Light side powers and Dark side powers

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-10-13 01:51am

Stark wrote:Hey, you'll never see me supporting the RPGS.

I'm annoyed the movies never had anyone in armour get hit with force lightning: it'd be good to establish if it's some kind of DET or mystical soul-raping.

But...
Vader was in armor.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2005-10-13 01:52am

D'OH! Erm.. it was black, and all cybernetic? *continues grasping*

Ar-Adunakhor · Post by **Ar-Adunakhor** » 2005-10-13 02:04am

Dooku does it to Obi Wan in RotS.

He did? I thought he was more picked up and slammed into a bulkhead or wall, and then had the landing TKed down onto him.

If he did in fact get taken down purely due to a Force Choke that would undoubtably put a damper on my theory there. Even if he was crushed purely with the force, though, I seem to remember another thread that said something about Palpatine's shroud being extremely potent in the room during that fight. That could be a reason for his defeat in that instance, because if his ability to use the force was severely hampered it would certianly lower his resistance to being Force Choked.

Stuart Mackey · Post by **Stuart Mackey** » 2005-10-13 02:24am

Ar-Adunakhor wrote:
Dooku does it to Obi Wan in RotS.
He did? I thought he was more picked up and slammed into a bulkhead or wall, and then had the landing TKed down onto him.

If he did in fact get taken down purely due to a Force Choke that would undoubtably put a damper on my theory there.snip.

Choked, then thrown about.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2005-10-13 10:14am

Yeah. I'm glad we finally saw lightsaber to stormtrooper armor contact.

Another thing I've been wondering about lately is "Jedi toughness." We've all seen and several have commented on how Jedi seem to be able to take some damage before going down, especially in ROTS with the Jedi who take multiple blaster hits as they go down.

Whether this is just a case of overkill (compare damage to Imperial Officers getting hit in the chest in ANH, especially pre-SE's) or perhaps thick "blaster proof clothes" (a continuously mentioned convention in the VD's for example but never mentioned onscreen) I wonder. I mean, do we need to assume it's some kind of Force powered damage reduction (a la Force Protection in Jedi Outcast/Academy, heh)? Sure we know Jedi can somehow protect themselves with the Force from certain environmental factors (great example: surfing on lava flows without being incinerated), but still...

The Dooku force combo on Obi-Wan thing is rather subtle. I missed it (the choking part) the first time I saw the movie as well!

Post by **NecronLord** » 2005-10-13 11:09am

Stark wrote:I hate to be the anti-fanboy, but is there even a reason to use lightning beyond 'lookz t3h kewl' and 'I hate you and I want you to suffer'? I mean, in most SW games you can SHOOT 98% of your enemies. TK works just as good for killing people, and sabres and even absorb lightning! It's got huge penalties and no real advanatages that I can see. Sure, if you're a brutal, twisted dark side kinda guy, you'd use it because you enjoy hearing screams, or to taunt a fallen enemy, but we've seen how USELESS it is in combat against anyone decent.

In the JK games it can't be blocked, mainly because the first was made before that was known to be possible in the canon. It's also possible that most jedi can't do that. Obi-Wan and Mace are both very good, after all.

And, on the opposite side, Jerec, in Jedi Knight, is able to use the highest ranked light-side power.

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2005-10-13 12:22pm

NecronLord wrote:
Stark wrote:I hate to be the anti-fanboy, but is there even a reason to use lightning beyond 'lookz t3h kewl' and 'I hate you and I want you to suffer'? I mean, in most SW games you can SHOOT 98% of your enemies. TK works just as good for killing people, and sabres and even absorb lightning! It's got huge penalties and no real advanatages that I can see. Sure, if you're a brutal, twisted dark side kinda guy, you'd use it because you enjoy hearing screams, or to taunt a fallen enemy, but we've seen how USELESS it is in combat against anyone decent.
In the JK games it can't be blocked, mainly because the first was made before that was known to be possible in the canon. It's also possible that most jedi can't do that. Obi-Wan and Mace are both very good, after all.

And, on the opposite side, Jerec, in Jedi Knight, is able to use the highest ranked light-side power.

What do you mean that regen thing he does in the tower when you hurt him enough? I'm afraid that is him drawing on the power of the vallay to heal himself.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2005-10-13 06:56pm

NecronLord wrote:
Stark wrote:I hate to be the anti-fanboy, but is there even a reason to use lightning beyond 'lookz t3h kewl' and 'I hate you and I want you to suffer'? I mean, in most SW games you can SHOOT 98% of your enemies. TK works just as good for killing people, and sabres and even absorb lightning! It's got huge penalties and no real advanatages that I can see. Sure, if you're a brutal, twisted dark side kinda guy, you'd use it because you enjoy hearing screams, or to taunt a fallen enemy, but we've seen how USELESS it is in combat against anyone decent.
In the JK games it can't be blocked, mainly because the first was made before that was known to be possible in the canon. It's also possible that most jedi can't do that. Obi-Wan and Mace are both very good, after all.

And, on the opposite side, Jerec, in Jedi Knight, is able to use the highest ranked light-side power.

Lightning can be blocked by Absorb in all the JK games that feature it. It still has a purpose, other than shooting, because you can use it regardless of what guns you have (or lack) and regardless of ammo. In JK1/MotS it did direct damage to health, skipping shields which could also be beneficial. Of course in JK2/JA they changed it so that shields absorb damage (rather than just reducing it like in JK1/MotS), so you have to have your shields depleted first before you start losing health (only a few rare things do direct health damage anymore). Lightning in JK2/JA had the benefit of being able to strike multiple opponents.

MotS gave you Chain Lightning, but it was a targetted power. So if you couldn't see them or get a lock, you couldn't use it. In JK2/JA you can just fire it like a gun and hit multiple targets, plus in JA you get the "two handed" option for double damage (if you lack a saber of course!).

Plus in any of the games if you got a Dark Surge/Force Surge (JK1/MotS respectively) or Force Boon (JK2 & JA) you could really throw some sparks around.

FOG3 · Post by **FOG3** » 2005-10-13 09:03pm

Kurgan wrote: I mean, do we need to assume it's some kind of Force powered damage reduction (a la Force Protection in Jedi Outcast/Academy, heh)? Sure we know Jedi can somehow protect themselves with the Force from certain environmental factors (great example: surfing on lava flows without being incinerated), but still...

Well there is this one KOTOR Force power called Energy Resistance.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2005-10-14 05:43am

I know damage reduction through the Force is proven in the games, as I cited the JK series.

I'm just wondering if that's the only possible (or most likely) explanation of what we see in the movies!

It could be, its just people make fun of us for using "the Force" as the answer to "every" ambiguity, logical problem or bit of unrealism in Star Wars, heh...

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2005-10-14 06:28am

Stuart Mackey wrote:
Lord Pounder wrote:
Stuart Mackey wrote: Its explained in the novel that he does not kill the Gamorrean guards.
And IIRC even lightly choking the guard was close to the darkside.

snip.
Novel does not say so. Nor does the movie.

I think it was in one of the EU books, the HTTE Trilogy.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2005-10-14 06:46am

Doesn't he kill the Gammoreans later by hacking them up with his lightsaber?

Or were these the two patricular Gammoreans, Groktar (who jumped ship and joined the Rebellion) and Boklos (who shot himself in the foot to avoid combat, won the Hutt lotto, married a twi'lek barmaid and became a Senator, dying at the age of 165, after having 16 children)?*

*Tales from The Unimportant Extras