StarDestroyer.Net BBS

I just read a hilarious thread on some althist forum, where the Empire attacked modern Earth and some wanker thought that Vader's occupation force was doomed to fall before Teh Power of the Common Man rising up against them (he probably imagined John Ringo writing the story . . . ). Another one seriously suggested our computers are better than SW standards. Now while I am certain this is not the case (it seems to be in contradiction with mentions I recall of astrogation, tachyonic computers, &c), it did get me wondering: What are the demonstrated capabilities of Wars computers in absolute terms? How does the franchise stand there compared to others?

What is primitive about Star Wars computing? The monochromatic displays? Man, tachyonic processors. Just keep repeating that until he goes away.

Droids alone are a great example of Star Wars' incredible processing and storage power. R2-D2, besides being fully-sapient, is able to calculate hyperspace jumps, store and recall the complete schematics of not only the freaking Death Star but supposedly a whole library of spacecraft- both civilian and military. He's also a 733t h4x0r.

Well, a much more mundane computing system is the use of quantum computers on the Death Star, as security systems. Hell, IIRC, some missiles have their own droid brains.

Also, can I have a link to this website?

EDIT: Wait, is it this place?

The credit-card sized data storage unit Leia stored the Death Star plans on had to have a storage capacity on the order of 10^18 bytes as a low-end estimate. That's billions of times better than the best we can do on Earth right now for pocket sized storage. Just plug in the resolution you want on your 160-kilometer-wide model and multiply by 16 bytes per polygon....

Darth Raptor wrote:What is primitive about Star Wars computing? The monochromatic displays? Man, tachyonic processors. Just keep repeating that until he goes away.

I am not actually debating the guy; that place is crammed full with retards, and I have no interest in bashing my head bloody against Darkstaresque Walls of Ignorance. I just followed a link there a while ago and found that some of it could be amusing reading at times.

Where is the tachyonic processor quote from? I remember it, but not the source?

Darth Ruinus wrote:EDIT: Wait, is it this place?

That is it.

Just because SW computers don't have fancy colorful Aero user interface or something like that doesn't mean that it's weak computers. Actually I think that it just shows that the SW civilizations got over the bling-bling to show off high tech, propably about 25.000 years ago or so. Clean and simple UI = more efficient.

Edit: Also, people in SW talk to their computers and use primarily holograms to display things, not panels/monitors. They use holocrons to store data, and you can talk to them, too, apparently (I'm thinking of the sith holocrons in KOTOR2). I'd say that's above what we can do on modern earth, at least my USB stick won't answer me or display holograms

Actually I think that it just shows that the SW civilizations got over the bling-bling to show off high tech, propably about 25.000 years ago or so.

I see you had your blinkers on during most of the prequel trilogy. The Empire might like their displays simple and to-the-point, but the Republic were certainly suckers for fancy GUI's with moving transparent gribbledidoodads.

Bounty wrote: I see you had your blinkers on during most of the prequel trilogy. The Empire might like their displays simple and to-the-point, but the Republic were certainly suckers for fancy GUI's with moving transparent gribbledidoodads.

Alright, seems I totally forgot about that stuff, sorry.

One thing to bear in mind is that a lot of the Old Republic computers we see are designed for non-military applications, whereas nearly every computer we see in the original trilogy is in use by the military, either the Empire or the rebellion.

I'd imagine the military would keep the fancy stuff to a minimum and go for the least complicated display and user interface they could get.

One thing to bear in mind is that a lot of the Old Republic computers we see are designed for non-military applications

Did you see the displays on the Invisible Hand?

Mind you, there's nothing wrong with fancy displays if they're well-designed, and the technology in SW-verse is certainly mature enough to make them work reliably.

Darth Hoth wrote:

Darth Raptor wrote:What is primitive about Star Wars computing? The monochromatic displays? Man, tachyonic processors. Just keep repeating that until he goes away.

I am not actually debating the guy; that place is crammed full with retards, and I have no interest in bashing my head bloody against Darkstaresque Walls of Ignorance. I just followed a link there a while ago and found that some of it could be amusing reading at times.

