Tears of Palpatine's Essay on the Chiss

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-18 03:48pm

Xizor was able to find out who Luke was.

Thrawn knew precisely who Luke was, and given his ability to dig up information like the Caamas document, and others, I wouldn't put it past him. Never the less, I'm not sure.

But its a nitpick that doesn't affect the overall conclusion that Thrawn was not a very good strategist or statesman.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-04-18 03:56pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote:R
Also, the Spaarti cylinder bit should've allowed Thrawn to cook up a stable clone of C'boath and terminate the whacko one. And all he needed to do was send a slug into Organa and mind-copy her and take samples from the fetii and her.

It takes Ten years to grow a clone that isn't whacko. And using the
ysalimiri bit won't work. Great, you've just vat-grown a jedi master...who
can't use the force!

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-04-18 04:02pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote: How about a plan that doesn't take 10 years and result in the wasting of what was left of the Empire? Even Thrawn couldn't have won by that point. If he had Spaarti cylinders, he should've had one ready to clone him immediately if he died.

*sputters*

It takes TEN FUCKING YEARS to make a non-whacko
clone who has all their marbles! You can't screw with that except by using
ysalamari, and that cuts out the Force, making them lose that "intuition"
so needed in a higher commander.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-18 04:07pm

MKSheppard wrote:
Illuminatus Primus wrote:R
Also, the Spaarti cylinder bit should've allowed Thrawn to cook up a stable clone of C'boath and terminate the whacko one. And all he needed to do was send a slug into Organa and mind-copy her and take samples from the fetii and her.

It takes Ten years to grow a clone that isn't whacko. And using the
ysalimiri bit won't work. Great, you've just vat-grown a jedi master...who
can't use the force!

Prove this shit. When is it ever stated that a rapid-growth clone won't be able to use the Force because it isn't exposed early on?

It takes 1 year to grow a clone that doesn't have clone madness w/out ysalamiri.

MKSheppard wrote:*sputters*

It takes TEN FUCKING YEARS to make a non-whacko
clone who has all their marbles! You can't screw with that except by using
ysalamari, and that cuts out the Force, making them lose that "intuition"
so needed in a higher commander.

What the fuck?

Hello everyone. Welcome to Debating 101. How about a case of a classic Unjustified Assumption?

The ysalamiri was neccessary ONLY because rapidly-grown Spaarti clones are driven insane by the "pressure" caused by so many nearly-identical minds being rapidly grown in such close proximity. The ysalamiri simply shields them from that.

Luke says the cylinder is on a timer of 10 years. This does not mean that it took 10 years to grow Thrawn's clone. I've never seen anything that indicates that Thrawn's or anyone's tactical prowess has diddly shit to do with the Force.

ALL of your assumptions are DIRECTLY contradicted by the VERY EXISTANCE of Major Tierce. He was a clone with both Force sensitivity (his template was a Royal Guardsman, all of which are Force sensitive) and he had Thrawn's tactical genius mixed into his flash-imprint. He was grown in less than a month.

All of Palpatine's clones were rapid-grown. They were VERY Force sensitive.

consequences · Post by **consequences** » 2003-04-18 09:36pm

All of Palpatines clones also probably had any personality in them wiped out by Palpy as a matter of course as soon as they were created.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-19 12:46pm

Does not matter--he said fast growth would prevent them from being Force sensitive--which the clones were.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2003-04-21 10:08pm

While I agree that the Chiss are militarily insignificant,I disagree with the precept that the Chiss must practise eugenics.

Recall that the only uniformity that is listed is a blue skin tone,jet black hair and red eyes.This could be nothing more unusual than a species wide trait.Certainly,we seen this before.For example,"pure" Mongloid stock usually have black hair and a certain bone structure.

Certainly,eons of isolation could produce such a racial distinction.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-21 10:16pm

Eons of isolation in small low-tech populations cause distinct uniformity. We're talking about a race that's been around for 1000s of years, and moved across whole systems.

There's no proof for eugenics, no. But I'd hardly put it past the blue Stalinists.

His Divine Shadow · Post by **His Divine Shadow** » 2003-04-22 07:42am

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Ad hominem dismissal of ideas not pallatable to you. You're not going to even consider it? Your logic is quite flawed here.

Nah, you've made your point better than him and you don't seem to mentally unstable.

His Divine Shadow · Post by **His Divine Shadow** » 2003-04-22 07:43am

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Eons of isolation in small low-tech populations cause distinct uniformity. We're talking about a race that's been around for 1000s of years, and moved across whole systems.

True, but they live in highly artificial buildings that mimick their enviroments.

Publius · Post by **Publius** » 2003-04-22 02:12pm

His Divine Shadow wrote:
Illuminatus Primus wrote:Ad hominem dismissal of ideas not pallatable to you. You're not going to even consider it? Your logic is quite flawed here.
Nah, you've made your point better than him and you don't seem to mentally unstable.

Out of idle curiosity, what in particular makes you think he is mentally unstable?

Publius

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2003-04-22 02:21pm

Publius wrote:
His Divine Shadow wrote:
Illuminatus Primus wrote:Ad hominem dismissal of ideas not pallatable to you. You're not going to even consider it? Your logic is quite flawed here.
Nah, you've made your point better than him and you don't seem to mentally unstable.
Out of idle curiosity, what in particular makes you think he is mentally unstable?

Publius

Well, the name "Tears of Palpatine" is quite a tip-off

His Divine Shadow · Post by **His Divine Shadow** » 2003-04-22 04:34pm

Publius wrote:Out of idle curiosity, what in particular makes you think he is mentally unstable?

Well maybe thats an exxageration but he's definitly getting too emotional over a fictional universe, to the point that he was actively trying to find excuses to attack them(namely that whole eugenics thing, which was really stupid).

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2003-04-24 11:15am

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Eons of isolation in small low-tech populations cause distinct uniformity. We're talking about a race that's been around for 1000s of years, and moved across whole systems.

There's no proof for eugenics, no. But I'd hardly put it past the blue Stalinists.

So?Assuming that a significant level of terraforming technology exists to create a semi-uniformity in planetary environments,there isn't anything to suggest why the uniformity of skin tone and hair colour shouldn't stay.

After all,Southern Chinese,despite having migrated to other nations as far back as 3 centuries ago still retain the basic yellow skin tone and black hair of their kind,along with the basic bone structure difference against the Northern Chinese.