Degrees of wankage (Crimson Empire spoilers)

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Post by Crazedwraith »

Lord Poe wrote:
DEATH wrote:Luke might be better at non combat skills same as Yoda but Kyle is apparently a better straight up fighter, (As Windu was), doesn't mean he would beat Luke in a no holds barred fight,
No, not Kyle. Corran (Mary Sue) HORN can beat Luke n a no holds barred fight. (I, Jedi)
Your obviously reading a different version of I, Jedi. The only reason Luke loses that fight is becuase he's not trying and is being a whiny bitch about the Dark side. Added to this is Corran using hth techniques, Luke's presumbly not used to.

Also its a sparring match not a fight there is a difference. For example while sparring at karate, I've had to back away from 10 year olds half my size. Not becuase I can't beat the crap out of them but because I either have back away or actually hit them hard.

The same thing can happen here, its possible Luke only gets hit in the fight becuase its either that or bisecting Corran. WHich is not something he wants to do.

Later in the book its shows Luke ripping through Jenesarii like nobodies buisness, a feat Corran knows he could never do.
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Post by The Grim Squeaker »

Corran says that Luke didn't even need him against the 5-6 Jensaari, when Corran could barely beat 1-2 and knew he was going to die against 5-6.
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Post by Illuminatus Primus »

DEATH wrote:
Vympel wrote: And there is no EU guy better than Luke. KJA can go fuck himself.
I don't understand the problem with a Jedi with almost as much experience as Luke and who has tapped into a massive power locus being a better fighter than Luke (Weaponsmaster of the NJO).
Luke might be better at non combat skills same as Yoda but Kyle is apparently a better straight up fighter, (As Windu was), doesn't mean he would beat Luke in a no holds barred fight, the games cut scenes seem to make Luke out as more dangerous over all even if in game:
Kyle boss>Kyle tutor>Desann>Luke>Tavion(New)>Tavion (old)
In-game mechanics exist to make the game interesting and hard for the player. For fuck's sake, Luke Skywalker has defeated both Lord Darth Vader and Emperor Palpatine - at Force Storm ability strength - in single combat.
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Post by Illuminatus Primus »

Chris OFarrell wrote:No. World Devatators are wank.

Huge glorified factories which somehow are able to defeat line warships in slugfests. Then spit out droid fighters which are now completly leathal to human pilots...planatery defence ion cannons don't even annoy them...

Then later fighter squadrons attacking them manage to punch through and cause damange, but Star Destroyers still can't. I mean it just boggles the mind. The Imperials didn;t have a large fleet screening the World Devestators and the NR fleet came out of hyperspace all guns blazing, taking out many of the ships including the Alleigence.

Then the World Devestators activate their OMG Ti3 Dr0n3s and the Rebel fleet is cut appart. Then instead of doing something like calling for reinforcements and concentrating firepower, Mon Mothma declares their only hope is to find Skywalker and use his '1337 jedi powers' to somehow pull a victory.

It's just....ARG.
Excuse you? The World Devestators were all much more massive than the largest capital ships that fought in the Battle of Calamari, and thus had greater reactor and shield dissipation wells to draw from. Its not surprising they were able to shit-kick the Mon Calamari cruisers and ISDs.

At no point to starfighters successfully damage the World Devestators. At one point General Antilles mistakes Silencer-7 self-destructing to success on the part of his forces.
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Post by The Grim Squeaker »

Illuminatus Primus wrote: In-game mechanics exist to make the game interesting and hard for the player. For fuck's sake, Luke Skywalker has defeated both Lord Darth Vader and Emperor Palpatine - at Force Storm ability strength - in single combat.
Actually Palaptine beat him despite being disoriented.
Also game mechanics are a shaky argument since in academy you can't fight Luke, and you also can't in Jedi Academy.
Like I said, I think that the relation is as that between Mace and Yoda:
out of battle Yoda is immeasurably stronger and can defeat stronger foes overall (Although he did barely lose against Sidious by sheer chance, although it's arguable if Sidious went all out against Mace Before losing his saber), but in a straight fight or against weaker foes Mace is/was more overwhelming, and had better techniques.
but as you said despite beating the nigh-omnipotent Jerrec Before becoming a jedi master, defeating Desann who had gained a boost from the valley of the jedi and from the force nexus beneath the Jedi/Massassi temple etc...
In a straight up fight game mechanics aside (Kyle ahving better combat powers, more health and styles than Luke), Kyle seemed to defer to Luke as the master of the order, but Kyle Was the battlemaster of the order kile Mace was.
In short, against weaker or mass foes or fair duels Kyle is a better fighter/tactician, but Luke is the greater Jedi and has a (arguably) better record against superior foes using the dark side.