Where is the tachyonic processor quote from? I remember it, but not the source?

Darth Ruinus wrote:EDIT: Wait, is it this place?

Ah, yes, Alternatehistory.com. Despite a few exceptions, many of them have some bizarre views (I believe there was once a Galactic Empire vs. Stargate thread that had a similar vibe). From what I have seen, most of those viewpoints stem from either lack of knowledge regarding the subject (which, if anything, shows how they don't even bother doing research first), or the belief that SW technology is inferior because it lacks that slick, futuristic look to it.

Bounty wrote:

One thing to bear in mind is that a lot of the Old Republic computers we see are designed for non-military applications

Did you see the displays on the Invisible Hand?

Mind you, there's nothing wrong with fancy displays if they're well-designed, and the technology in SW-verse is certainly mature enough to make them work reliably.

those displays where designed by nemodians for nemodians (and droids ofc), so they might actually be clear as crystal to them (since they're very obviously aren't humans or anything near humans in terms of biology)

Well, the targeting computer on X-Wings seem to have trouble hitting 2 meter wide targets. How does that compare with modern hardware?

Then again, given C3PO's language and movement capabilities, they should be highly advanced.

Newpa_Hasai wrote:Well, the targeting computer on X-Wings seem to have trouble hitting 2 meter wide targets. How does that compare with modern hardware?

had trouble hitting a 2 meter wide object, while under heavy fire, EMC and moving at god knows how fast, considering that the X-wings were more or less sensorblind you can't say jack shit about their computing capabilities due to the variebles involved.

Lord Revan wrote:had trouble hitting a 2 meter wide object, while under heavy fire, EMC and moving at god knows how fast, considering that the X-wings were more or less sensorblind you can't say jack shit about their computing capabilities due to the variebles involved.

It looked easier in the film They appeared to be moving at ~WW2 fighter speeds, maintained communications throughout the battle, seemed to know exactly how far away the exhaust port was, and there wasn't any turbolaser fire when Red Leader attacked.

...Or am I biased into thinking that Star Wars computers are of the same kind as the ones in the Golden Age of Sci-Fi (Androids are easy/number crunching is hard)

Newpa_Hasai wrote:

Lord Revan wrote:had trouble hitting a 2 meter wide object, while under heavy fire, EMC and moving at god knows how fast, considering that the X-wings were more or less sensorblind you can't say jack shit about their computing capabilities due to the variebles involved.

It looked easier in the film They appeared to be moving at ~WW2 fighter speeds, maintained communications throughout the battle, seemed to know exactly how far away the exhaust port was, and there wasn't any turbolaser fire when Red Leader attacked.

What were you watching? We don't have a frame of reference for most of it (making velocity estimation impossible), but when we watch the distance tick down on the rangefinder they are moving ~2.2 km/s, or Mach 6

...Or am I biased into thinking that Star Wars computers are of the same kind as the ones in the Golden Age of Sci-Fi (Androids are easy/number crunching is hard)

If anything, numbercrunching is easier. Stop and think about how many calculations a navicomputer has to do to find a safe path. There are at least 400 billion stars interacting with each other that must be accounted for, plus however many smaller objects there are depending on the tolerances of a hyperdrive.

He's right though in that a lot of retro sci-fi posits android brains that aren't exactly regular computers- a hypothesis that might prove to be accurate as biomorphic AIs- i.e., those modeled after a sapient, organic brains- might be more stable/ less prone to DROID REBELLIONS/ better able to do heuristics than a computer that just tries to power through it with an overclocked, water-cooled Pentium 5,000,000. Mechanical men with mechanical brains, in other words.

