StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Alright, it's after Episode III. Anakin and his hand-picked team of clone troopers have butchered every single Jedi in the temple on Coruscant. Many of the Jedi in direct command of field units were cut down by their own troopers, and those few that remained alive would no doubt need to go into hiding.

My question is, since we know Yoda fled to the swamps of Degobah, and Obi Wan took up the life of a hermit on Tattooine, what happened to the other Jedi?

The reason I ask is that while Anakin did send a message recalling EVERY Jedi to the temple on Coruscant, I imagine not all of them were in direct transit, and even if they were, why couldn't they disappear? I know every Jedi in the prequel era wears those damned robes, but would all of them? Would the Jedi be difficult to detect? And even if they were, the clones are most often in military instillations. I don't see them manning the desk at customs outside some remote planet somewhere. Would all the bureaucrats try and turn in the Jedi? Would they even be aware of Order 66? The Jedi are supposed to be leading the good fight against the Seperatists, so they'd be cast as heroes by the wartime media, right?

Basically the question is this. About how difficult would the average Jedi knight find it to disappear quietly? Would their names and races, recorded in the archives at the temple no doubt, make it hard for them to move undetected? Would the average joe really feel it necessary to turn them in?

They all died. Of gangrene.

No but really, they all ran around having stupid adventures in EU material while never managing to accomplish anything meaningful. There's scads of them in the EU, doing all sorts of silly shit. "Aha, I've been under a rock for 100 years, and I'm a Sith now for some reason! Face my wrath, Han Skywalker Junior III!"

The Jedi were supposedly scattered throughout the galaxy and some were on their own missions. Its entirely possible that a recall message would had ask Jedi to report in back to the Republic and Coruscant.

Consider this, if Jedi were engaged in infiltration missions like that seen in Shatterpoint, they and their troops might had been cut off from Order 66. Even if they did survive Order 66, that didn't mean they knew the Empire was out to get them but rather, say, Clone traitors or some sort. There are also other forms of "Jedi", those in the AgriCorps, healers and etc.

Even if they haven't directly transited back to the Temple, they might had reported in to the local Republic government etc and then had been shot down by clonetroopers.

It would be interesting to actually pin down how long Order 66 took. The events appear to have happened within a day in the movie, before Chancellor Palpatine made his appearence before the Senate telling them that the Jedi had attempted a coup against the Republic.

Dark Lord also shows us what some Jedi did upon receiving the recall message

I imagine that Palpatine made it fairly difficult for them to move freely, but at that point he had such an advantage in power differential (and had managed to account for so many of the Jedi masters who were actually powerful enough to be a serious threat) that it didn't matter. If individual Jedi decided to go hide under a rock while he controlled the rest of the galaxy, that didn't really hurt Palpatine's ambitions.

What Palpatine probably put most of his effort into was making sure that the Jedi couldn't organize- couldn't assemble any separate nuclei of power which could present him with credible opposition. There's some EU examples of that- one from a video game of a bunch of refugee Jedi rallying on Naboo and a stormtrooper legion flattening them, in the immediate post-coup period.

But yeah, the EU suffers from a plague of Jedi Purge survivors.

It's not all that surprising that a noticeable fraction of the Order would survive the purge when you think about it- many of them would have been off on independent assignments away from large clone forces, or lucky enough not to be immediately assassinated when the clones attacked them. After all, Order 66 was as big a surprise to the clones as it was to the Jedi; they wouldn't have had someone on hand to kill every Jedi they were operating with at the time.

What is surprising, or at least disappointing, is that so many EU writers can't be bothered to come up with something more creative than "I am a Force user who survived the Jedi Purge." It robs from the mystique the Force had in the original trilogy to have so many people capable of using it washing around.

PainRack wrote: Dark Lord also shows us what some Jedi did upon receiving the recall message

Seriously, Baffalo, read Dark Lord if you haven't already.

The fate of some other Jedi is covered elsewhere. For example, I think Shak-Ti goes down in The Force Unleashed, though as I recall that contradicts the Revenge of the Sith novel so it might not be canon.

I suppose it's possible that some of the less powerful ones who weren't personally connected to the temple might buy into Palpatine's story, and be inducted into something like the Inquisition. The Empire could then spend many years subverting them to the Dark side, by which I don't mean using Lightning/Choke all the time, but willing to turn a blind eye to the more obvious atrocities of the Empire, whilst using their Force powers to hunt down insurgents, etc.

Well for one, Obi-Wan and Yoda countermanded the recall message, so that isn't an issue.

"A young Jedi named Darth Vader, who was a pupil of mine until he turned to evil, helped the Empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi Knights. ... Now the Jedi are all but extinct."

