Page 1 of 1
B-wings
Posted: 2002-09-05 11:42pm
by AL
on Saxton's page I was looking at the B-wing model and counted at least nine guns on the fighter maybe 10. Now i remember a post which i took part in a month or so ago about tie interceptors having 10 laser cannons and most just couldnt believe that, but the B-wing has a large number of weapons. What for? to inflict more damage against a capital ship and against an enemy fighter? Who knows I personally like the first one.
Posted: 2002-09-05 11:45pm
by Master of Ossus
B-Wings and TIE Interceptors are designed for different things. B-Wings are heavy assault fighters, designed to go up against capital ships and deal damage to them. They have very heavy firepower, armor, and shields. They lack speed and maneuverability. My initial reluctance to accept the 10 lasers on TIE Interceptors was because the TIE Interceptor is a space superiority fighter that is designed to combat other starfighters. As a result, it will need greater acceleration and maneuverability than a B-Wing. In order to increase speed and maneuverability, generally firepower and protection must be traded off. That was why I initially did not believe that the TIE Interceptor could have that much firepower.
Posted: 2002-09-06 12:59am
by AL
Author Message
Master of Ossus Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2002 10:45 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
B-Wings and TIE Interceptors are designed for different things. B-Wings are heavy assault fighters, designed to go up against capital ships and deal damage to them. They have very heavy firepower, armor, and shields. They lack speed and maneuverability. My initial reluctance to accept the 10 lasers on TIE Interceptors was because the TIE Interceptor is a space superiority fighter that is designed to combat other starfighters. As a result, it will need greater acceleration and maneuverability than a B-Wing. In order to increase speed and maneuverability, generally firepower and protection must be traded off. That was why I initially did not believe that the TIE Interceptor could have that much firepower.
and what do you say now?
Posted: 2002-09-06 01:15am
by Cal Wright
That because of the role the TIE Interceptor often plays, it more than likely does not have more than the four wing tipped lasers. Where as, I believe the B-Wing has three laser cannons and three ion cannons. From models I would suspect more. However, the B-Wing is a heavy bomber, versus an interceptor.
Posted: 2002-09-06 01:40am
by Sardaukar
I don't understand how you guys can automatically assume that something is a gun based solely on it's appearance. Until it's officially stated that a B-Wing has X number of guns I will assume that anything that isn't specifically labelled as a gun, in whatever canon/official resource, is not a gun.
Posted: 2002-09-06 01:47am
by Sea Skimmer
Sardaukar wrote:I don't understand how you guys can automatically assume that something is a gun based solely on it's appearance. Until it's officially stated that a B-Wing has X number of guns I will assume that anything that isn't specifically labelled as a gun, in whatever canon/official resource, is not a gun.
Unless someone can come up with a better explanation, there's not much reason not to make the assumption. IDS's have only been seen firing IIRC 31 different turbolasers, yet nearly 200 can be counted on the model, does that mean we should only accept those guns that we saw firing as real, even if the others match in appearance and location exactly?
One of them might actually be an air data sensor for atmospheric flight, but beyond that, what else would the others be other then weapons?
Posted: 2002-09-06 03:05am
by Sardaukar
Sea Skimmer wrote:
Unless someone can come up with a better explanation, there's not much reason not to make the assumption. IDS's have only been seen firing IIRC 31 different turbolasers, yet nearly 200 can be counted on the model, does that mean we should only accept those guns that we saw firing as real, even if the others match in appearance and location exactly?
One of them might actually be an air data sensor for atmospheric flight, but beyond that, what else would the others be other then weapons?
The could be any number of kinds of sensors. Radiation, targetting, whatever.
We didn't actually see (as far as I can recall) a B-Wing fire in the movie at all. But I wouldn't go as far as to say that they therefore have no guns, just that not everything that looks like a gun is a gun.
They could be guns, the size of the B-Wing would probably allow for whatever weapons power/support systems they'd need, but I am personally reluctant to adopt the idea until I have more proof other than "they
look like guns".
BTW Hello everyone on this board, I've been lurking in asvs for a few years, but have recently decided to ignore the whole vs. debate and stick to Star Wars. Seeing as the debate was won years ago
Posted: 2002-09-06 03:22am
by Sea Skimmer
Sardaukar wrote:Sea Skimmer wrote:
Unless someone can come up with a better explanation, there's not much reason not to make the assumption. IDS's have only been seen firing IIRC 31 different turbolasers, yet nearly 200 can be counted on the model, does that mean we should only accept those guns that we saw firing as real, even if the others match in appearance and location exactly?
One of them might actually be an air data sensor for atmospheric flight, but beyond that, what else would the others be other then weapons?
The could be any number of kinds of sensors. Radiation, targetting, whatever.
Except things like fire control systems have been identified in official works several times, and look nothing like laser cannons.
Posted: 2002-09-06 06:54am
by SPOOFE
Wrong, Sea Skimmer. Go grab the Episode I ICS and look up the entry for the AAT. On each of the two side-mounted secondary turrets, below the lase gun itself, are two protrusions that do look like they could be laser weapons. However, they are identified as "rangefinders". So just because there's a cylinder protruding out from a ship, don't assume it's a gun.