Ender wrote:What were you watching? We don't have a frame of reference for most of it (making velocity estimation impossible), but when we watch the distance tick down on the rangefinder they are moving ~2.2 km/s, or Mach 6

More of the maneuvers and dogfighting before the trench run. Er, what units was the rangefinder using? (I bring this up since I seem to recall that the countdown on the Deathstar itself was not using seconds/minutes)

...but on further thought, it simply could have been a problem where absurd levels of precision were required, hence "impossible, even for a computer" and this is a bad example. Argument retracted. =/

Darth Raptor: My favorite example of that would be in I, Robot. There's one part where the characters are talking about how advanced a new android is because it can do triple integrals. ::Looks at his very non-sentient TI-89.::

That is because the series (Asimov robot and Foundation) has internal coherancy problems. Asimov made a universe were AIs are weak to avoid eliminating all human characters. He didn't take into account Moores law or the effects that would have.

Besides, the exhaust port wasn't just a straight shaft into the core. The shaft made a very sharp angled curve, didn't it? That would make shooting the proton torps in, and making sure the torps could maneuver through the shaft's limited space and go all the way into the Death Star's core to blow it up, much more difficult.

Bounty wrote:

One thing to bear in mind is that a lot of the Old Republic computers we see are designed for non-military applications

Did you see the displays on the Invisible Hand?

Mind you, there's nothing wrong with fancy displays if they're well-designed, and the technology in SW-verse is certainly mature enough to make them work reliably.

Did you read where I said "a lot" and not "all"?

Besides, the Invisible Hand was crewed by Nemoidians and droids, not humans. Heck, the Nemoidians running the ships often have weird goggle things over their faces. Who knows how that enhances/affects things.

Newpa_Hasai wrote:

Ender wrote:What were you watching? We don't have a frame of reference for most of it (making velocity estimation impossible), but when we watch the distance tick down on the rangefinder they are moving ~2.2 km/s, or Mach 6

More of the maneuvers and dogfighting before the trench run. Er, what units was the rangefinder using? (I bring this up since I seem to recall that the countdown on the Deathstar itself was not using seconds/minutes)

...but on further thought, it simply could have been a problem where absurd levels of precision were required, hence "impossible, even for a computer" and this is a bad example. Argument retracted. =/

Darth Raptor: My favorite example of that would be in I, Robot. There's one part where the characters are talking about how advanced a new android is because it can do triple integrals. ::Looks at his very non-sentient TI-89.::

The rangefinder was using meters/kilometers, same as we use.

And when was the Death Star countdown not using seconds/minutes?

The Medstar duology had I-5 giving his computer specs for his droid brain, and as I recall he wasn't exceptionally high-end at all...

Anyhow, its places like these why I largely stopped debating at all. There's always going to be a place like it, you can't stomp it out, at best you can just set an example for other people. Forums like that don't want detailed analysis or hard discussions: they want to go by group consensus, personal or group opinion, and what they can recall from the movies. Trying to get anything more from it (or to make it more than that) is like pulling teeth, and even if you do, ,they'll just look at you like you're some sort of weirdo (IE the old "its sci fi so you can't really analyze it" double standard.)

The New Rebellion had a stunning display of Coruscant and the NR intelligence database capabilities. When contacted by Kruguer, they were able to rapidly search the entire Galactic Republic historical and cultural knowledge so as to identify the death mask location and historical correlation of the name within minutes........

But then again, this is the same galaxy where droids can't identify a Kamino dart:D

Did you read where I said "a lot" and not "all"?

Besides, the Invisible Hand was crewed by Nemoidians and droids, not humans. Heck, the Nemoidians running the ships often have weird goggle things over their faces. Who knows how that enhances/affects things.

I remember reading that it is a remote fighter display. I don't remember the source. Wookiepedia gives this:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Data_goggles

Data goggles were, to exterior appearances, simple eye-goggles that provided the wearer with real-time holographic displays within the eyecups. However, these goggles also included a cybernetic implant that provided the user with direct access to the starship's central control computer. This meant pilots could literally activate shipboard systems with a thought

But then again, this is the same galaxy where droids can't identify a Kamino dart:D

It could simply be it wasn't put into the database.

we know in AOTC that referencese to Kamino were removed from the Jedi archives. That would presumably include referencecs to other aspects about Kamino (such as the saberdart.) That was more a commentary on the arrogance of the Jedi order at the time that they never considered that their archives might have been incomplete or tampered with (the same way they never contemplated Dooku might have been an assassinating fuckwit.)