include tactics they've never shown or even implied)

Oh, the tactics part? When we find so many cases of Jedi not making use of their abilities to end a fight quickly, you have fair reason to conclude that their tactics is not so good.

Come on, even DW admitted that overconfidence is a weakness of the Jedi--and overconfidence obviously leads to bad tactics. Are you going to deny even that now? I have a hard time suspending my disbelief over that...