EU garbage aside, this is exactly what happened. Vader had access to pretty much all information on the Jedi, last known whereabouts, assignments etc.. Given the nature of the Jedi, most wouldn't just abandon their current missions to go into hiding so they would be easy to find and those that did manage to get lost were all found and whacked by the time of Ep. IV.

As for your other questions, the Jedi number in the hundreds at this point after Order 66 so there aren't many to be on the lookout for. Also, not knowing exactly which Jedi survived O66, makes it hard to put out APBs on them. They aren't just going to stay in their Jedi attire either. Yes, Yoda and Obi-Wan did, but Yoda was all by himself and Obi-Wan happened to get a place where what the Jedi wore was pretty standard attire. Still, even on a civilized planet in a galaxy with a population in the hundreds of trillions, a hundred guys in robes aren't really going to stand out.

Really, the only give away is the lightsaber. Ditch that and you are good to go. Hell, even blood tests aren't a guarantee. There are bound to be people with high midichlorian counts floating around that don't happen to be Jedi.

The Romulan Republic wrote:

PainRack wrote: Dark Lord also shows us what some Jedi did upon receiving the recall message

Seriously, Baffalo, read Dark Lord if you haven't already.

The fate of some other Jedi is covered elsewhere. For example, I think Shak-Ti goes down in The Force Unleashed, though as I recall that contradicts the Revenge of the Sith novel so it might not be canon.

I've avoided EU for a while, which is why I'm not up to date. I think the Dark Nest (is that right? The one with the bugs?) trilogy burned me out on the EU. Seriously, a bunch of bugs? Taking over the minds of Jedi and making them fucking hippies with mind link? What the holy fuck!?! And then Jason becoming a Sith Lord for no other reason than he's a winy bitch who likes it when someone spanks him too hard.

Havok wrote:Well for one, Obi-Wan and Yoda countermanded the recall message, so that isn't an issue.

"A young Jedi named Darth Vader, who was a pupil of mine until he turned to evil, helped the Empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi Knights. ... Now the Jedi are all but extinct."

EU garbage aside, this is exactly what happened. Vader had access to pretty much all information on the Jedi, last known whereabouts, assignments etc.. Given the nature of the Jedi, most wouldn't just abandon their current missions to go into hiding so they would be easy to find and those that did manage to get lost were all found and whacked by the time of Ep. IV.

As for your other questions, the Jedi number in the hundreds at this point after Order 66 so there aren't many to be on the lookout for. Also, not knowing exactly which Jedi survived O66, makes it hard to put out APBs on them. They aren't just going to stay in their Jedi attire either. Yes, Yoda and Obi-Wan did, but Yoda was all by himself and Obi-Wan happened to get a place where what the Jedi wore was pretty standard attire. Still, even on a civilized planet in a galaxy with a population in the hundreds of trillions, a hundred guys in robes aren't really going to stand out.

Really, the only give away is the lightsaber. Ditch that and you are good to go. Hell, even blood tests aren't a guarantee. There are bound to be people with high midichlorian counts floating around that don't happen to be Jedi.

I never really liked the whole 'Jedi Robes are a uniform thing'. I mean, ok sure, the robes might not be the most comfortable and maybe even itchy, and that teaches you concentration and what not, but really? Fucking robes like that? Luke at least had enough fashion sense to wear something he could move around in. First time you try running through an engine space with whirring machinery in something like those robes, your ass is getting pulled into an engine and you come out the end as a fine red mist.

Anyway, in regards to the topic at hand, I don't know if the statement Obi Wan made was accurate simply because he's a hermit who doesn't get a lot of news. Granted, he does have the Force, and I'm not sure how good his plan is if he can just dial up his buddies and see what's going down. If I went out and built a shack somewhere and lived there for about 25 years and came out, I don't know what I'd think. Just saying.

And in regards to stormtroopers and even the Emperor's Hands, do you think they had specific orders that if they found any Jedi, they were to immediately start shooting them? Or was that an order that just kind of went away after a while? Is it covered in the little booklet they give at Stormtrooper camp that anyone wearing robes like a Jedi with a shiny metal cylinder must be shot on sight? I wonder if it's next to the page that tells you how to miss the broadside of a planet?

Hmm, I thought I remembered a passage in the novel (RotS) were it was postulated that some of the surviving Jedi would just stop being Jedi. Seing what happened, seeing how their Order was destroyed and Jedi outlawed, they'd settle down in hiding and try to live a 'normal' life.

Havok wrote:Well for one, Obi-Wan and Yoda countermanded the recall message, so that isn't an issue.

"A young Jedi named Darth Vader, who was a pupil of mine until he turned to evil, helped the Empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi Knights. ... Now the Jedi are all but extinct."