The problem with World destroyers in my opinion is that fact that a mobile factory ignoring the combined firepower of most of the rebel fleet without effect is wank, even the Executors shields buckled against the far weaker Rebel ships at Endor.
If they were explicitly stated to focus most of their mass on shielding it would be easier to "swallow", although the part where they satrt to eat Rebel ships is going too far in my opinion.
Hoiw large/long were the destroyers compared to the Executor? I may be confusing the size differences :?
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Post by NecronLord »

DEATH wrote:I don't understand the problem with a Jedi with almost as much experience as Luke and who has tapped into a massive power locus being a better fighter than Luke (Weaponsmaster of the NJO).
A better fighter, yes, with guns and things. Kyle Katarn, (barring of course his dark side alt. reality version, who'd shred Luke and Wankatine at the same time) has never even been implied to be better.
Luke might be better at non combat skills same as Yoda but Kyle is apparently a better straight up fighter, (As Windu was), doesn't mean he would beat Luke in a no holds barred fight, the games cut scenes seem to make Luke out as more dangerous over all even if in game:
Kyle boss>Kyle tutor>Desann>Luke>Tavion(New)>Tavion (old)
And for the record, Yoda was always better than Mace in every way. Samuel L Motherfuckin' Jackson fanboyism aside.

Additionally, you don't want to rely on JA/Jedi Outcast cutscenes, as far as I know, they're randomised. As for Tavion - I have little respect left for her after killing her in five seconds flat by getting her to drop her lightsaber and just chopping her in half.
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Post by Chris OFarrell »

Illuminatus Primus wrote:
Chris OFarrell wrote:No. World Devatators are wank.

Huge glorified factories which somehow are able to defeat line warships in slugfests. Then spit out droid fighters which are now completly leathal to human pilots...planatery defence ion cannons don't even annoy them...

Then later fighter squadrons attacking them manage to punch through and cause damange, but Star Destroyers still can't. I mean it just boggles the mind. The Imperials didn;t have a large fleet screening the World Devestators and the NR fleet came out of hyperspace all guns blazing, taking out many of the ships including the Alleigence.

Then the World Devestators activate their OMG Ti3 Dr0n3s and the Rebel fleet is cut appart. Then instead of doing something like calling for reinforcements and concentrating firepower, Mon Mothma declares their only hope is to find Skywalker and use his '1337 jedi powers' to somehow pull a victory.

It's just....ARG.
Excuse you? The World Devestators were all much more massive than the largest capital ships that fought in the Battle of Calamari, and thus had greater reactor and shield dissipation wells to draw from. Its not surprising they were able to shit-kick the Mon Calamari cruisers and ISDs.
They were not THAT much larger, at least according to the sources I've read. "The Silencer-7 was the largest World Devastator at 3,200m long and 1500m tall", from Mikes site. Mon Cals are roughly that long, if not that tall and ISD's which smaller are still far more dedicated to pure combat.

A World Devestator is a glorifed FACTORY. The fact that a vessel not MUCH larger then an ISD can internaly store the volume and mass of one (Ref when one ate Emancipator at Mon Cal), then have room for all the various internal factories which can build anything from Tie Droids to smaller capital starships and STILL HAS ENOUGH ROOM for weapons and power systems able to defeat not that much smaller dedicated warships...it is completly absurd.

At no point to starfighters successfully damage the World Devestators. At one point General Antilles mistakes Silencer-7 self-destructing to success on the part of his forces.

I'm quoting here from here:

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:_kmK ... ncer&hl=en

Which is apparently an audio transcript of the book.

OFFICER: Commander Klev, two of our ships actually report minor hits! Silencer Four has lost two turbolaser stations! Silencer Six reports damage to its’ munitions warehouse! Their assault i’s about to shut down our aft hangar bay!