Posted: 2002-09-06 07:55am
by Mr Bean
Indeed
Posted: 2002-09-06 09:37am
by Sea Skimmer
SPOOFE wrote:Wrong, Sea Skimmer. Go grab the Episode I ICS and look up the entry for the AAT. On each of the two side-mounted secondary turrets, below the lase gun itself, are two protrusions that do look like they could be laser weapons. However, they are identified as "rangefinders". So just because there's a cylinder protruding out from a ship, don't assume it's a gun.
N, I think ill continue to assume they are, since the AT-AT rangefinders are short stubby things which bear only a passing resemblance to the blasters there coaxial with, and because such things have never been shown on a Star fighter.
Star Fighter sensors and targeting systems have been shown as internal arrays or hull conformal panels.
Posted: 2002-09-06 10:35am
by SirNitram
The reason we assume they are laser cannons is.. And this is going to shock you.. They are visually identical to the four wing mounted guns. This is not passing similarity or similar. This is looking identical. Should we assume a turret mount is a weather sensor just because it would leave the ISD with a large number of guns?
Posted: 2002-09-06 11:37am
by Knife
Looking at various publicity shoots of the models, one can also find a small tube like structure above and below the laser cannon on a A wing.
I can not remember the A wing firing more than one shot per side durring the Battel of Endor. This was a large battle and if they had a total of six lasers, they would have used them. Since they did not I can only assume(don't like that word, assume makes an Ass of U and ME) they are not weapons but sensors of some sort. Being next to the laser cannon, one could reasonably conclude that they are range finders or other active targeting arrays. Hell for all I know they could be gun camera's.
This is on the A wing, so if they are sensors, the protusions on the B wing would not be weapons necessarly.
Granted that the picture I have is from Shane Johnson's Technical Journal, and I disregaurd most of the info in it, but the picture is one from the model. I've also seen the picture in other forms of media, so unless I am wrong in its origin the protusions on the fighters do not need to be the barrels of cannons.
Posted: 2002-09-06 11:10pm
by RayCav of ASVS
Really, we shouldn't assume that they all are guns. After all, someone really really dumb on planes might mistake a friggin PITOT TUBE for a machine gun!
Posted: 2002-09-06 11:59pm
by Darth Yoshi
All the sources I've seen show the guns below the cockpit as ion cannons, with one blaster on each wingtip.
Posted: 2002-09-07 01:25am
by Guest
The B-wing is an awesome starfighter. It has always been my favorite Rebel Alliance fighter. Unfortunately, it never received a lot of screen time.
Posted: 2002-09-07 02:14am
by Sardaukar
Looking at my Hasbro B-Wing (it seems accurate enough when comparing to the photos) There are 6 large cylinders and 6 small cylinders.
2 medium/small and 2 small on the nose
1 large and 1 small on the s-foils
2 large and 2 small at the wingtip on the "bottom"
To me it seems that there are 6 guns, each with a corresponding targetting sensor (or whatever, but this makes sense to me.
Posted: 2002-09-07 04:56pm
by Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi
Some of them are sensors, rangefinders, or ion cannons. Since we never see the B-wing in action in the movies, this can be accepted, unlike the TIE Interceptor, which we see.
The Truth about the B-Wing
Posted: 2002-09-08 12:01pm
by Wicked Pilot
All armament statistics originated with WEG, the B-wing never fires its armament on-screen (some stills exist that suggest the B-wing would have gotten more screen time at Endor, however according to SW.com its narrow profile made it hard to see on film so these sequences were cut. It's unknown if they survived).
HOWEVER:
The film model shows FOUR cannon in the nose, one in each small wing, and two at the end of the main wing spar. There is evidence that one proton torpedo launcher is nestled between the twin pods immediately above the engine block (namely, what seems to be heavy blast scoring similar to what's found on the X-wing's torpedo launchers) however NONE exists of the second torpedo launcher supposedly located in the weapons pod at the end of the main wing.
Unfortunately the quality of these guns is purely guesswork as, like I stated above, the B-wing never fires on film.
In addition, this is the armament for ALL B-wings shown on film, proving that THIS is the fighter's armament regardless of what WEG or other sources say. The number of cannons combined with the lack of evidence of a second torpedo launcher suggests that the B-wing is a GUNSHIP, NOT a bomber, much like the AC-130.
The "modular weapons" thing is bullshit cooked up by secondary sources to cover the conflicting armament of other secondary sources. Study of the B-wing effects model shows those guns could NOT be removed.
Further weaponry analysis:
The cannon at the end of each small wing are DIFFERENT than the two identifiable laser cannon at the end of the main wing spar, suggesting that whatever cannon are located in the main wing are NOT the same type as the S-foil cannon, therefore there can NOT be three ion cannon unless the third located at the tip of the main wing is a different type! In addition, the two S-foil cannon appear to have a series of openings AROUND the truncated cone-shaped structure at the firing tip. The only other cannon known to have multiple openings in the muzzle are the Falcon's quad guns, where each barrel has two openings. Could this mean, then, that the S-FOIL cannon are also lasers? Unknown for sure, but given that the only other known cannon with multiple muzzle openings are the Falcon's quad lasers it's quite possible. Why the B-wing's appear to have so many is unknown
The B-wing shows three smaller structures which COULD be small guns, commonly labeled as "targeting sensors." The A-wing features similar equipment, so this may remain a viable description.