EU garbage aside, this is exactly what happened. Vader had access to pretty much all information on the Jedi, last known whereabouts, assignments etc.. Given the nature of the Jedi, most wouldn't just abandon their current missions to go into hiding so they would be easy to find and those that did manage to get lost were all found and whacked by the time of Ep. IV.

Pretty much. It's not unreasonable to suppose that a small fraction survived- a few percent who happened to be on assignments that gave them a chance to run from the nearest clonetroopers rather than just being lured into an overwhelming ambush.

But, naturally, any survivors would be the ones who managed to lay low and blend in, or who were living like a hermit (the strategy used by Yoda and Obi-Wan).

As for your other questions, the Jedi number in the hundreds at this point after Order 66 so there aren't many to be on the lookout for. Also, not knowing exactly which Jedi survived O66, makes it hard to put out APBs on them.

...Wouldn't they be able to get reports back from the clonetroopers on which Jedi had been killed in fairly short order?

Baffalo wrote:I never really liked the whole 'Jedi Robes are a uniform thing'. I mean, ok sure, the robes might not be the most comfortable and maybe even itchy, and that teaches you concentration and what not, but really? Fucking robes like that? Luke at least had enough fashion sense to wear something he could move around in. First time you try running through an engine space with whirring machinery in something like those robes, your ass is getting pulled into an engine and you come out the end as a fine red mist.

If they're a uniform, I think they're a semi-formal one, ceremonial as much as practical. If you look at the prequels, you see a lot of Jedi wearing more practical clothes, as I recall. Anakin, for one, and he's far from the only example.

Jedi wear their robes all the time in the Temple, but that's no surprise.

Anyway, in regards to the topic at hand, I don't know if the statement Obi Wan made was accurate simply because he's a hermit who doesn't get a lot of news. Granted, he does have the Force, and I'm not sure how good his plan is if he can just dial up his buddies and see what's going down. If I went out and built a shack somewhere and lived there for about 25 years and came out, I don't know what I'd think. Just saying.

That's true. And Obi-Wan's explanation of what happened to the Jedi (and, for that matter, Yoda's) were vague enough that we can reasonably suppose they honestly didn't know about a handful of other Jedi who happened to be out there. Yoda and Obi-Wan only knew about each other because after the Purge they put their heads together and came up with a plan. Between the new-Imperial military being on the lookout for any unexpected transmissions and the Force's abilities as a reliable long range communicator being doubtful, it would be no surprise if they lost touch with a few old friends who were trying the same "lie low" strategy somewhere completely different.

I remember that on at least one occasion some survivor ambushed and tried to kill Vader (on Kessel eight of them managed to subdue him at the cost of three of them before the 501 Legion appeared and killed the five).

I believe that the Jedi that did escape Order 66 would obviously be in hiding. But I always see a lot of people think that they are secretly trying to stop the Empire. I personally feel that maybe some of them said, hey! Fuck the Republic! Meaning that they found somewhere and wanted to make a new life for themselves and not deal with the Empire.

If you look at it from a different perspective, maybe they thought the then Republic was messed up anyway and not even worth saving. Count Dooku knew that the Republic was messed up. He also said in AOTC that if Qui Gon was still alive he would have joined him. So to me that would imply that Qui Gon(being Dooku's padawan) must have talked about the problems within the Republic. So I would assume there were other disenfranchised Jedi as well.

Now with the new canon being created, we already have 3 more Jedi that survived being Ahsoka, Kanan and Ezra. Even though Ezra is a student of one of the survivors. I am willing to bet that there will be more as time goes on. I am just one that believes that not every Jedi will become some rebel and try to take down the Empire and re establish the Republic.

Baffalo wrote: I've avoided EU for a while, which is why I'm not up to date. I think the Dark Nest (is that right? The one with the bugs?) trilogy burned me out on the EU. Seriously, a bunch of bugs? Taking over the minds of Jedi and making them fucking hippies with mind link? What the holy fuck!?! And then Jason becoming a Sith Lord for no other reason than he's a winy bitch who likes it when someone spanks him too hard.

I think the novel EU got way too attached to it's 'dark' big plot arcs. I wasn't fond of them.

The comic side was a fair bit better- to the point when people complained Jacen's fall *made no sense*, in the next story arc they retconned in a new reason stealing a villain from the comics.

Baffalo wrote:And then Jason becoming a Sith Lord for no other reason than he's a winy bitch who likes it when someone spanks him too hard.

Sounds quite realistic actually. Think about it. When have you last heard of a great hero heroically accomplishing things and than suddenly turning evil for no good reason. It's always some underachieving kid who has more power than brains and thus feels entitled.

