Your ideal NR OOB?

[Kazuaki Shimazaki]

Indeed. The fact that they very shortly after set course for Courscant, where in Courtship they were able to move at sublight quite well in that almost turky shoot shows the engines wern't heavily damaged, just temp knocked out.

Courtship? As in Courtship of Princess Leia? I thought was after Solo Command, which Mon Remonda did not suffer any crippling damage.

[Chris OFarrell]

Indeed. The fact that they very shortly after set course for Courscant, where in Courtship they were able to move at sublight quite well in that almost turky shoot shows the engines wern't heavily damaged, just temp knocked out.

Courtship? As in Courtship of Princess Leia? I thought was after Solo Command, which Mon Remonda did not suffer any crippling damage.

*smacks head*

My bad. I was confussing Iron Fist and Solo Command and the relevent final endings. In both we have Wedge and Han talking and reflecting, so my bad.

[His Divine Shadow]

According to the chronology on my site, it's:
1. Iron Fist
2. Solo Command
3. The Courtship of Princess Leia

[Kazuaki Shimazaki]

It went for Seven pages. 299 to 305 inclusive. Novels are very hard to establsih times

for but in that time period we had a Dogfight, a conversation, another conversation, another dogfight, another

conversation, dogfight, Faces coversation/interldude, dogfight, withdrawl of TIE's to hanger, Iron fist pases

Mon Remonda point blank, then enters hyperspace. Thats a significant time period.

It could be a very short time. Iron Fist Chapter 20 in its entirety is Section Based, roughly delineated

by the "* * *" symbol. I suspect Allston was really on the ground, with his RPG manuals and cards ... etc out,

going turn by turn. Many of the events in the P.299-301 and P.302-305 Sections can be concurrent rather than

sequential, and thus can be as short as a few minutes each.

I see my argument is: Remonda has no chance in a straight up fight, even with a few helpers. She was supposed to be the strongest, and look what happened in P.299-301! Disabled in a few minutes under only a bit of fire!

Your argument seems to be: But it did well on P.302-305! They:
1) Managed to repair the worst of their damage within a day or so!
2) Managed to get a few licks on Iron Fist, too!
3) They scared her off!
So they should do well!

1) It may have been a temporary disablement. Or they simply used the frigate to tow Remonda slowly and painfully to hyperjump speed. In any case, even a TEMPORARY disablement is very bad (engine out for a few minutes had doomed Scharnhorst in real life.) They were taking only a tiny fraction of an SSD's firepower, less than a MC's (which officialwise, the way they are doing it, is less than an ISD-I.) For them to disable ALL your engines, either your engines are very vulnerable to superficial damage from bleedthrough, or the Iron Fist is burning through your shields to score multiple penetrating hits despite using only a small amount of firepower. It does not bode well had Iron Fist turned to put more guns to bear, even with three ships sharing the blows.
2) If you look at the engagement closely, it would seem that Mon Remonda was on Iron Fist's port bow (and thus exposing her starboard side to Iron Fist,) which had already been damaged in the Battle of Kuat with at least 12 Star Destroyers (thus implying the shielding was down.) The easiest solution is simply that Mon Remonda happened to be shooting at that weak patch (which Zsinj had very little time to repair.) That also rationalizes it with P.300 statement - it shouldn't be doing real damage at all, but it was hitting the weak patch on P.305.
3) I would think the sabotage scared Zsinj more than Mon Remonda. When his domes started blowing up mysteriously one by one, it would occur to him that he's actually being ambushed. Zsinj doctrine comes into play: The enemy prepared battlefield. Can't stay here. Don't know how many other ships they have just moving in right now to blow me up. Must re-establish initiative after escaping. And Razor Kiss wasn't good for much more anyway (notice how it blew up right after Zsinj left.)

[Darth Fanboy]

According to the chronology on my site, it's:
1. Iron Fist
2. Solo Command
3. The Courtship of Princess Leia

And your site is most correct. Of course if you want to include all Zsinj Related activity.

Wedges Gamble
Krytos Trap
Wraith Squadron
Iron Fist
Solo Command
Courtship of princess Leia.

