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I thought these guys were supposed to be the ultimate badasses the Empire had to offer. But it seems like most of them were petulant little childs, incompetent, or just achieved the title by making some delicious new weapon (which makes you wonder if Tarkin would've achieved Grand Admiral status).

There seemed to be few if any military geniuses amongst their ranks. What's the deal?

Some of them are self-titled after the fall of the Empire. I seem to recall reading (somewhere) that Thrawn was the only legitimate Grand Admiral to survive the Republic's illegitimate seizure of old Imperial territories after Palpatine's death. Can anyone support this, or am I remembering a false memory?

I seem to recall reading (somewhere) that Thrawn was the only legitimate Grand Admiral to survive the Republic's illegitimate seizure of old Imperial territories after Palpatine's death. Can anyone support this, or am I remembering a false memory?

Thrawn was the last remaining Grand Admiral after the fall of Coruscant. In the EU, he was given the title in a private ceremony on Coruscant by the Emperor himself. I think this was in "The Last Command". There is a quote somewhere in the Zahn trilogy where Han says something like: "I thought we got all of them" after finding out that they're fighting a Grand Admiral.

There seemed to be few if any military geniuses amongst their ranks. What's the deal?

Maybe there were other prerequisites to fill besides being a tactical genius? Who were the others, anyway?

Wasn't Zaarin a Grand Admiral? His claim to fame was the TIE Avenger project.

Zaarin, Thrawn, Teshik, and Pitta seem to live up to their reputation as military geniuses.

Declann, Grant, Takel and Tingellinus were PERHAPS equal to them.

The rest can easily be feed to the dogs.

Referring to SW Insider #66, there were 13 Grand Admirals appointed by the Emperor. A circle of 12, and Thrawn was 13 after he killed Grand Admiral Zaarin.

A bit about each:

Grand Admiral Zaarin: Creator of the TIE-D, tried to overthrow the Emperor (didn't know you couldn't kill him). Thrawn let him steal a rigged cloaking device that destroyed his ship when he installed it.

Grand Admiral Thrawn: You know him, you love him, noghri killed him.

Grand Admiral Batch: Not a political man, developed a working cloaking device not vulnerable to double-blindness. His operations were destroyed by rebels, including his SSD. He fled, but was assasinated by his crew, who joined Warlord Harrsk.

Grand Admiral Declann: Dark force sith adept, used the Force-Meld on his pilots. Served in clone wars with distinction. A cruel and cunning man, he was on the second Death Star when the emperor died. Instead of fleeing, he was running to the Throne Room to avenge his master when the station exploded.

Grand Admiral Grant: The last Grand Admiral. A nobleman and a capable leader who didn't seek power, so he didn't have a safety net after Endor. 2 years after, he defected and gave up military secrets to the New Republic. He retired comfortably to Rathalay, surprised no one called him to fight Thrawn.

Grand Admiral Grunger: A greedy, cruel man, after Endor he built up a force to conquer Imperial Center. Ran into Grand Admiral Pitta, and the two destroyed each other.

Grand Admiral Il-Raz: A political appointee, loyal to the Empire, he had no military experience, and instead ran COMPNOR, carrying out missions for the Emperor. After Endor, he committed suicide.

Grand Admiral Makati: An admiral devoted to destroying a necromantic cult. He was loyal to whoever ruled Imperial Center, and after Endor went on Isard's permission to destroy religious fanatics trying to take over the Empire. Trapped in the Lost City of the Jedi for a while, he finally defeated his enemies shortly before comitting suicide.

Grand Admiral Pitta: Anti-Alien, with a bit of non-human in his DNA. Covered up by punishing aliens everywhere. He was given the job of depopulating alien homeworlds on the Outer Rim and enslaving them. After Endor he took over the Corellian sector, getting himself a torpedo sphere. In his fight against Grand Admiral Grunger, the sphere was destroyed when Grunger rammed it.

Grand Admiral Syn: Loyal to the Empire, taking the Emperor's doctrine for religion. He fought against rebel groups with distinction, and after Endor, converted to a dark-side cult. He hung around Kashyyyk, and was killed when the world was liberated by Admiral Ackbar.

Grand Admiral Takel: A rather "streetwise" admiral from lower-class, he was a man of lust, for all species of women. Also an expert strategist, sometimes enhancing his mind with glitterstim, which he used to read the fear and flee the second Death Star. He left Isard after failing her, and served under Trioculus. Glitterstim paranoia made him question the man too often, though, and he was executed.

Grand Admiral Teshik: The cyborg Grand Admiral, he had started out a caring and confident man. When he failed to exterminate a pirate mennace soon enough, the Emperor sent him to destroy the Hapan war fleet. He survived, but 75% of him was replaced by cybernetics, after this he severed his emotions. He managed to get off the crumbling Death Star, and directed the Battle of Endor for another 3 hours before Ion Cannons disabled his ship. He was executed for "Inhuman atrocities committed against the citizens of the galaxy", and died laughing.