COMMANDER KLEV: Yes, very well. It’s time to end this little game. Release the robotic TIE Fighters, and increase our altitude.

Which is damage from Starfighter attacks. X and Y wings mostly I think.
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cool when you read it, ridiculous when you think about it

Post by Kurgan »

What's wanky about CE is that here we have a story focused on these Red Guards, who have done absolutely nothing in Star Wars up to this point (when CE was released) except stand in the background like the guards at Buckinham Palace. Guys in red who carry SPEARS.

Then all of a sudden we're lead to believe that they're actually these extremely elite hand to hand fighters who wear superior armor, carry superior weapons (double bladed Darth Maul style staves that use vibroblades instead of lightsabers on the ends; blasters that can penetrate TIE Fighters; and those sticks they use have electro stuff on them that can kill Wookies and cut you in half or some crap), who also happen to be low level force adepts.

It just seemed really over the top, like somebody who really liked how cool those Guards looked and wanted to turn them into the next Boba Fett.

Now I honestly don't care for somebody to reply to this with "corrections" on the limits of all their abilities. Let's face it, in Episode III we saw clearly how the Guards are rather useless.

I'm sure there's a certain logic that Palpy, who can hold his own against somebody as powerful as Yoda, and slaughters Jedi with ease, would want incredibly strong guards. On the other hand, he doesn't really need guards at all, and somebody more powerful enough to seriously protect him would be a threat. Such guards still serve a function, by throwing off his enemies by making them think he NEEDS guards, and by keeping people from barging into his room at any hour of the night (I'm sure spears work great against ordinary folk). That they're clearly meant to be a development of the Senate Guard for the Chanceller seems obvious from the new movies (made after CE).


And yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, as a CE apologist will say, Palpatine COULD have created these uber guards sometime after Episode III (just like he could have cloned himself and transfered his soul around like he was said to be fond of doing in Dark Empire/2), culling them from the ranks of the now non-clone conscript supplemented Stormtrooper ranks, and we'd be none the wiser.

And need I mention that in the same book we also have a supposedly elite group of Stormtroopers in black armor (who of course only exist to get slaughtered by our anti-hero to show how badass he is). And a Red Guard (with scary black helmet!) declaring himself Emperor? And he has to face the anti-hero who conveniently sides with the good guys? Gimme a break!

It's a fanwanker's wet dream... :lol:

PS: Wasn't this also the series where we got another female Imperial Admiral and one of those pale Palpatine look alike "bureacrats" in purple (see ROTJ) scheming behind the scenes? Or am I thinking of another comic series?
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Re: cool when you read it, ridiculous when you think about i

Post by The Grim Squeaker »

Kurgan wrote: PS: Wasn't this also the series where we got another female Imperial Admiral and one of those pale Palpatine look alike "bureacrats" in purple (see ROTJ) scheming behind the scenes? Or am I thinking of another comic series?
You're thinknig of the Rogue Squadron comics, and Either Isard or "Admiral" Tavira, and Sett Pestage the emperoros major domo.
Now I honestly don't care for somebody to reply to this with "corrections" on the limits of all their abilities. Let's face it, in Episode III we saw clearly how the Guards are rather useless.
I'm sorry but I have too :wink: .
Being Pwned by a pissed of Yoda using the force really doesn't set a low limit, remind me again who Apart from the old Sith, Mace, Luke and a tiny amount of other masters from the NJO (Kyle Katarn, arguably [but probably not] Uber wank Kyp) wouldn't be crushed by Yoda using the force against them fast and hard in confined quarters?
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Re: cool when you read it, ridiculous when you think about i

Post by Elheru Aran »

DEATH wrote:
Kurgan wrote: PS: Wasn't this also the series where we got another female Imperial Admiral and one of those pale Palpatine look alike "bureacrats" in purple (see ROTJ) scheming behind the scenes? Or am I thinking of another comic series?
You're thinknig of the Rogue Squadron comics, and Either Isard or "Admiral" Tavira, and Sett Pestage the emperoros major domo.
No, there was a female Imperial officer, I forgot the name but her face was based upon Lucy Autrey Wilson of Lucas Licensing; could've mistaken her for an admiral easily enough, as she wore an Imperial uniform.

