Hapan Nova Cruiser's at the Battle of Endor ?!?

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-08-25 03:16pm

StarshipTitanic wrote:
Rogue 9 wrote:No they aren't. If I wasn't on a lab comp I'd download the high res and circle it for you, but I can't. The side view is just a tad off, and if you look to the right side of the front section you can see a second protrusion emerging from behind the one facing us on both ships.

Edit: There's a second pair of Nebulon Bs directly below the Mon Cal that's to the left of the Falcon, and they look like standards. Are they what you were looking at? Because I'm looking at the pair to the right of the Mon Cal and just below the Falcon.
If you look closely at the larger picture, you'll notice the same effect you think is the double hull extending to the very bow of the ship. That's because the very tip is also "unplated."

Nope, sorry. What I'm seeing is protruding to the bow of the ship; what you're talking about juts out towards the stern.

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2004-08-25 03:22pm

Rogue 9 wrote: Nope, sorry. What I'm seeing is protruding to the bow of the ship; what you're talking about juts out towards the stern.

What are you talking about "towards the stern."

All four of those Nebulon shots are the same shot repeated four times. There are many examples of this in this image, like the five TIE Fighters at the bottom and the other Rebel capital ships. The only difference is that the gray forwardmost parts of the hull on the lower two Nebulons blends into the darker clouds of Endor while the upper two sharply contrast to the bright, white clouds.

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2004-08-25 03:29pm

I hate to point out the obvious, but the Neb 2s and the Hapan ships did not exist at the time, as either models, or much less concepts. This assumption that these ships are somehow designs seen years later in video games and the EU, as opposed to simply being known models filmed against a blue screen at long range, is downright absurd.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-08-25 03:31pm

Yeah. I'm talking about one of these.

I'll also throw these two in there, even though they're pure fanwank, just because they look cool.

But anyway, the first one is what I think we're seeing.

Edit: Okay, apparently direct linking to pics on the site is not allowed. Go here; the relevant pic is the second thumbnail.

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2004-08-25 03:31pm

Wicked Pilot wrote:I hate to point out the obvious, but the Neb 2s and the Hapan ships did not exist at the time, as either models, or much less concepts. This assumption that these ships are somehow designs seen years later in video games and the EU, as opposed to simply being known models filmed against a blue screen at long range, is downright absurd.

I was going to point this out myself, but I didn't want to get jumped by "suspension of disbelief" people...

Bob the Gunslinger · Post by **Bob the Gunslinger** » 2004-08-25 04:33pm

Rogue 9 wrote:
StarshipTitanic wrote:
No, you're seeing the darker parts of the hull and the lighter, narrower part that's flat hull plating.
No, I'm seeing the reason why Crix thought they were Hapan Novas. The front (which he thought was the Nova's rear) is split, like a Mark 2, making them resemble reversed Novas from a distance. You only see a little bit of the starboard hull protrusion because it's a side view, but they're not perfectly perpendicular to the camera angle and you can make out the second protrusion.

It looks like a normal N-B to me. I seriously think that you are confusing the darker horizontal protrusions from the bottom of the front hull or a second vertical protrusion. Those really are just N-Bs.

And if you think about it, why would Lucas build a model of a split-hulled N-B--a model we have never seen outside of the movies, ever--only to show it for just a split second in the most confused, busy space shot in the whole movie? Why would he go through the work and then just waste that ship? It is a model: if it moves onscreen that means that they filmed it with a motion-control camera.
I think you're just misinterpreting what you are seeing.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-08-25 04:37pm

a model we have never seen outside of the movies, ever

Yes we have. TIE Fighter. X-Wing: Alliance. References in the X-Wing books, IIRC.

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2004-08-25 04:44pm

Rogue 9 wrote:
a model we have never seen outside of the movies, ever
Yes we have. TIE Fighter. X-Wing: Alliance. References in the X-Wing books, IIRC.

I think he meant, why would Lucas have a totally unique ship on the scale of the original Neb model built for a piddling background shot for one, brief scene?

