SW Databank Entry for "Duck"

[RedImperator]

There is no official explanation of human origins in the Star Wars galaxy. That said Spanky (and IP's) explanation is the only one which only includes only things known to exist in the Star Wars universe: a highly advanced ancient civilization that left or died out before the earliest known historical records. Assuming the Galaxy Far Far Away is reasonably close to the Milky Way, it would be possible for the Empire or the Republic (either one) to raid Earth for plants, animals, and humans with which to seed a planet in the GFFA. If the hyperspace aliens, for lack of a better term, were MORE advanced than the Republic/Empire, which clearly seems to be the case since the latter cannot duplicate or even fully understand the former's artifacts, then obviously they could do it as well, and do it far enough in the past (up to 200,000 years ago) that the human civilization we see in Star Wars would have time to develop to the point it's reached in the films "a long time ago".

This theory doesn't require time travel to the past (never, ever seen in Star Wars), does't require some alien demigod creating humans in two different galaxies, and it doesn't require an attempt to handwave away the entire human fossil record. It's the best theory of human origins in the SW universe that I know of, and even if there's a better one out there, it doesn't involve time travel, it doesn't involve sci-fi creationism, and it doesn't require us to ignore the fossil record. Spanky's hypothesis is the strongest one in this thread, period. In fact, it's the only one that survives Occam's Razor.

[Guardsman Bass]

In fact, it's the only one that survives Occam's Razor.

Still, it conflicts with some of the literature; I mentioned that some of the Core World cultures are in the hundreds of thousands of years old; longer than humanity has existed on Earth up until today, not to mention 'a long time ago.'

[Glimmervoid]

Side note how do we explain the perfect modern English even in games like KOTOR(which is set well before modern English) do we assume it has been translated?

[Noble Ire]

Side note how do we explain the perfect modern English even in games like KOTOR(which is set well before modern English) do we assume it has been translated?

You mean spoken? I thought It was simply translation for the benifit of the viewer (English is Areubesh.) Or is there written english somewhere there?

[Spanky The Dolphin]

Yes, it's simply autotranslated, just like Westron in Lord of the Rings.

[Dakarne]

You mean spoken? I thought It was simply translation for the benifit of the viewer (English is Areubesh.) Or is there written english somewhere there?

Only in usable Computer Consoles and Subtitles.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

In fact, it's the only one that survives Occam's Razor.

Still, it conflicts with some of the literature; I mentioned that some of the Core World cultures are in the hundreds of thousands of years old; longer than humanity has existed on Earth up until today, not to mention 'a long time ago.'

Are you sure? I don't personally recall anything being listed as happening 500K BBY besides the Devaronians developing interstellar travel.

Oh, and thanks, Red.

[Guardsman Bass]

I thought I saw the 500,000 year figure on a timeline somewhere; maybe it was the Tion Hegemony, back when it was still an empire? Other than that, I was simply reading off of Saxton's writings; he mentioned that some of the cultures in SW go back hundreds of millenia.

[Havok]

Call me dumb here, and I know you will. (Spanky, you are just so damn cute when you get all mad) Is it ever actually stated that the "humans" in Star Wars are actually, well, humans? Obviously not Earthlings/Terrans whatever, but human?

[18-Till-I-Die]

Well they'd almost have to be. The chances of a world producing a race virtually identical to humans in another galaxy, is fantastically small. Like...as in so small as to be all but impossible.

It's like, what are the chances you and i, writing two movies idependant of each other and having never met, both write screenplays that are identical right down to the dialogue, sentences, typos, the paper...ok that's a shitty analogy but you see what i mean.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

Call me dumb here, and I know you will. (Spanky, you are just so damn cute when you get all mad) Is it ever actually stated that the "humans" in Star Wars are actually, well, humans? Obviously not Earthlings/Terrans whatever, but human?

Yes, it is. In much of the EU and even multiple times in the films.