As for the purple-coated bureaucrat, probably mixing him up with Pestage, yes.

Although I will allow that it's quite possible he's thinking of Leonira Tavira or Ysanne Isard, though Isard never had admiral's rank...
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Post by The Grim Squeaker »

Tavira never had an Admirals rank, but gave herself the title like many imperial warlords (Grand admirla Cronus, Vice lord [Fat guy who tried to Kill Daala with a knife made out of his massive chain collection while choking on her trap).
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Post by nightmare »

Chris OFarrell wrote:They were not THAT much larger, at least according to the sources I've read. "The Silencer-7 was the largest World Devastator at 3,200m long and 1500m tall", from Mikes site. Mon Cals are roughly that long, if not that tall and ISD's which smaller are still far more dedicated to pure combat..
A WD is much more blocky than an ISD. It's easily a magnitude larger in mass, the Silencer-7 possibly pushing 20 times.
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Post by Anguirus »

Which is apparently an audio transcript of the book.

OFFICER: Commander Klev, two of our ships actually report minor hits! Silencer Four has lost two turbolaser stations! Silencer Six reports damage to its’ munitions warehouse! Their assault i’s about to shut down our aft hangar bay!

COMMANDER KLEV: Yes, very well. It’s time to end this little game. Release the robotic TIE Fighters, and increase our altitude.

Which is damage from Starfighter attacks. X and Y wings mostly I think.
This is a deliberate ALTERATION of the graphic novel. Klev and his flunky mock the X-wings for being obsolete, useless, and unable to penetrate the shields. Klev blasts off to intercept the Emancipator and releases the TIE/Ds on the way up, which were apparently designed and built on the spot.
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Post by Coalition »

A World Devestator is a glorifed FACTORY. The fact that a vessel not MUCH larger then an ISD can internaly store the volume and mass of one (Ref when one ate Emancipator at Mon Cal), then have room for all the various internal factories which can build anything from Tie Droids to smaller capital starships and STILL HAS ENOUGH ROOM for weapons and power systems able to defeat not that much smaller dedicated warships...it is completly absurd.
Completely true. Let's measure the two vessels:

A World Devastator is a roughly rectangular vessel 1 mile long, 1/4 mile wide, and 1/2 mile tall. This is a total volume of 1/8 a cubic mile. You do have that narrow part in the center (which makes no sense), so this could be more like 2/3 of that value, or 1/12 a cubic mile.

A Star Destroyer is 1 mile long, ~1/2 mile wide, and ~1/4 mile tall. That ould normally be a solid with a volume of 1/8 a cubic mile.

However, that Star Destroyer can be treated as a pyramid, with the engine being the 'base'. That base is actually a diamond, so the height and width of the vessel is halved. From there, you plug in the formula to find the volume of a pyramid:

V=1/3 * B * H

B in this case is the area at the back of the Star Destroyer, or 1/2 mile * 1/4 mile * 1/2 = 1/16 miles^2. H in this case is the length of the Star Destroyer, aka 1 mile. So you get:

V = 1/3 * (1 mile) * (1/16 miles^2)
V = 1/48 miles^3

So a World Devastator at the same length of a Star Destroyer has 4 times the volume of a Star Destroyer. The Silencer, about twice the length, width, and height, would have a volume of ~32 times that of a Star Destroyer.
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Post by Chris OFarrell »

Coalition wrote:
Completely true. Let's measure the two vessels:

A World Devastator is a roughly rectangular vessel 1 mile long, 1/4 mile wide, and 1/2 mile tall. This is a total volume of 1/8 a cubic mile. You do have that narrow part in the center (which makes no sense), so this could be more like 2/3 of that value, or 1/12 a cubic mile.

A Star Destroyer is 1 mile long, ~1/2 mile wide, and ~1/4 mile tall. That ould normally be a solid with a volume of 1/8 a cubic mile.

