Hoth

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-04-12 05:54pm

I know this has probably been beaten to death for all eternity, but when I tried the search function of the forum, it yielded no results.

What was the reason for the lack of air support on Hoth? Was it because it was too cold or some other reason?

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2003-04-12 05:57pm

Mike nuked the search function a while back, so that you can only find posts made after a certain point.

I doubt the TIEs could have survived in the frigid atmosphere.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-04-12 05:59pm

I thought it was the theater shield...same reason we didn't see droid starfighters at the ground Battle of Naboo. No ground pressure, no passing through shield (best hypothesis I've seen yet). The TIEs were likely waiting for the generators to go down to perform strafing runs, but then got reassigned to try to intercept the fleeing freighters.

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-04-12 06:01pm

IRG CommandoJoe wrote:I know this has probably been beaten to death for all eternity, but when I tried the search function of the forum, it yielded no results.

What was the reason for the lack of air support on Hoth? Was it because it was too cold or some other reason?

The cold was probably a factor in that since even if designed to operate in space a vehicle might not be ready to handle wind chill factors. The other is the Rebels shield apparently it made it difficult to get ties into the battle area. The truth of the matter is that the Empire did not take the time to configure their fighters to operate in a polar envoriment and neither did the Rebels, since the Empire did not have repulsorlift vehicles, they did not have air units that could support their walkers. The Walkers did a pretty good job of taking out the Rebel "SnowSpeeders."

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-04-12 06:08pm

Ok thanks. Too bad about the search function though...

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2003-04-12 06:08pm

Why would fighters designed to operate in a VACUUM care about temperature? It was warm enough for the Rebel Troops to survive.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-04-12 06:22pm

Grand Admiral Thrawn wrote:Why would fighters designed to operate in a VACUUM care about temperature? It was warm enough for the Rebel Troops to survive.

Because in atmoshpere theres conduction to take into account as well. That means you loose heat faster than you would in vacuum.

And it's obvious that they had trouble in the extreme cold regardless. After all, the Snow Speeders had trouble. If their repulsers didn't work a TIE would never fly.

Wild Karrde · Post by **Wild Karrde** » 2003-04-12 07:29pm

And it's obvious that they had trouble in the extreme cold regardless. After all, the Snow Speeders had trouble. If their repulsers didn't work a TIE would never fly.

Not necessarily, the snow speeders were originally civilian air-speeders and were essentially just that at Hoth with the exception of the harpoon, some armor, and laser cannons.

IIRC the reason that the rebels had so much trouble getting them adapted to the cold was due to a problem with the heat sinks drawing too much heat for operation in Hoth's arctic conditions.

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2003-04-12 07:34pm

Wow, Wild Karrde posted. He's always on, but never posts.

The reason for the lack of TIEs would be the shield. EpII ICS:

"the high-velocity exhausts that drive a speeder or starship are stifled by particle shields." -P. 28

Soontir C'boath · Post by **Soontir C'boath** » 2003-04-12 07:54pm

Wild Karrde wrote:IIRC the reason that the rebels had so much trouble getting them adapted to the cold was due to a problem with the heat sinks drawing too much heat for operation in Hoth's arctic conditions.

Actually, it's because the Heat Sinks did TOO GOOD of a job getting rid of the heat, in which would result in having the engine of a craft dead cold.

Wow, Wild Karrde posted. He's always on, but never posts.

Same thing for me

Cyaround,
Jason

Wild Karrde · Post by **Wild Karrde** » 2003-04-12 08:01pm

Darth Garden Gnome wrote:Wow, Wild Karrde posted. He's always on, but never posts.

Oh no I've been spotted!:shock:

*Runs around room in panic managing to accomplish nothing except repeatedly slamming into a wall like a fly agaisnst a closed window*

Anyway...I finally decided to post and join the madness, besides it only took me about a year to get around to it.

Wild Karrde · Post by **Wild Karrde** » 2003-04-12 08:06pm

Soontir C'boath wrote:
Wild Karrde wrote:IIRC the reason that the rebels had so much trouble getting them adapted to the cold was due to a problem with the heat sinks drawing too much heat for operation in Hoth's arctic conditions.

Actually, it's because the Heat Sinks did TOO GOOD of a job getting rid of the heat, in which would result in having the engine of a craft dead cold.
Yeah that's what I meant, it's just that I'm horrible at putting words to type, kinda like I'm talking outta my ass!

*WHEE*

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2003-04-12 08:07pm

Well you were right about the madness part....

Wild Karrde · Post by **Wild Karrde** » 2003-04-12 08:14pm

Darth Garden Gnome wrote:Well you were right about the madness part....

Madness! that's crazy talk. Now, get over here so I can drill your skull for magical lucky charms.

Wild Karrde · Post by **Wild Karrde** » 2003-04-12 08:28pm

Back to the topic at hand... the reason that the X-wings weren't providing cover was for a couple of reasons:

1. They had the snowspeeders, why waste FTL capable starfighters for something that was to serve as nothing but a delaying tatic.

2. The X-wings were needed to protect the transports. Sure two X-wings per transport wouldn't matter much to a squadron of Ties but it would force the Ties to pay them some attention giving the transport time to jump to hyperspace.