[18-Till-I-Die]

I kind of understand the confusion though, i for the longest time thought they were 'Corellians' cause that was the name of a major human homeworld. That, and it'd be extremely convenient wouldnt it.

But yes they are supposed to be 'human Humans' as oppossed to 'alien Humans'.

[Lancer]

I kind of understand the confusion though, i for the longest time thought they were 'Corellians' cause that was the name of a major human homeworld. That, and it'd be extremely convenient wouldnt it.

But yes they are supposed to be 'human Humans' as oppossed to 'alien Humans'.

Corellian is more of a nationality than a race.

[Illuminatus Primus]

In a sort of Twilight Zone way, could experimental hyperdrives from Earth have simulated time travel by transmitting information (aka colony ship) to another galaxy far far away, before it even left earth from their point of view (aka a long time ago)?
As I understand it, 'realistic' treatments of FTL without technobabble made for this would violate causality because at the very least information arrives earlier than light could, and because you can end up leaving before you started if you travel far enough fast enough. (or maybe the latter is just something I got mixed in with the Warp)

No, that's not how relativity works. Time never goes backwards. It slows down as you approach the speed of light, and speeds up as you go past it, but it never goes backwards.

Relativistic time travel can only send you forward in time. Travelling backwards is completely impossible in that fasion.

It is basically understood that any FTL that results in going backward in time in any frame of reference will violate causality and is impossible. Granted SoD forces us to accept it in SF universes where it is directly observed. But we should not postulate it where it is absent. That is irrational.

In fact, it's the only one that survives Occam's Razor.

Still, it conflicts with some of the literature; I mentioned that some of the Core World cultures are in the hundreds of thousands of years old; longer than humanity has existed on Earth up until today, not to mention 'a long time ago.'

No, you're wrong. The thing is that some local historical records go back 500,000 years says absolutely jackshit about whether humans were in those historical records.

Someone brought up the Tion and the Gree; there's no explicit evidence for a pre-200,000 year date for either, and even so, no explicit statement that I believe the former and certainly the latter are humans.

Call me dumb here, and I know you will. (Spanky, you are just so damn cute when you get all mad) Is it ever actually stated that the "humans" in Star Wars are actually, well, humans? Obviously not Earthlings/Terrans whatever, but human?

Use your fucking eyes. What is this? TFN? I thought we held ourselves to some higher standard, Jesus.

And I'd like to add, that regardless of what post-ROTJ drek they publish which I am refusing to buy or read, Centerpoint and the Corellian System are hardly the only pre-Republic civilization. The Sharu, the supposed creators of the Maw, and the Rakata are all examples.

[Elheru Aran]

Call me dumb here, and I know you will. (Spanky, you are just so damn cute when you get all mad) Is it ever actually stated that the "humans" in Star Wars are actually, well, humans? Obviously not Earthlings/Terrans whatever, but human?

I refer you to the Darkstar argument that SW humans are born with metal vertebrae. I shit you not. Considering Darkstar's reputation about these parts, I would take that as a word of warning.....

[Guardsman Bass]

I want to possibly correct my statement based off of a timeline I just looked at here. The Tion empire (created by Xim the Despot) was not 200,000 years back, at least according to the timeline, but actually about 30,000 years before ANH. Of course, this should probably be taken with a large dose of skepticism as well; it claims that hyperspace travel was discovered just before the foundation of the Old Republic, which isn't actually true; the Columbi ventured out at least a million years before the Old Republic, although they returned to their homeworld.

We do at least know that there was some form of city-like civilization (probably human) on Coruscant 90,000 years before ANH, based off of Courtship of Princess Leia. In it, Han wins the planet Dathomir in a Sabacc game inside a casino which hasn't seen the sun in 90,000 years- it has been covered by city since then.

