StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Well, Wookieepedia's already started gathering up info, and there's some nice details here and there. The book covers most eras seen so far, including the Legacy comics, the current LOTF books and the KOTOR comics.

Some Palpatine-related info I found interesting, a picture of him training under Plagueis, must be in his 20s or so at the time, and another showing a young Darth Maul training with those electrostaffs from Ep. 3 (must be practicing to use the double-bladed lightsabre).
The interesting thing about the second picture, is Palpatine's face, which shows almost more decay and scarring than even his ROTS-form. This is consistent with the short story Sithisis, which shows Palpatine changing from the monsterous Sidious form to his human-looking Palpatine appearance.

Based on the artist, Palpatine's face in the second is more likely an artistic error....especially considering the other pieces of art Tommy Lee Edward did.

(That obviously traced LOTR pic of the Great Hyperspace War).

True, but it corroborates with a previous depiction of Palpatine in private, prior to the events of ROTS. Seems Windu's counter didn't so much create those scars as it revealed them. (Palpatine also grew long fingernails in the film and then lost them later on, I doubt that's due to lightning damage).

Any tidbits about Palpatine? I'm trying to build the ultimate case for Palpatine's superiority over all Sith Lords.

What stuff about Vader is there?

About Palpatine, he is credited as the writer of a chapter of the book, appearing as one of the Gatekeepers of the Telos Holocron, discovered on Telos IV by the NJO in 40 ABY. He left behind this holocron, which recorded the following:

Palpatine wrote:Maul had but one reason for being: to exact vengeance against the Jedi Order for the decimation of the Sith ranks. Oh, how he dreamed of burning the Jedi Temple to the ground. I know, for I gave him that dream repeatedly.

Emphasis mine. Palpatine has the ability to implant dreams and images in people. Could be a possible source for Anakin's nightmares about his wife's death.

Remembered something from the OS. It was in the last Vader update on the Databank:

The Movies section on Darth Vader wrote:Some among the Jedi believed this to be part of an ancient prophecy of a Chosen One, willed into life by the midi-chlorians, who would bring balance to an increasingly darkening Force. There was another possibility, though. The child could have been the creation of sinister Sith manipulations, as the Dark Lords Darth Plagueis and Darth Sidious conspired to bring about the perfect apprentice by coaxing life from lifelessness.

Emphasis mine. "Heather has Two Mommies", knock yourself out! :P

That sounds familiar. When they had succeeded in "creating life from lifelessness", did they by chance, exclaim, "It's alive, IT'S ALIIIVE!!"? Does that mean that Palpatine's first name is Igor or Fritz?

VT-16 wrote:About Palpatine, he is credited as the writer of a chapter of the book, appearing as one of the Gatekeepers of the Telos Holocron, discovered on Telos IV by the NJO in 40 ABY. He left behind this holocron, which recorded the following:

Palpatine wrote:Maul had but one reason for being: to exact vengeance against the Jedi Order for the decimation of the Sith ranks. Oh, how he dreamed of burning the Jedi Temple to the ground. I know, for I gave him that dream repeatedly.

Emphasis mine. Palpatine has the ability to implant dreams and images in people. Could be a possible source for Anakin's nightmares about his wife's death.

To tell you the truth, I do not consider Sidious implanting dreams in others that farfetched. In fact, I think there's an excellent basis for it in the movies. What I view as "dreams" is a desire to do something. It's certainly within the limits of these beings, those onscreen, to possibly implant an idea. For example, Obi-Wan offers a suggestion to a stormtrooper in ANH to do something, and Darth Vader can communicate via telepathy with Luke in TESB. Yoda and the "council" in Ep.I could read Anakin's thoughts. There is a basis for mind manipulation right there, from the highest official sources. And as far as the literature goes, I recall an affair with the Lusankya being concealed by Palpatine's mind prowess. How hard can it be then to suggest a powerful Sith Lord such as Sidious can't do this?

Late Edit:

However, this is strictly my opinion, but I don't believe that Sidious did anything to Anakin. I see more irony in Anakin's prevention of Padme's death by the action that he takes in the course of ROTS. Basically, he sees Padme dying as a result of his turning to the dark side, as we see in the movie, and I think the Force is only warning him to NOT turn to the dark side, but he doesn't realize this before it is too late.

Boeing 757 wrote: I see more irony in Anakin's prevention of Padme's death by the action that he takes in the course of ROTS. Basically, he sees Padme dying as a result of his turning to the dark side, as we see in the movie, and I think the Force is only warning him to NOT turn to the dark side, but he doesn't realize it before this is too late.

I'm not sure that I agree with what I've put in bold as there is a vital difference between the two dreams. In the first dream we are shown, Padmé cries out to Anakin (as if he was present) and in the second dream, it's not Anakin which is present but Obi-Wan.

Mange wrote:

Boeing 757 wrote: I see more irony in Anakin's prevention of Padme's death by the action that he takes in the course of ROTS. Basically, he sees Padme dying as a result of his turning to the dark side, as we see in the movie, and I think the Force is only warning him to NOT turn to the dark side, but he doesn't realize it before this is too late.

