Ep3 review thread SPOILERS

McC · Post by **McC** » 2005-05-19 03:55pm

Really? Damn, I totally missed it.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2005-05-19 03:57pm

You know, I realized right now after seeing it why Palpatine chose clones
for his GRAND ARMY; instead of raising draftees; because a draftee would
go:

"Sir, what? you want us to KILL the JEDI?" when given Order 66;
there would be slipups even if he used brainwashing.

With clonetroopers, they're the ultimate form of politically reliable
soldiers; which makes me wonder if the Stormtroopers on Endor
in ROTJ were 100% clones, chosen for their ultimate reliability to
Palpatine...

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-05-19 04:08pm

I thought the movie was great, not as good as it could have been, but still great. The action sequences, Yoda/Palpatine and Anakin/Obi especially. I was also quite impressed by the acting. Ian Macdarmid definately carried the film, but Ewan and too my suprise even Hayden did quite well too. Even Padme had a few good lines, but her overall performance was weak. I really enjoyed the ending sequence was great, and the Opera scene was one if not the best acting interplays in the saga.

Favorite Parts: Yoda/Palaptine Fight, Opera Scene

Worst Parts: Early romatic moments, to some extent the opening (the BD's voices were a bit too goofy for my taste.

Overall Rating: 9.4, tied with RotJ for third after ANH and ESB.

(As a side note, even though I was thrilled at being able to see the movie at the midnight showing, the crowd there was way over the top. For instance, when Padme revealed she was pregnant in the beginning, half the crowd spontaneously did a Jerry Springer-esque "No she didnt!" jeer. WTF? WTF?)

Kamakazie Sith · Post by **Kamakazie Sith** » 2005-05-19 04:12pm

Joe wrote:I don't see what's wrong with the theory. It's certainly far superior than any other theory I've yet heard presented.

You mean the canon statement that the force created him? While I do think that is also lame, the idea that Palpatine created Anakin is far worse.

McC · Post by **McC** » 2005-05-19 04:14pm

Kamakazie Sith wrote:You mean the canon statement that the force created him? While I do think that is also lame, the idea that Palpatine created Anakin is far worse.

The Force can be twisted to another's will...another like Palpatine. You have to be dense as shit to not pick up on the subtext of that scene.

Superman · Post by **Superman** » 2005-05-19 04:18pm

Kamakazie Sith wrote:
Joe wrote:I don't see what's wrong with the theory. It's certainly far superior than any other theory I've yet heard presented.
You mean the canon statement that the force created him? While I do think that is also lame, the idea that Palpatine created Anakin is far worse.

All the clues are there, moron. Read between the lines.

Yeah, we get it. It doesn't match up to what you want it to be so it's wrong.

Kamakazie Sith · Post by **Kamakazie Sith** » 2005-05-19 04:21pm

Superman wrote:
Kamakazie Sith wrote:
VT-16 wrote: That will be debated till the end of time.
I don't see why. There's no indication at all that Palpatine created Anakin. As far as Palpatine is concerned he didn't know about Anakin till The Phantom Menace. Only people who like to stretch theories based off vague similarities will be debating this issue till the end of time, for me there is no debate at all.

Honestly, it's a lame theory.
Nah, you're lame. The clues are all there. Boy has no father, Palpy seems to be watching him since Ep 1 and Palpy mentions to Anakin later that there is a power that can create life... CREATE life through mitochloreans (sp). How the hell was Anakin made? This could explain it. Paply is the master at pulling strings behind the scenes, he could have had this planned since day one.

I know those who are fanboys of Palpy would like to believe he engineered this entire thing from day one, but there is no indication that he even knew of Anakin's existence.

The clues are there, please. As long as you like grasping at straws, sure. You take an unverifiable claim from Palpy, and construed it to say that Palpatine has this power then you reach to tie him and Anakin together without any evidence supporting that Palpy ever made contact with Shmi Skywalker.

Then to top it off George Lucas doesn't even touch upon it, and since when has George Lucas left little surprises like this out? He LOVES stuff like that, yet he left it out? I don't think so.

This theory stinks of fanboyishness.

Kamakazie Sith · Post by **Kamakazie Sith** » 2005-05-19 04:22pm

McC wrote:
Kamakazie Sith wrote:You mean the canon statement that the force created him? While I do think that is also lame, the idea that Palpatine created Anakin is far worse.
The Force can be twisted to another's will...another like Palpatine. You have to be dense as shit to not pick up on the subtext of that scene.

Give me a fucking break. They aren't tied together at all, and you're ignoring the fact that Palpy never made any indication that Anakin existed.