However, that Star Destroyer can be treated as a pyramid, with the engine being the 'base'. That base is actually a diamond, so the height and width of the vessel is halved. From there, you plug in the formula to find the volume of a pyramid:

V=1/3 * B * H

B in this case is the area at the back of the Star Destroyer, or 1/2 mile * 1/4 mile * 1/2 = 1/16 miles^2. H in this case is the length of the Star Destroyer, aka 1 mile. So you get:

V = 1/3 * (1 mile) * (1/16 miles^2)
V = 1/48 miles^3

So a World Devastator at the same length of a Star Destroyer has 4 times the volume of a Star Destroyer. The Silencer, about twice the length, width, and height, would have a volume of ~32 times that of a Star Destroyer.
Which is still absurdly insufficient. Take for example a modern shipyard. Then add up the factories that produce the advanced technology for it. Then the foundries that refine the raw materails. The factories that produce the key structure for the ship from them. Then the machine shops to build all the little bits and peices. Then the powerplants and so on to run it all...

The infastructure DWAFFS the thing that is built by an order of magnitude or more. And the same holds true for star wars. Look at the shear size of the factories on Geonosis, which produced nothing but battledroids.

Or the resources of the KDY shipyards that build Imperial class Star Destroyers. Even with a full TWELVE slipways working on the project (which is the maximum resources that can be brought to bear on even an Executor class), ISD's require six months to be completed. Yet we are supposed to believe that these WD's are able to build similar levels of construction onto themselves in far shorter periods of time, using nothing but its internal factories?

Construction Droids on Courscant which are based on the EXACT same technology as WD's and are COMPLETLY walking factories are not seen to be far beyond conventional systems. In 'Dark Apprentince', one going full bore only moved one of its feet every 30 minuites when chewing through a building. And it was building quite low tech stuff compared to things like starships, just basic buildings, expressways and so on and the thing clearly wasn't building 1:1 its size to output, despite not having overheads like defensive systems, propulsion (beyond its 'feet') and so on.

The World Devestator has to fit in its powerplant, sublight and FTL engines, storage areas for the material it intakes and breaks down, countless factories to build countless specalised things from huge ISD sized additions to its own systems to small droid fighters, with all the parts in between needing to be made. Add onto that hanger space for zillions of small craft, assembly areas where large craft including capital ships are built internaly. And also all the crew compartments and so on.

Now bear in mind a WD doesn't simply EQUAL an ISD in offensive/defensive abilities. It is able apparently to completly IGNORE their best shots. When ISD's bests shots can at least damage Executor class Star Destroyers, if not very seriously! Also probably including MC-90 class heavy cruisers which were present at the battle and can withstand sustained fire from an Executor for a significant time and hit back with very heavy guns and very easily outclasses an ISD. There were also MC-80 B's present like Mon Remonda present that was eaten by a WD that itself chewed up ISD's without much problem in the long Zanji campaign.

It would NEED four times the volume of an ISD all devoted to the ships weapons systems to try and approach the kind of level where it could ignore ISD's and even heavier Mon Cal cruisers. But of course thats absurd, one would think at best only half the ships volume is dedicated to combat purposes, and THAT is being generous when you consider all construction droids using the same techology are only able to do.

And THAT is probably being generous when you look at some of the pictures of the ships in action, the ventral surfaces under the two 'towers' fully ripping material from under the ship, implying the ships factories are all in the towers and the 'spar' contains the reactors and everything else.

Could World Devestators be potentially very powerful and useful construction ships? Damn right. Could they realisticly be super warships of DOOM that can't be scratched by a NR fleet, which is perfectly able to bash through the escorting Alleigence and Imperial class Destroyers? Hardly.

In short, its wanktastic.
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Post by nightmare »

I don't disagree with you in principle, but a WD is a magnitude larger or more. It also clearly uses molecular building, like construction droids. We also don't know the production time, only that TIE droids seem to be quickly built, in minutes perhaps. To the best of my knowledge, we have to time table for ISDs or other large starships. The problem doesn't appear to be as bad as you make it out to be.
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Post by Kazuaki Shimazaki »

