StarDestroyer.Net BBS

In case we haven't all seen it yet...

http://www.howitshouldhaveended.com/Div ... _Wars.html

Of course, there are logical explanations for some of it, but it's still funny.

Requires DIVX, by the way.

"We will be in firing range in 30 minutes"
"I say we're in range now, fire."

!

Seriously though, why didn't the death star just fire through Yavin into the Rebel base? They don't have to target Yavin itself, they can just fire through its gas cloud seeing as they were clearly able to track the Rebel Base through it. (Obviously they wouldn't want to waste the shot on the gas giant's solid core, since it takes DS1 several hours to recharge its laser.) Do they need a line of sight to most accuratly fire the weapon?

CaptHawkeye wrote:Seriously though, why didn't the death star just fire through Yavin into the Rebel base? They don't have to target Yavin itself, they can just fire through its gas cloud seeing as they were clearly able to track the Rebel Base through it.

The atmosphere and gravity well of the gas giant would interfere with the beam, possibly in unpredictable ways. With tens of thousands of kilometers to travel both to the gas giant and beyond it, it wouldn't be too hard to miss, even assuming Yavin's atmosphere didn't soak up a lot of the beam's energy.

Ted C wrote:

CaptHawkeye wrote:Seriously though, why didn't the death star just fire through Yavin into the Rebel base? They don't have to target Yavin itself, they can just fire through its gas cloud seeing as they were clearly able to track the Rebel Base through it.

The atmosphere and gravity well of the gas giant would interfere with the beam, possibly in unpredictable ways. With tens of thousands of kilometers to travel both to the gas giant and beyond it, it wouldn't be too hard to miss, even assuming Yavin's atmosphere didn't soak up a lot of the beam's energy.

I suppose in retrospect they actually could try to blow up the gas giant itself, (assuming the laser could hit the giant's core with enough energy left to blow it up) the mass gravity shift and debris from the giant just couldn't be good for the Rebel base.

EDIT: But yeah, like you said. They have no idea what shooting into a gas giant could do. So it wasn't considered viable for safety reasons.

CaptHawkeye wrote:

Ted C wrote:

CaptHawkeye wrote:Seriously though, why didn't the death star just fire through Yavin into the Rebel base? They don't have to target Yavin itself, they can just fire through its gas cloud seeing as they were clearly able to track the Rebel Base through it.

The atmosphere and gravity well of the gas giant would interfere with the beam, possibly in unpredictable ways. With tens of thousands of kilometers to travel both to the gas giant and beyond it, it wouldn't be too hard to miss, even assuming Yavin's atmosphere didn't soak up a lot of the beam's energy.

I suppose in retrospect they actually could try to blow up the gas giant itself, (assuming the laser could hit the giant's core with enough energy left to blow it up) the mass gravity shift and debris from the giant just couldn't be good for the Rebel base.

EDIT: But yeah, like you said. They have no idea what shooting into a gas giant could do. So it wasn't considered viable for safety reasons.

IIRC according to some calculations Curtis Saxon did at some point, the DS shot would have taken too long to effect Yavin 4, if fired into Yavin itself (either that or it would soak it up and yawn).

Recall the first Death Star could only fire its superlaser at a relatively low speed, once every half day or so. Is they fired through even the upper atmosphere of the gas giant and missed somehow, that could give the Rebels sufficient time to evacuate their base.

Really, what the Imperials should have done is just shoot down that escape pod as soon as they saw it, with lifeforms or not. It's not like they have a shortage of turbolaser bolts.

Alternatively, they could have sent a shuttle out to intercept it and confirm whether or not the Death Star plans were stashed aboard (since jettisoning the plans in an escape pod to be picked up on the surface is, when you think about it, a fairly obvious tactic for the Rebels to take, and one that the Imperials should have been prepared for.)

As Drooling Iguana pointed out what Curtis Saxton said, the gravitational binding energy of a gas giant is tremendous. It'd be pointless firing the superlaser into Yavin, even if it had the bare minimum to dissociate the huge planet.


Of couse, they could've chanced a shot a bit earlier, through the upper atmosphere. Right, so it might miss. Fine.

Big deal, send in a few thousand TIE fighters to finish off the Rebels then!

Cykeisme wrote:Big deal, send in a few thousand TIE fighters to finish off the Rebels then!