[RedImperator]

I want to possibly correct my statement based off of a timeline I just looked at here. The Tion empire (created by Xim the Despot) was not 200,000 years back, at least according to the timeline, but actually about 30,000 years before ANH. Of course, this should probably be taken with a large dose of skepticism as well; it claims that hyperspace travel was discovered just before the foundation of the Old Republic, which isn't actually true; the Columbi ventured out at least a million years before the Old Republic, although they returned to their homeworld.

We do at least know that there was some form of city-like civilization (probably human) on Coruscant 90,000 years before ANH, based off of Courtship of Princess Leia. In it, Han wins the planet Dathomir in a Sabacc game inside a casino which hasn't seen the sun in 90,000 years- it has been covered by city since then.

That means Coruscant "only" has 110,000 years to develop to the point the casino in question was in permanant shadow. I can find parts of New York City which reached that point in the 19th century. If the hyperspace aliens gave transplanted humans no technological assistant at all, it just means the Coruscant humans developed technologically faster than the Earth humans--not surprising, since they'd be flung down on the surface of an unfamiliar planet, and agriculture could be the difference between life and death, not just a supplementary food source as it originally was here.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

It was more likely Corellia than Coruscant, as Coruscant was a bit too cold to naturally support a "native" human population before it was colonised and built up. Quite a bit had been done to Coruscant's ecosystem.

I want to possibly correct my statement based off of a timeline I just looked at here. The Tion empire (created by Xim the Despot) was not 200,000 years back, at least according to the timeline, but actually about 30,000 years before ANH. Of course, this should probably be taken with a large dose of skepticism as well; it claims that hyperspace travel was discovered just before the foundation of the Old Republic, which isn't actually true; the Columbi ventured out at least a million years before the Old Republic, although they returned to their homeworld.

Xim's empire was actually a bit closer to the ~25,000 BBY point of the foundation of the Republic, within at least several centuries or a couple thousands of years, I think. Hyperspace travel was indeed developed right before the foundation of the Republic, meaning that all pre-Hyperspace FTL, such as by the Columi, Devaronians, and Duros was something else.

[Noble Ire]

Xim's empire was actually a bit closer to the ~25,000 BBY point of the foundation of the Republic, within at least several centuries or a couple thousands of years, I think. Hyperspace travel was indeed developed right before the foundation of the Republic, meaning that all pre-Hyperspace FTL, such as by the Columi, Devaronians, and Duros was something else.

But Rakatan starships seem to use hyperdrive, and they are from 5,000 or so years before the foundation of the OR. Although, I suppose it might not actually be hyperdrive tech...
Perhaps the Rakatans actually were the one to develop the widely used variety of FTL, but when they fled back to their homeworld, they left some of their tech in the hands of freed slave races, who in turn "discovered" hyperdrive.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

I doubt it was actually hyperdrive, but wouldn't be surprised if it was due to Bioware's seemingly total incompetence. They can go fuck themselves for all I care.

[HemlockGrey]

I always thought humans evolved seperately in the Star Wars galaxy...I mean, there are billions of galaxies, right? And billions of planets in those galaxies? It could happen...

[Havok]

Call me dumb here, and I know you will. (Spanky, you are just so damn cute when you get all mad) Is it ever actually stated that the "humans" in Star Wars are actually, well, humans? Obviously not Earthlings/Terrans whatever, but human?

I refer you to the Darkstar argument that SW humans are born with metal vertebrae. I shit you not. Considering Darkstar's reputation about these parts, I would take that as a word of warning.....

Dude... that is supremely stupid. Who would write something like that... and then who would subscribe to the theory.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

Yeah, I was able to get DarkStar to say that in a debate that drifted focus to Vader's illuminated bones in RotJ.

[Havok]

Wow... kinda sad really.
I applaude your skills Spanky, if you got someone to admit to that drivel.

[DPDarkPrimus]

Well, in Darkstar's defense, he only said that because he can never admit he's wrong about anything.

Oh wait, pointing that out doesn't really defend Darkstar, it just makes him out to be even more of a spaz. Oops, my mistake.