I'm not sure that I agree with what I've put in bold as there is a vital difference between the two dreams. In the first dream we are shown, Padmé cries out to Anakin (as if he was present) and in the second dream, it's not Anakin which is present but Obi-Wan.

Hhmm, you mean to say that Anakin *should* have been present as his visions suggest, but when all was said and done it was Obi-Wan instead of Anakin who was near Padme? Well, alright, I hope this doesn't confuse you then.

Supposing that we look at it from my point of view, I think that merely the Force might have been giving Anakin a wake-up call. Yes. Basically, the vision Anakin saw was only a portrayal of the future as the Force wanted to reveal it to Anakin. The Force itself--being the vision--might have been speaking to Anakin directly as a means of insight, rather than as we think Padme was speaking to Anakin. Ergo I'm equating this to say perhaps Luke's vision in the Dagobah Cave where Luke finds out first hand from the Force's perspective that if he continues the trend his perpetrating, he'll become another "Darth Vader." So maybe Padme's "Help me!" may have been the Force's "Hey dumb arse, pay attention to what's happening right now or you're going to get everyone killed!"

Also, I'm putting into consideration Yoda's line from ESB "Always in motion is the future" to mean that while one can see the basics of what MAY happen (an outline perhaps, or even a rough draft), the final copy isn't always perfect. There's just so MANY factors that can influence a future decision and that's probably what Yoda was talking about with the fluidity of the future spiel. A famous example of this, ahem, would be Palpatine's prediction of Luke's enslavement to the dark side at the end of ROTJ (which never came to pass...). So maybe Anakin merely forsaw an imperfect copy of future events (one with some unknown variable), so that technically doesn't discount the possibility of the Force warning Anakin to his possible fall to the dark side. Hope that wasn't so mind boggling. Saying all that however....I have to also add as a sidenote that this is just MY favorite stance on the issue. I'm not saying it's George Lucas's own feelings or anything such. In fact, I even buy (to some degree) Sidious's implantation of thoughts into Anakin's head.

For instance, I can make an opposing viewpoint claiming that Sidious did plant visions in Anakin's head. The fact that Anakin did have a vision about Padme dying, and then Palpatine bringing up a Force power capable of stopping death at the arena...well something seems STRANGE about that. It seems to be too much of a coincidence. But then again, someone can also bring up that Sidious already knows about Anakin and the sandpeople, and Anakin as a consequence might have told Palpatine his yearning to stop people from dying. So either way, it's a jumbled mess and I can't say I prefer to have any sort of concrete judgement without having an open mind to another possibility.

Here's what I thought the most interesting tidbit from TEG2TF was written (in universe) by Luke Skywalker about Palpatine (emphasis is mine):

....And for six years, I believed, as everyone else did, that Palpatine was dead. Only last year did I learn the truth: Palpatine had not been consumed by a blast of energy, but had survived as Dark Side energy itself. In this bodily, transitional state, he traveled across the galaxy until he reached his hidden retreat world. There he projected his spirit into the body of a waiting clone, a replica of himself. By this method, he had cheated death. It was not the first time. He had previously utilized clones after he had discovered that the corrupting power of the dark side had a detrimental on his physical form. But after the Battle of Endor, He commissioned many more clones of himself to ensure that he would live forever.

Now I know as well as anyone that Leland Chee hs stated that Palpatine's first death took place at Endor, not before, but it is also Lucas policy that things are canonical only until a more current source says otherwise. Anyone else notice this?

There's nothing canon-changing about that. The current status is Palpatine lies to Luke, and Luke believes him.

Luke's just recounting what he believes - he has no way of knowing Palpatine wasn't telling the truth.

QuentinGeorge wrote:There's nothing canon-changing about that. The current status is Palpatine lies to Luke, and Luke believes him.

Luke's just recounting what he believes - he has no way of knowing Palpatine wasn't telling the truth.

Its idiotic; Chee's just being simplistic. And besides, why would Palpatine lie? And why would Endor-Palpatine not be a clone? He doesn't even look very much like ROTS-Palpatine anyway.

Darth Massacrus wrote: It was not the first time. He had previously utilized clones after he had discovered that the corrupting power of the dark side had a detrimental on his physical form.

Now I know as well as anyone that Leland Chee hs stated that Palpatine's first death took place at Endor, not before, but it is also Lucas policy that things are canonical only until a more current source says otherwise. Anyone else notice this?

Yeah, he said so as much to Luke when he came to Byss. Maybe Palpatine killed himself for an experiment...just to see if he could do it or not.

Yeah, he said so as much to Luke when he came to Byss. Maybe Palpatine killed himself for an experiment...just to see if he could do it or not.

Doesn't sound like a wonderful idea. What if it didn't work?

Androsphinx wrote: Doesn't sound like a wonderful idea. What if it didn't work?

He did it to Bevel Lemelisk first, so he knew that it worked.

He did it to Bevel Lemelisk first

Speaking of which, according to Wookieepedia, one of the books detail Lemelisk's capture and execution by the New Republic. His final words were said to have been "Just make sure you get it right this time." :P