Kamakazie Sith · Post by **Kamakazie Sith** » 2005-05-19 04:23pm

Superman wrote:
Kamakazie Sith wrote:
Joe wrote:I don't see what's wrong with the theory. It's certainly far superior than any other theory I've yet heard presented.
You mean the canon statement that the force created him? While I do think that is also lame, the idea that Palpatine created Anakin is far worse.
All the clues are there, moron. Read between the lines.

Yeah, we get it. It doesn't match up to what you want it to be so it's wrong.

What you call "clues" I call reaching very far to explain a fanboyish fantasy. Unless you have something that can tie them together besides vague references to powers that we don't even know if Palpy has at that time, then it's nothing but pure fanboyish speculation.

Butterbean569 · Post by **Butterbean569** » 2005-05-19 05:06pm

Vader: "If you're not with me, then you're my enemy"

Obi-Wan: "Only the Sith deal in black and white"

Anyone else think that was a shot at Bush?

As soon as Vader said that I was like....didn't Bush say that?

Dahak · Post by **Dahak** » 2005-05-19 05:11pm

So I just watched it.
It was a nice movie, clearly an improvement over the first two ones.
CGI was good, it had almost no slow scenes and moved quickly ahead. The scenes after order 66 is executed almost brought tears to my eyes, the music fitted it very well.
R2D2 is a very fitting comic relief. And Yoda and the Red Guards was just funny

The Bad...
While his acting did improve fantastically, the love scene in the first third did almost reach the cringe-inducing levels of AotC. Sometimes the acting was a bit too wooden, and sometimes, especially when Palpatine names Vader, it was just way over the top (That got quite some chuckles from the audience...).
The fight between Palpatine and Windu was...underwhelming. Mostly because of McDiarmid. He seemed stilted, unnatural. And for someone who was supposedly a master of a kick-ass fighting style, Windu didn't impress me, either. It was all in all, a boring fight.

And a question: As Yoda and Obi-Wan are in the temple at the end, Obi-Wan speaks of the "Emperor". How was he to know about the Empire when the very senate meeting was at the same time? And why does he speak of him later on in the scene with Padme as the Chancellor?

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2005-05-19 05:27pm

Jez-us, the battle with Windu is meant to be a bloody stalemate until Anakin comes in, sees what is (or isn't) happening and then Windu is bitchslapped. How hard is this to get? As far as it goes, it shows how good Palpy is at laying down the law and I don't see any bad points here.

Superman · Post by **Superman** » 2005-05-19 05:32pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:Jez-us, the battle with Windu is meant to be a bloody stalemate until Anakin comes in, sees what is (or isn't) happening and then Windu is bitchslapped. How hard is this to get? As far as it goes, it shows how good Palpy is at laying down the law and I don't see any bad points here.

Palpy was setting that up to turn Anakin, me thinks.

Here's something though, how did Palpatine know about Anakin's wife and her impending death? Precog?

Also, how did he know that Vader force choked her and "killed her," as he told Anakin. He seems to have all the dirt on what's been going on. Is that the precog ability?

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2005-05-19 05:36pm

Superman wrote:
Palpy was setting that up to turn Anakin, me thinks.

As I have repeatedly stated.

Here's something though, how did Palpatine know about Anakin's wife and her impending death? Precog?

Also, how did he know that Vader force choked her and "killed her," as he told Anakin. He seems to have all the dirt on what's been going on. Is that the precog ability?

Since Yoda evidently knew something bad was going on instantly, it can only be attributed to feeling the Force effects. Using a power like a Dark Side Force choke would probably be immediately detectable to a pro like Palpy.

Vendetta · Post by **Vendetta** » 2005-05-19 05:38pm

Well, I came.

Dahak · Post by **Dahak** » 2005-05-19 05:43pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:Jez-us, the battle with Windu is meant to be a bloody stalemate until Anakin comes in, sees what is (or isn't) happening and then Windu is bitchslapped. How hard is this to get? As far as it goes, it shows how good Palpy is at laying down the law and I don't see any bad points here.

What it is meant to be and what it did look like are two things to me.
Maybe McDiarmid was just too old, but it just did not feel like a fight, be it stalemate or whatever, it looked like Jackson was doing a little practise with McDiarmid, all slow, easy so that no one gets hurt...
Especially after one has read the part from the book, which does not fit with what I saw in the movie somehow.

Tinkerbell · Post by **Tinkerbell** » 2005-05-19 05:45pm

Ok guys -- let's be honest. How many of you wanked during/directly after the movie?

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2005-05-19 05:48pm

Dahak wrote: What it is meant to be and what it did look like are two things to me.
Maybe McDiarmid was just too old, but it just did not feel like a fight, be it stalemate or whatever, it looked like Jackson was doing a little practise with McDiarmid, all slow, easy so that no one gets hurt...
Especially after one has read the part from the book, which does not fit with what I saw in the movie somehow.