The B-wing's largest cannon, located at the tip of the main wing and offset slightly to port, bears a strong resemblence to the A-wing's twin laser cannon however is MUCH larger. The appearance, combined with its size seems to support the "heavy laser" definition.
The light cannon in the nose at least APPEAR to slightly resemble the barrels of the Falcon's quad guns (note however I make this observation off a somewhat blurry image). This suggests a laser cannon of some sort, their diminuitve size indicates short-range and low-power. Their location suggests that the B-wing would use these for defense against hostile starfighters as the wing cannon are too awkwardly placed for dogfighting. They likely have a high rate of fire.
There is no resemblence between the B-wing's three other wing guns (S-foil and the smaller main wing cannon) and any other starfighter weaponry. However the ring-like collar around the second large cannon in the main wing is most like a similar structure on the X-wing's laser cannon attached to the concave strip (WEG labels this "collar" a "gate coupling"). The structure is smaller in the B-wing, however, but may indicate that this is ALSO a laser cannon of some sort. Size (particularly muzzle diameter) suggests a fairly hefty weapon.
Extensive blast scoring between the two pods immediately above the engine block is the only evidence existing of a torpedo launcher, none can be found in the main wing pod, nor is their structural evidence of a launcher to be found there. The upper area is only large enough to house one launcher.
My estimated armament:
Fixed
4x light laser cannon (nose)
2x laser cannon (S-foils)
2x heavy laser cannon (main wing)
Ordinance
1x proton torpedo launcher (above engine block)
Posted: 2002-09-08 12:19pm
by 2000AD
According to The Essential Guide to Vehicles and Vessels:
"In standard configuration, each secondary wing has one ion cannon, with a third ion cannon located at the base of the main wing. A laser cannon and an emmision-type proton-torpedo launcher are also mounted on the end of it's main wing. The engines sit just above the extending wings with another proton-torpedo launcher immediately above the engines. A pair of auto-blasters are in the nose of the cockpit module; technicians can opt to mount up to four auto-blasters in the nose section.
B-Wing designers deliberately made the weapon-mounting points modular. Technicians can reconfigure autoblaster, laser-cannon, and ion-cannon mounts within a few hours."
Going by this source the B-wing carries:
3 ion-cannons
2-4 auto-blasters
1 laser-cannon
2 proton torpedo launchers
with the option to mix and match weapons. A most versatile fighter.
Posted: 2002-09-08 03:11pm
by Isolder74
2000AD wrote:According to The Essential Guide to Vehicles and Vessels:
"In standard configuration, each secondary wing has one ion cannon, with a third ion cannon located at the base of the main wing. A laser cannon and an emmision-type proton-torpedo launcher are also mounted on the end of it's main wing. The engines sit just above the extending wings with another proton-torpedo launcher immediately above the engines. A pair of auto-blasters are in the nose of the cockpit module; technicians can opt to mount up to four auto-blasters in the nose section.
B-Wing designers deliberately made the weapon-mounting points modular. Technicians can reconfigure autoblaster, laser-cannon, and ion-cannon mounts within a few hours."
Going by this source the B-wing carries:
3 ion-cannons
2-4 auto-blasters
1 laser-cannon
2 proton torpedo launchers
with the option to mix and match weapons. A most versatile fighter.
by an official source the B-Wing is armed better than some light warships. Also the ship is bigger than a Tie Interceptor and is is built around its hardpoints.
it has 4 hardpoints in the comand pod but usually mounts only 2 due to cost
it has 3 hardpoints on the end of the main wing these include the Main heavy blaster that is not modular, one torpedo tube, and a modular hardpoint that ussually has a Ion cannon
it has 1 modular hardpoints on each S-foil wing that ussualy has an ion cannon
Above the engine mount is 1 peminant torpedo tube + a hardpoint to attach a additional torpedo tube and extra ammo for the original tube. the new tube on one side the extra ammo on the other.
this is not bad for a fighter that is designed to kill capitol ships but it has its tradeoffs. Its slow and very unwieldy so it needs to be escorted to its target but what bomber wouldn't. As most of it weapons are optimized to kill capitol ships its not really a good dogfighter
Posted: 2002-09-08 09:52pm
by Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi
Perhaps, it could have been made to succeed the Y-wing, or a partner to it in capital ship assault. The B-wing uses torps, and the Y-wing uses .
Posted: 2002-09-09 05:48am
by EmperorMing
From what I have read the B-wing was designed for cap ship assaults.
Posted: 2002-09-09 12:29pm
by Isolder74
EmperorMing wrote:From what I have read the B-wing was designed for cap ship assaults.
It was cause the Rebels don't have lots of Capitol Ships to take on Imperial Warships they made a really big fighter that could