3. Also the X-wings might not have been much more useful then the snowspeeders. Depending on how powerful their torps were they might not have been able to use them due to friendly-fire concerns and not to mention the rebellion needed all the torps it could get.

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-04-13 02:07am

The Episode 2 ICS states that using spacefaring craft underneath a theatre shield isn't safe. There are harmful 'interactions' to think about.

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-04-13 02:10am

Wild Karrde wrote:Madness! that's crazy talk. Now, get over here so I can drill your skull for magical lucky charms.

He a Gnome not a Leprecan! Picking on a Gnome will only get you cursed!

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-04-13 02:13am

Stormbringer wrote:
Grand Admiral Thrawn wrote:Why would fighters designed to operate in a VACUUM care about temperature? It was warm enough for the Rebel Troops to survive.
Because in atmoshpere theres conduction to take into account as well. That means you loose heat faster than you would in vacuum.

And it's obvious that they had trouble in the extreme cold regardless. After all, the Snow Speeders had trouble. If their repulsers didn't work a TIE would never fly.

there is another reason. It is called Icing. Its doubtful a Spaceship would be equipt with de-icing equiptment without these it will accumilate ice as it flies around and crash from the extra weight.

Sokar · Post by **Sokar** » 2003-04-13 02:27am

The presence of the Theater Shield is what did it. Gen. Veers transports were forced to land outside of the shield and then the AT-AT's were forced to march to within firing distance of the primary power generators. Secondary landings of more Stormtroopers and Lord Vader could then commence. The TIE squadrons though were absent even after this, I would imagine that they were busy attempting to run down the escaping transports prior to their jumps into hyperspace, rather than be diverted to cover an already secured Rebel Base.

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2003-04-13 02:30am

An interesting thought; if the theatre shield prevented TIEs from being used, why did the Rebel snowspeeders still work?

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-04-13 02:32am

Darth Garden Gnome wrote:An interesting thought; if the theatre shield prevented TIEs from being used, why did the Rebel snowspeeders still work?

Because, my learned friend, snowspeeders are repulsor craft, not space faring, ion engine fighters.

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2003-04-13 02:36am

Vympel wrote:Because, my learned friend, snowspeeders are repulsor craft, not space faring, ion engine fighters.

TIEs have repulors too.

Also, "the high-velocity exhausts that drive aspeederor starship are stifled by particle shields." -P. 28 of the EpII ICS.

Robert Treder · Post by **Robert Treder** » 2003-04-13 03:19am

Darth Garden Gnome wrote:
Vympel wrote:Because, my learned friend, snowspeeders are repulsor craft, not space faring, ion engine fighters.
TIEs have repulors too.

Also, "the high-velocity exhausts that drive aspeederor starship are stifled by particle shields." -P. 28 of the EpII ICS.

The speeders didn't have to cross the barrier of the theatre shield, whereas the TIES would have. If the shield is not volumetric, this could be the reason for the absence of Imperial air support.
Although, the Imps could in theory have brought in large grounded carriers which disengorge their fighters once through the shield. This, obviously, was deemed unnecessary by the Imperials. They likely did not anticipate the harpoon cable tactics.

Wild Karrde · Post by **Wild Karrde** » 2003-04-13 03:23am

Isolder74 wrote:
Wild Karrde wrote:Madness! that's crazy talk. Now, get over here so I can drill your skull for magical lucky charms.
He a Gnome not a Leprecan! Picking on a Gnome will only get you cursed!

Oh please that's only a myth.

*Continues to drill through the Gnome's head ignoring Isolder74's warning*

See I told you nothing bad would happen.

*Walks off only to be struck by lighting every few steps*

Isolder74:Told you so!

WildKarrde:Quiet you.

*Dusts himself off and wanders away only to be instantly vaporised by several tubrolaser bolts*

And the moral of this story: Never drill through a Gnome's head for something when you can achieve the same thing with several boxes of breakfast cereal and a Richard Nixon mask.

Wild Karrde · Post by **Wild Karrde** » 2003-04-13 03:36am

Robert Treder wrote:
Darth Garden Gnome wrote:
Vympel wrote:Because, my learned friend, snowspeeders are repulsor craft, not space faring, ion engine fighters.
TIEs have repulors too.

Also, "the high-velocity exhausts that drive aspeederor starship are stifled by particle shields." -P. 28 of the EpII ICS.
The speeders didn't have to cross the barrier of the theatre shield, whereas the TIES would have. If the shield is not volumetric, this could be the reason for the absence of Imperial air support.
Although, the Imps could in theory have brought in large grounded carriers which disengorge their fighters once through the shield. This, obviously, was deemed unnecessary by the Imperials. They likely did not anticipate the harpoon cable tactics.

It could have also been as simple as the Ties being deemed unnecessary.
Let's assume the sheild stopped them. When it was brought down the rebel's were already in full retreat and the Imperials had already taken the base. the rebel soldiers were being taken care by the AT-ATs and AT-STs and the heavy weapons the rebels were using agaisnt the AT-ATs was quickly abandoned when the shield came down. The Ties were most likely rerouted to take out the rebel transports.

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