Chris OFarrell wrote:Now bear in mind a WD doesn't simply EQUAL an ISD in offensive/defensive abilities. It is able apparently to completly IGNORE their best shots. When ISD's bests shots can at least damage Executor class Star Destroyers, if not very seriously! Also probably including MC-90 class heavy cruisers which were present at the battle and can withstand sustained fire from an Executor for a significant time and hit back with very heavy guns and very easily outclasses an ISD. There were also MC-80 B's present like Mon Remonda present that was eaten by a WD that itself chewed up ISD's without much problem in the long Zanji campaign.
Now, you simply can't blame Dark Empire for Zsinj or even KJA. Dark Empire originated in 1991 and 1992 comics which were only later integrated into a full sized comic book. In other words, Dark Empire should have set the law and precedent, not books based on crappy WEG compressive mechanics which allows even a patrol boat a chance to damage a Star Destroyer. Certainly it should not be blamed for failing to follow the later books.
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Re: cool when you read it, ridiculous when you think about i

Post by Kurgan »

Kurgan wrote:What's wanky about CE is that here we have a story focused on these Red Guards, who have done absolutely nothing in Star Wars up to this point (when CE was released) except stand in the background like the guards at Buckinham Palace. Guys in red who carry SPEARS.

Then all of a sudden we're lead to believe that they're actually these extremely elite hand to hand fighters who wear superior armor, carry superior weapons (double bladed Darth Maul style staves that use vibroblades instead of lightsabers on the ends; blasters that can penetrate TIE Fighters; and those sticks they use have electro stuff on them that can kill Wookies and cut you in half or some crap), who also happen to be low level force adepts.

It just seemed really over the top, like somebody who really liked how cool those Guards looked and wanted to turn them into the next Boba Fett.

Now I honestly don't care for somebody to reply to this with "corrections" on the limits of all their abilities. Let's face it, in Episode III we saw clearly how the Guards are rather useless.

I'm sure there's a certain logic that Palpy, who can hold his own against somebody as powerful as Yoda, and slaughters Jedi with ease, would want incredibly strong guards. On the other hand, he doesn't really need guards at all, and somebody more powerful enough to seriously protect him would be a threat. Such guards still serve a function, by throwing off his enemies by making them think he NEEDS guards, and by keeping people from barging into his room at any hour of the night (I'm sure spears work great against ordinary folk). That they're clearly meant to be a development of the Senate Guard for the Chanceller seems obvious from the new movies (made after CE).


And yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, as a CE apologist will say, Palpatine COULD have created these uber guards sometime after Episode III (just like he could have cloned himself and transfered his soul around like he was said to be fond of doing in Dark Empire/2), culling them from the ranks of the now non-clone conscript supplemented Stormtrooper ranks, and we'd be none the wiser.

And need I mention that in the same book we also have a supposedly elite group of Stormtroopers in black armor (who of course only exist to get slaughtered by our anti-hero to show how badass he is). And a Red Guard (with scary black helmet!) declaring himself Emperor? And he has to face the anti-hero who conveniently sides with the good guys? Gimme a break!

It's a fanwanker's wet dream... :lol:
I also can't believe I forgot the wanktastic ability of their melee weapons to reflect blaster bolts just like a freakin' lightsaber. :lol:

I wonder if the Magnadroids were in any way inspired by these wanky characters? Apart from having a vague resemblance to IG-88 from ESB, I'd almost be willing to bet money on some inspiration...

Okay, really I'm done. ;)
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Re: cool when you read it, ridiculous when you think about i

Post by The Grim Squeaker »

Kurgan wrote: I wonder if the Magnadroids were in any way inspired by these wanky characters? Apart from having a vague resemblance to IG-88 from ESB, I'd almost be willing to bet money on some inspiration...

Okay, really I'm done. ;)
they were inspired by IG-88, the production name of the Magnaguards is IG-100, (Although how a newer model of droid could be so much weaker and possesed of a lower production number is beyond my understanding)
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Post by Kurgan »

Other than the fact they are droids and have little red glowy lights (inspiredy by HAL from 2001), I figured they had more in common with the CE guards, but that's my opinion. ;) I know they are supposed to be related to the droids, officially.
fun/fantasy movies existed before the overrated Star Wars came out. What made it seem 'less dark' was the sheer goofy aspect of it: two robots modeled on Laurel & Hardy, and a smartass outlaw with bigfoot co-pilot and their hotrod pizza-shaped ship, and they were sucked aboard a giant Disco Ball. -adw1
Someone asked me yesterday if Dracula met Saruman and there was a fight, who would win. I just looked at this man. What an idiotic thing to say. I mean really, it was half-witted. - Christopher Lee