Grand Admiral Tigellinus: A charismatic man who was friends Moff Disra and Thrawn. He betrayed Thrawn by engineering his exile to the unknown regions, and used the influence to become a Grand Moff over a large region of the Core. He refused to join the Central Committee after Endor, and was killed by his old friend, Moff Disra.

That's all, folks! Any other "Grand Admirals" were self-promotions.

I believe Paelleon was legitimatley promoted by the remaining moffs in the Imperial Remnant.

He was a "Vice-Admiral". He refused to take any other title, such was his reverence and respect for his former mentor, Grand Admiral Thrawn.

You sure, Im pretty sure in the latest book (book III i forget the title) he is referred to as GA.

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Referring to SW Insider #66, there were 13 Grand Admirals appointed by the Emperor. A circle of 12, and Thrawn was 13 after he killed Grand Admiral Zaarin.

Hmmmmm.........Seems a bit biblical to me.....

BlkbrryTheGreat wrote:You sure, Im pretty sure in the latest book (book III i forget the title) he is referred to as GA.

Was promoted to Grand Admiral by the time of NJO, not too much longer after being awarded the title "Supreme Commander" after the defeat of (shudder) Daala.

BlkbrryTheGreat wrote:I believe Paelleon was legitimatley promoted by the remaining moffs in the Imperial Remnant.

That is a preposterous suggestion. A Moff is of inferior rank to a grand admiral, and the idea that a group of Moffs can appoint an officer to a much higher rank is simply absurd. It is like suggesting that a committee of colonels could legitimately appoint a general.

While it is possible that "Grand Admiral" Pellaeon's promotion to that rank is legitimate within the context of the Imperial remnants, it is certainly a bastard promotion as far as the Galactic Empire is concerned. His last lawful rank in the service of the Galactic Empire was that of vice-admiral, and his rank of grand admiral is certainly not comparable to that enjoyed by the Emperor's chosen.

Publius

Moff's are also the govenors of the sectors remaining in the IR, its stated quite clearly in the NJO that the military is subordinate to them.

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Referring to SW Insider #66, there were 13 Grand Admirals appointed by the Emperor. A circle of 12, and Thrawn was 13 after he killed Grand Admiral Zaarin.

This is quite different than the TIE fighter game. Thrawn was promoted to Grand Admiral in the end of the first expansion set, which was before he hunted down Zaarin in the last battle. The dialogue of the Emperor indicates that Zaarin was kicked out once he betrayed.

Moffs are higher in rank than a Vice Admiral IMHO. In the Hand of Thrawn Duology Dissera(sp) was albe to dismiss Pellaeon on occasion even though it rankled Pellaeon. However in the HttE you never see Thrawn once even having contact with the surviving goverment of the Empire. My guess is that it was a 50/50 partnership between the Moff's and Pellaeon. Moffs don't do battles and Pellaeon self admitidly hated politics. He was very reluctant to take over from Daala.

Trytostaydead wrote:I thought these guys were supposed to be the ultimate badasses the Empire had to offer. But it seems like most of them were petulant little childs, incompetent, or just achieved the title by making some delicious new weapon (which makes you wonder if Tarkin would've achieved Grand Admiral status).

There seemed to be few if any military geniuses amongst their ranks. What's the deal?

The Grand Admiral's didn't really need to be that smart, since before Endor most military operations would be relatively minor and not require all that much influence from the by the Grand Admirals. They where simply an expedient to shorten the chain of command from Emperor to grunt. For that political reliability was probably the overriding concern. Though that didn't work out with Zaarin..

Lord Pounder wrote:Moffs are higher in rank than a Vice Admiral IMHO. In the Hand of Thrawn Duology Dissera(sp) was albe to dismiss Pellaeon on occasion even though it rankled Pellaeon.

Quite the contary in The same duology Pellaeon says he is only discussing the peace action with the moffs as a courtesy, being supreme commader means he can do anything on his own judgement

Lord Pounder wrote:Moffs are higher in rank than a Vice Admiral IMHO. In the Hand of Thrawn Duology Dissera(sp) was albe to dismiss Pellaeon on occasion even though it rankled Pellaeon. However in the HttE you never see Thrawn once even having contact with the surviving goverment of the Empire. My guess is that it was a 50/50 partnership between the Moff's and Pellaeon. Moffs don't do battles and Pellaeon self admitidly hated politics. He was very reluctant to take over from Daala.

Pellaeon wore the rank badge of a fleet admiral by the time of the peace treaty with the New Republic, and nominally had responsibility for all operations not falling under the areas of responsibility (AORs) of the Moffs, in their capacities as supreme commanders of the several sector commands. Although the original depiction of the Imperial remnants suggested a much closer balance of power between the Moff Council and the Supreme Commander, subsequent sources have revised this to make the latter into a military strongman and despot.

Publius