Yavin 4, being a far better-established base than Hoth, probably had a full shielding system sufficient to hold off TIEs indefinitely.

Ted C wrote:

Cykeisme wrote:Big deal, send in a few thousand TIE fighters to finish off the Rebels then!

Yavin 4, being a far better-established base than Hoth, probably had a full shielding system sufficient to hold off TIEs indefinitely.

Why not simply stop them getting away then? Lots of TIEs, the Death Star's other guns, and probably a few ISDs fairly close by...

Hyperdrive is fast enough to make forgoing the Death Star entirely and just sending in a few hundred ISDs a feasable option. Tarkin is a powerful man, but would his doctrine of "rule by fear" hold up in face of a direct Imperial order?

The Empire should nor have built the Death Star. They should have constructed a few thousand ISDs instead.

Master_Baerne wrote:The Empire should nor have built the Death Star. They should have constructed a few thousand ISDs instead.

And when Alderaan turns on its shields, it'll sit and laugh at the Imperial fleet in orbit.

The whole point was to use the Death Star as a terror weapon. That's the first major reason for its existence. As for the other..

Master_Baerne wrote:Hyperdrive is fast enough to make forgoing the Death Star entirely and just sending in a few hundred ISDs a feasable option. Tarkin is a powerful man, but would his doctrine of "rule by fear" hold up in face of a direct Imperial order?

The Empire should nor have built the Death Star. They should have constructed a few thousand ISDs instead.

They already had thousands of ISDs. Aside from scaring the bejeezus out of everyone, the Death Star had another very practical purpose: defeating heavy planetary shields without an extended siege.

Cykeisme wrote:The whole point was to use the Death Star as a terror weapon. That's the first major reason for its existence. As for the other..

Master_Baerne wrote:The Empire should nor have built the Death Star. They should have constructed a few thousand ISDs instead.

They already had thousands of ISDs. Aside from scaring the bejeezus out of everyone, the Death Star had another very practical purpose: defeating heavy planetary shields without an extended siege.

Diverting funding to the the Eclipses and Sovereigns could fulfill both purposes splendidly, granted, they couldn't blow up a planet like the Death Stars, but a single shot is enough to punch through a planetary shield and kill a planet, and I'd find looking at your planet in ruins and being incapable of repairing it a much more intimidating prospect than detonating it, as simply killing the planet leaves evidence, however, turning the planet into an asteroid field leaves you an asteroid field. They also cost a lot less in man power, funding, and resources and thus allow you to build them more quickly than a Death Star, and a fully functionally one at half a year means shit loads of Sovereigns.

General Schatten wrote:Diverting funding to the the Eclipses and Sovereigns could fulfill both purposes splendidly

Actually they would have worked better than the Death Star: if necessary, several can team up to take out a planet's shields, otherwise they can go off in ones or twos (well, with accompanying fleet maybe) and enforce Imperial rule all over the place.

Teleros wrote:

General Schatten wrote:Diverting funding to the the Eclipses and Sovereigns could fulfill both purposes splendidly

Actually they would have worked better than the Death Star: if necessary, several can team up to take out a planet's shields, otherwise they can go off in ones or twos (well, with accompanying fleet maybe) and enforce Imperial rule all over the place.

Considering the speed of hyperdrive, one superweapon is more than enough for even a galactic superpower like the Empire. I mean, its not like heavily-populated worlds are going to rebel faster than they can be destroyed. The Death Stars are a bit excessive, but they certainly are effective tools of terror. Quibbling about alternate usages of the materials involved is entirely missing the point.

phongn wrote:And when Alderaan turns on its shields, it'll sit and laugh at the Imperial fleet in orbit.

I'd think that a few thousand ISDs could break through the shields, given 'retreat from Coruscant' where a large Imperial Fleet broke through Coruscant's shields by simply bombarding them for a night until they fell

EDIT 2: About the Thousand TIEs idea:

The Rebels have a decent-size fleet orbiting Yavin IV, based of Empire At War, X-wing, the original comics, SW: Galaxies and Battlefront 2 so would the TIEs win?

EDIT 3: And I forgot, the Empire did have Torpedo Spheres to take out the shield generators as well, and spies (e.g. Bothans taking out Caamas's shield generators before Palpatine BDZed the world.