Knife wrote:Hmm, I thought I remembered a passage in the novel (RotS) were it was postulated that some of the surviving Jedi would just stop being Jedi. Seing what happened, seeing how their Order was destroyed and Jedi outlawed, they'd settle down in hiding and try to live a 'normal' life.

Yeah, I was just hunting for that quote, may be in the old EU Dark Lord book. but it does make sense. Your order is destroyed, your civilization destroyed, your infrastructure destroyed, all by the Enemy. You're surrounded, no opposition to join up with, just blend into the populace and lay low.

At first I could see it as a survival tactic, but then after a decade, you just live the life you forged.

Another thing to consider is that a Jedi acting within a resistance cell is probably more of a liability than an asset. Sure force powers help a lot and the inclusion of a Jedi brings legitimacy to the group and raises morale. But at the same time it makes said group a prime target for imperial forces even if they would otherwise not have been. A minor rebel cell or resistance movement could operate under the nose of local authorities for years. Especially if these are incompetent. But once the word spreads that a Jedi is with them odds are someone scary in a black suit of armor is going to come along to deal with it. So a Jedi would have motivation not to get involved and publicly reveal his presence lest he draw unwanted attention of who ever he considers to be the good guys.

Knife wrote:

Knife wrote:Hmm, I thought I remembered a passage in the novel (RotS) were it was postulated that some of the surviving Jedi would just stop being Jedi. Seing what happened, seeing how their Order was destroyed and Jedi outlawed, they'd settle down in hiding and try to live a 'normal' life.

Yeah, I was just hunting for that quote, may be in the old EU Dark Lord book. but it does make sense. Your order is destroyed, your civilization destroyed, your infrastructure destroyed, all by the Enemy. You're surrounded, no opposition to join up with, just blend into the populace and lay low.

At first I could see it as a survival tactic, but then after a decade, you just live the life you forged.

I do recall that as the ending of that book. It featured a group of Jedi that survived Order 66 attempting to link up and do something together. After getting the only Master among the group killed, the survivors recognize that they must stop being Jedi. Several of them make connections with what would eventually be the Rebel Alliance but they serve in a capacity as normal humans rather than as Jedi. The main surviving character even recognizes that she needs to abandon the Jedi Code and begins a romance with the team slicer that had always liked her.

Purple wrote:Another thing to consider is that a Jedi acting within a resistance cell is probably more of a liability than an asset. Sure force powers help a lot and the inclusion of a Jedi brings legitimacy to the group and raises morale. But at the same time it makes said group a prime target for imperial forces even if they would otherwise not have been. A minor rebel cell or resistance movement could operate under the nose of local authorities for years. Especially if these are incompetent. But once the word spreads that a Jedi is with them odds are someone scary in a black suit of armor is going to come along to deal with it. So a Jedi would have motivation not to get involved and publicly reveal his presence lest he draw unwanted attention of who ever he considers to be the good guys.

Wasn't this a major plot point in Rebels season 2? It is too bad that Kanan and Ezra in Rebels never realized this exactly. Instead of abandoning their tradition they even add Ashoka to their group, which makes them an even larger target. At least she is actually tough enough to take on virtually any Inquisitors. Though that should serve to make Vader even more interested. Realistically*, it should be a matter of time before Vader hunts her down.

* As odd as it is to use that term when discussing SW.

Knife wrote: Yeah, I was just hunting for that quote, may be in the old EU Dark Lord book. but it does make sense. Your order is destroyed, your civilization destroyed, your infrastructure destroyed, all by the Enemy. You're surrounded, no opposition to join up with, just blend into the populace and lay low.

At first I could see it as a survival tactic, but then after a decade, you just live the life you forged.

Right. A number of Jedi would go native after 10, 15, 20 years. Kanan and Ahsoka who were young at the start of the purge was able to get back in the game, but if you're near 30 when starting out, do you pop up again when you're in the mid 40s? Especially with the most impulsive Jedi being the first to be caught.


EU, a couple of the eventually-found survivors did lay low through the whole thing.

Let's not discount the fact that the new EU showed us that the clonetroopers were not only indoctrinated, but were implanted with failsafe inhibitor chips to compel their obedience. Hence, in the new EU, there's far less of a chance that any clones overcame their indoctrination and allowed their Jedi commanders to escape.

Galvatron wrote:Let's not discount the fact that the new EU showed us that the clonetroopers were not only indoctrinated, but were implanted with failsafe inhibitor chips to compel their obedience. Hence, in the new EU, there's far less of a chance that any clones overcame their indoctrination and allowed their Jedi commanders to escape.

Was it ever explained how Kanan survived it?

Yes, in the comic book miniseries about him. Specifically, issue #2.