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Post by Noble Ire »

they were inspired by IG-88, the production name of the Magnaguards is IG-100, (Although how a newer model of droid could be so much weaker and possesed of a lower production number is beyond my understanding)
The Intergalactic Banking Clan simply doesn't use sequential designations for their droids. That's all.
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Post by The Grim Squeaker »

Noble Ire wrote:
they were inspired by IG-88, the production name of the Magnaguards is IG-100, (Although how a newer model of droid could be so much weaker and possesed of a lower production number is beyond my understanding)
The Intergalactic Banking Clan simply doesn't use sequential designations for their droids. That's all.
Except that IG-88 was made by a "Lor-something robotics" Imperial intelligence agency/company that made IG between ANH-ESB and sometime after the formation of the full empire, not the defunct banking clan
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Post by Ghost Rider »

DEATH wrote:
Noble Ire wrote:
they were inspired by IG-88, the production name of the Magnaguards is IG-100, (Although how a newer model of droid could be so much weaker and possesed of a lower production number is beyond my understanding)
The Intergalactic Banking Clan simply doesn't use sequential designations for their droids. That's all.
Except that IG-88 was made by a "Lor-something robotics" Imperial intelligence agency/company that made IG between ANH-ESB and sometime after the formation of the full empire, not the defunct banking clan
Which has been ret conned in a more recent Clone Wars comic.

IG-88 is a former Intergalatic Banking droid.
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Post by Illuminatus Primus »

DEATH wrote:
Illuminatus Primus wrote: In-game mechanics exist to make the game interesting and hard for the player. For fuck's sake, Luke Skywalker has defeated both Lord Darth Vader and Emperor Palpatine - at Force Storm ability strength - in single combat.
Actually Palaptine beat him despite being disoriented.
What about the end of Dark Empire, when Luke soundly defeats a young Emperor Palpatine right before he is capable of unleashing a Force Storm that obliterated the Republic fleet?
DEATH wrote:Like I said, I think that the relation is as that between Mace and Yoda:
out of battle Yoda is immeasurably stronger and can defeat stronger foes overall (Although he did barely lose against Sidious by sheer chance, although it's arguable if Sidious went all out against Mace Before losing his saber), but in a straight fight or against weaker foes Mace is/was more overwhelming, and had better techniques.
but as you said despite beating the nigh-omnipotent Jerrec Before becoming a jedi master, defeating Desann who had gained a boost from the valley of the jedi and from the force nexus beneath the Jedi/Massassi temple etc...
In a straight up fight game mechanics aside (Kyle ahving better combat powers, more health and styles than Luke), Kyle seemed to defer to Luke as the master of the order, but Kyle Was the battlemaster of the order kile Mace was.
In short, against weaker or mass foes or fair duels Kyle is a better fighter/tactician, but Luke is the greater Jedi and has a (arguably) better record against superior foes using the dark side.
What evidence is there for this? Luke has great Force potential than any other (SoTE), Luke is better trained, Luke has destroyed more demigod Dark Siders without cheap shots, luck, or prophecy to aid him in both Vader and Palpatine in direct conflict.
DEATH wrote:The problem with World destroyers in my opinion is that fact that a mobile factory ignoring the combined firepower of most of the rebel fleet without effect is wank, even the Executors shields buckled against the far weaker Rebel ships at Endor.
Ok? There was one Executor at Endor that was refusing to engage the Rebel fleet. There were a fleet of Devestators at Calamari all willing to engage when attacked. Reactor volume is on the Devestators' side. Ask Ender for details about this kind of power-to-combat-strength relationship.
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Post by Crossroads Inc. »

While we are on the topic of WD's, ((which I personally love in concept)) Was there ever a complete list of just what they could produce, how fast they could make it, or what they needed to 'consume' for fuel?

I've heard some people say they could churn out ships like Marauder Corvetts and Carrack cruisers with ease, and others saying they even made ISD's

As for the topic of wether a "Glorified Factory Droid" could have as much firepower and shield strength as they were shown in the comics... I think part of it comes from the fact that they make warships... If you are a factory that can make Turbolasers and Shield batters for warships... Whats to stop you from telling your automated units to start attaching extra Turbolasers to your outter haul?
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