Another example of why it isn't something invented twenty years later for a game: Look at the engine section. The double-hulled Nebulons have a sort of staircase arrangement to their engine nozzles, producing quite a different look. The shot of the Nebulon-B is in profile (or near-profile as you think), so it should show up prominantly, except it doesn't.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-08-25 04:50pm

Bleh. I forgot about that in my search for a double hull. Been a while since I've played TIE Fighter. I guess that makes the shot I found a fan-created hybrid, then, and therefore not valid. But that still looks like a double hull.

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2004-08-25 04:53pm

Rogue 9 wrote:But that still looks like a double hull.

Probably because the cylinder I was talking about earlier looks like the tip of the alleged hull.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-08-25 04:56pm

Which brings us back to the cylinder facing the wrong way for it to be that. *Confusion*

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2004-08-25 04:58pm

Rogue 9 wrote:Which brings us back to the cylinder facing the wrong way for it to be that. *Confusion*

It's far darker than the rest of the hull, so it wouldn't blend into the cloud cover like most of the other features.

Lex · Post by **Lex** » 2004-08-25 05:02pm

well the left one definitly looks like a nebulan for me, but the the right one looks a bit different so i dunno... by no way a mark 2 IMO

EDIT: reminds me a lot of klingon warbirds

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2004-08-25 05:02pm

Rogue 9 wrote:But that still looks like a double hull.

That is because you are a moron. [/Mario Strativarius]

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2004-08-25 05:51pm

Jordie wrote:It might be this. A Flurry escort carrier.
Funky ship

EDIT: But, yeah, could be the Neb-B, silly me.

This would make sense given the ease with which the Flurry was made ready for the Bakura mission.

The Cleric · Post by **The Cleric** » 2004-08-25 06:38pm

N-B's have symmetrical narrowing. Those jump up toawrds the bulge.

Chardok · Post by **Chardok** » 2004-08-25 06:50pm

Dudes, COME ON, you can't possibly be serious! Those are SO not NEB's, man! LOOK AT IT, for crissakes! Zoom in on it! It's TOTALLY a carracks with cloud abnormalities. Or the horribly out of scale B-wings!

The Cleric · Post by **The Cleric** » 2004-08-25 06:54pm

If it's Carracks, then it's 4 Carracks all with perfectly identical could anomolis behind htem.

Chardok · Post by **Chardok** » 2004-08-25 06:59pm

StormTrooperTR889 wrote:If it's Carracks, then it's 4 Carracks all with perfectly identical could anomolis behind htem.

Could be shadows, man...carracks ain't small!

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2004-08-25 07:02pm

I'm not sure myself. I can't really make out what they are. They look like Nebulon-B's but its hard to tell. I can't see them ver well but of course m eyesight isn't the greatest. it wouls be nice if they were Nova cruisers though.

Bob the Gunslinger · Post by **Bob the Gunslinger** » 2004-08-25 07:27pm

Rogue 9 wrote:
a model we have never seen outside of the movies, ever
Yes we have. TIE Fighter. X-Wing: Alliance. References in the X-Wing books, IIRC.

That is not a studio model built to be filmed in ROTJ using a bluescreen and a motion-control camera, is it? We can find pictures of all of the OT studio models and even the concept models and none of them are an N-B 2. It did not exist in 1983.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2004-08-25 07:31pm

Bob the Gunslinger wrote:
Rogue 9 wrote:
a model we have never seen outside of the movies, ever
Yes we have. TIE Fighter. X-Wing: Alliance. References in the X-Wing books, IIRC.
That is not a studio model built to be filmed in ROTJ using a bluescreen and a motion-control camera, is it? We can find pictures of all of the OT studio models and even the concept models and none of them are an N-B 2. It did not exist in 1983.

So them, was it added by ILM artists that loved the EU during the making of the Special Edition trilogy?

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2004-08-25 07:36pm

JME2 wrote:So them, was it added by ILM artists that loved the EU during the making of the Special Edition trilogy?

Nobody loves the Neb 2, it's an unorigional peice of crap. But if that's your theory then go get us a screen cap form the origional movie and show us the missing ships.

Bob the Gunslinger · Post by **Bob the Gunslinger** » 2004-08-25 07:52pm

That's from the special edition? I thought it was from the original edition...

nightmare · Post by **nightmare** » 2004-08-25 09:30pm

Looks exactly like Nebulon-B profiles.