The movie is however the higher canon, so that is readily explained. Additionally, the quick way Palpy dispatches the Jedi flanking Mace shows he was really keeping him as a nice illustrative point for Anakin who would soon turn up he felt. It was a brilliant set-up and Anakin evidently looked lost when he saw how he'd been tricked.

Superman · Post by **Superman** » 2005-05-19 05:50pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:
Dahak wrote: What it is meant to be and what it did look like are two things to me.
Maybe McDiarmid was just too old, but it just did not feel like a fight, be it stalemate or whatever, it looked like Jackson was doing a little practise with McDiarmid, all slow, easy so that no one gets hurt...
Especially after one has read the part from the book, which does not fit with what I saw in the movie somehow.
The movie is however the higher canon, so that is readily explained. Additionally, the quick way Palpy dispatches the Jedi flanking Mace shows he was really keeping him as a nice illustrative point for Anakin who would soon turn up he felt. It was a brilliant set-up and Anakin evidently looked lost when he saw how he'd been tricked.

I think we can also all agree that Yoda is greater than Mace. Palpy stalemated Yoda, so I don't know how Mace could have out skilled Palpy.

Dahak · Post by **Dahak** » 2005-05-19 05:50pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:
Dahak wrote: What it is meant to be and what it did look like are two things to me.
Maybe McDiarmid was just too old, but it just did not feel like a fight, be it stalemate or whatever, it looked like Jackson was doing a little practise with McDiarmid, all slow, easy so that no one gets hurt...
Especially after one has read the part from the book, which does not fit with what I saw in the movie somehow.
The movie is however the higher canon, so that is readily explained. Additionally, the quick way Palpy dispatches the Jedi flanking Mace shows he was really keeping him as a nice illustrative point for Anakin who would soon turn up he felt. It was a brilliant set-up and Anakin evidently looked lost when he saw how he'd been tricked.

It still looked visually underwhelming, after this fight had been somewhat hyped...
After this whole Vapaad-thing and how super-fast it was supposed to be it looked...slooooow...
I much prefered the Yoda/Palpatine fight. That one was fun to watch.

aerius · Post by **aerius** » 2005-05-19 05:59pm

Padme's pregnancy. Goddamnit, haven't you heard of birth control? Or at least have Anakin use the force to pull his sperm back out after doing the deed. Or just use the damn morning after pill. How hard could it be?

Other than that and the awkward Anakin/Padme moments where I felt like slapping some sense into them it was a kick ass movie.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2005-05-19 06:01pm

Probably because Mace is simply no match for Palpatine. He had the kid gloves on. Now, Yoda was something of a fight, but Yoda disengaged and ran away. If that doesn't show you how absolutely lethal Palpatine is, I don't know what does. People probably assumed he was frail and needed Vader as a bodyguard in RotJ, but his powers are not in doubt. He simply got too over-confident in the end.

Andrew J. · Post by **Andrew J.** » 2005-05-19 06:13pm

Superman wrote:Nah, you're lame. The clues are all there. Boy has no father, Palpy seems to be watching him since Ep 1 and Palpy mentions to Anakin later that there is a power that can create life... CREATE life through mitochloreans (sp). How the hell was Anakin made? This could explain it. Paply is the master at pulling strings behind the scenes, he could have had this planned since day one.

He also said Darth Plagus was the only one who had ever mastered that power.

Superman · Post by **Superman** » 2005-05-19 06:18pm

Andrew J. wrote:
Superman wrote:Nah, you're lame. The clues are all there. Boy has no father, Palpy seems to be watching him since Ep 1 and Palpy mentions to Anakin later that there is a power that can create life... CREATE life through mitochloreans (sp). How the hell was Anakin made? This could explain it. Paply is the master at pulling strings behind the scenes, he could have had this planned since day one.
He also said Darth Plagus was the only one who had ever mastered that power.

True. Could Plagus have been Palpy's master though?

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2005-05-19 06:21pm

Superman wrote:
Andrew J. wrote:
Superman wrote:Nah, you're lame. The clues are all there. Boy has no father, Palpy seems to be watching him since Ep 1 and Palpy mentions to Anakin later that there is a power that can create life... CREATE life through mitochloreans (sp). How the hell was Anakin made? This could explain it. Paply is the master at pulling strings behind the scenes, he could have had this planned since day one.
He also said Darth Plagus was the only one who had ever mastered that power.
True. Could Plagus have been Palpy's master though?

He said that Plagus was the only one who mastered the ability of keeping people alive. It's not clear if he was the only one who mastered the ability to create life (if that's even possible--Palpatine may have been bullshitting about both abilities, or either one), since when he talks about them during the Opera scene he refers to them as two separate abilities.