[CmdrWilkens]

Kaz as much as one can point to the damage the iron Fist suffered before hand it doesn't change the fact that even with the monRemonda crippled, in your words, he chose to FLEE rather than fight after losing 50% of his shields. Now lets think, you are Zsinj and you've got your biggest enemy disabled and still have 50% of your shield strength. Do you cut and run if the Mon Remonda is so weak as you seem to be claiming?

The fact that Zsinj chose to recall his fighters and leave indicates that despite losing her sublight engines (IIRC her thrusters were still operational) the Mon Remonda represented enough firepower to scare Zsinj into believing it possible that his flagship was in danger of being destroyed or crippled. Also given that the Iron Fist is suppossed to belong to the Executor-class of vessels this would indicate a very powerful ship in the MC80B.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki]

(One last day, then it is a week to Beijing. Oh well... these debates come all the time anyway )

It is not just "50% of his topside shielding." "Scaring him off" is psychological, and thus is not always defined by physical reality, but by perception.

From the very beginning, he knew he had to get out of there as soon as possible, before the NR sends more ships in to attack him. But he already made the mistake of over-reaching (though understandable.) In his greed for Solo, he pretended the forward MC was Solo's (even though there's no hard evidence yet) and charged it.

Throughout the whole engagement, Zsinj's primary goal was ESCAPE, preferably with Razor Kiss. He knew more was coming. He just didn't know when.

He gets increasingly upset by the well planned way the Rebels were coordinating the battle.

When the dome went out, it wasn't just the dome and 50% of his topside shielding capacity, it was also his psychology. It is getting more and more obvious this is a WELL-PLANNED ambush. And if it was so well-planned, Solo probably had more ships coming in, ships he can't avoid if he insists on killing Mon Remonda (and incidentally trying to save Razor's Kiss.

His gain if he stayed by reducing speed:
1) He MIGHT, MIGHT be able to save Razor's Kiss (which was apparently on the border of critical failure, or was she scuttled?)
2) He's probably able to kill Solo.

His loss:
1) Potentially, the reinforcements would come
2) They would kick his butt, then he can't escape if he wanted to.
3) You definitely ain't getting Razor Kiss that way.

We, on the outside, know that the cruiser and frigate is pretty much all Solo had in range, but Zsinj doesn't know that. It is mere pragmatism to withdraw until you know more - after all, there's plenty of chances to kill Solo, but one mistake means one's own butt.

[Ender]

Zsinj also had a rule that if the enemy chose the battlefield, run no matter how it looks, as was stated in Solo Command. That might have been why he turned tail

[Kazuaki Shimazaki]

Zsinj also had a rule that if the enemy chose the battlefield, run no matter how it looks, as was stated in Solo Command. That might have been why he turned tail

That's the point I've been trying to make for this Iron Fist incident.

[CmdrWilkens]

Zsinj also had a rule that if the enemy chose the battlefield, run no matter how it looks, as was stated in Solo Command. That might have been why he turned tail

That's the point I've been trying to make for this Iron Fist incident.

Yet he clearly chose to make a fight of it from the start. If he had intended to run and merely cause as much damage as possible then he would have gone to full power and barraled through the Mon Remonda without ever launching fighters. Since he chose to perform a full deployment this tells us that, while he was looking for an escape route, he intended to give battle.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki]

Yet he clearly chose to make a fight of it from the start. If he had intended to run and merely cause as much damage as possible then he would have gone to full power and barraled through the Mon Remonda without ever launching fighters. Since he chose to perform a full deployment this tells us that, while he was looking for an escape route, he intended to give battle.

His first plan was to blow past with his two ships without the fighters, killing the Remonda on the way out. When Razor Kiss lost her shields, then in trying to save her from marauding starfighters (a reasonable attempt, no?) he launched her own fighters and reduced speed. Then when he realized Razor Kiss was a lost cause and that he's clearly in a well-planned ambush and in danger of losing Iron Fist (probably to reinforcements or another saboteur taking out another system,) he opted to flee.