Teleros wrote:

General Schatten wrote:Diverting funding to the the Eclipses and Sovereigns could fulfill both purposes splendidly

Actually they would have worked better than the Death Star: if necessary, several can team up to take out a planet's shields, otherwise they can go off in ones or twos (well, with accompanying fleet maybe) and enforce Imperial rule all over the place.

Wookiepedia indicates that each is equipped with a Superlaser capable of punching through a planetary shield and burning off a continent, and enhanced Ion Engines and a faster Hyperdrive. The only thing the Sovies and Eclipses can't do are destroy planets in one shot and take on entire fleets by themselves, but given the size of the Rebellion, that's a nearly useless feature. Also they have gravity well generators, thus giveing them time to recharge for another blast, if they even need it.

Warsie wrote:EDIT 2: About the Thousand TIEs idea:

The Rebels have a decent-size fleet orbiting Yavin IV, based of Empire At War, X-wing, the original comics, SW: Galaxies and Battlefront 2 so would the TIEs win?

Most definately the Death Star can target the fleet with every turbolaser on any given hemisphere, given the size of the Death Star this is tens of thousands if not hundreds of thousands of turbolasers being brought to bear on any single side of the Death Star. It's already known that the only reason Luke destroyed the Death Star was because Tarkin didn't start letting go the Death Star's hordes of TIE/ln TIE Fighters, with the TIEs flying against the X-Wings and Y-Wings and the Death Star obliterating entire portions of the fleet in one volley, defeat is unthinkable, the Rebels only choice would be a retreat via hyperspace (Which is another reason why I prefer the Eclipse and Sovereign Star Dreadnaughts over the Death Star, they have Gravity Well Projectors).

The other nice thing about a Death Star is that when you get around to building a second one, you have an excellent "go conquer another galaxy" vehicle. It's a movable beachhead. Sure, getting it to another galaxy is hardly trivial, but with the size of the craft and the speed of hyperspace it could easily sustain and support its crew and succeeding generations until you get to the next galaxy and its resources. Naturally, this is a monumental task, but you have to start somewhere. What would make the Sith happier than spreading their philosophy?

Hmm. I appear to have made an illconsidered, unsupported statement that was justly ripped apart by all of you people. It just seems, in retrospect, that if an ISD is destroyed you lose the investment required to build only one ISD, and they usually travel in battle groups, IIRC. On the other hand, if you lose a Death Star...

I realize that by this logic, warship construction should not move beyond the small rowboat, but since both Death Stars were destroyed by acts of plot, they seem kinda pointless.

Master_Baerne wrote:but since both Death Stars were destroyed by acts of plot, they seem kinda pointless.

You could say the same thing about the Empire as a whole then couldn't you?

PayBack wrote:

Master_Baerne wrote:but since both Death Stars were destroyed by acts of plot, they seem kinda pointless.

You could say the same thing about the Empire as a whole then couldn't you?

Yes, you could. Though since the Empire degenerates into the Imperial Remnant, which helps win the war against the Yuzzhan Vong (stupid idea by the way, but it's canon) they might not be completely useless.

Drooling Iguana wrote:Really, what the Imperials should have done is just shoot down that escape pod as soon as they saw it, with lifeforms or not. It's not like they have a shortage of turbolaser bolts.

Alternatively, they could have sent a shuttle out to intercept it and confirm whether or not the Death Star plans were stashed aboard (since jettisoning the plans in an escape pod to be picked up on the surface is, when you think about it, a fairly obvious tactic for the Rebels to take, and one that the Imperials should have been prepared for.)

That my friend is the turning point of the war. Had the Droids been shot to atoms in their escape pod the Alliance would have eventually crumbled. Im sure you already knew that..... just my two ¢'s

Hey so if Eclipse lasers can defeat shielding, and destroy continents... what says one shot can do that? The idea that the Eclipse can defeat any planetary shielding strikes me as ridiculous, and the idea that it can do this and kill a planet with the same shot absurd. Far be it for me to imply Wookiepedia has inaccurate or stupid information, of course. LOL!

Are there any reliable estimates of the Eclipse's power? It seems unlikely, since it was in a comicbook, did nothing, then exploded, so where are these 'lol effectively the same as a Death Star and a millionth the size' claims coming from?

The Dark Empire Sourcebook or both Essential Guides?