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Posted: **2003-12-12 11:57pm**

Over Thanksgiving dinner me and my cousin were talking about it, just speculation at this point. Guess we're gonna see him get his ass kicked majorly in the next episode while he kicks some major ass himself, but he said that he heard Vader fell into some lava once? As a GM in an RPG would you rule falling in lava is instant death, or heavy damage each round? Just in AD&D I saw these two different scenarios in the rules, one said the latter one said the former. Would it instantly destroy flesh and bone?

Posted: **2003-12-13 12:02am**

The only thing that allowed Anakin Skywalker to survive falling into the molten pit and crawl back out as Darth Vader was his grasp of the Force.

Posted: **2003-12-13 12:32am**

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:The only thing that allowed Anakin Skywalker to survive falling into the molten pit and crawl back out as Darth Vader was his grasp of the Force.

Ah, so it is true? What canon documentation is there on it? The comics perhaps? And, just how severe were his injuries, worse than a bacta tank could cure?

Posted: **2003-12-13 12:36am**

Vader's spinal cord was totally severed at a specific point, making him an immobile quadrapelegic who couldn't even breathe without his suit.

I suggest you read the following, facinating article:
http://www.theforce.net/swtc/injuries.html

Posted: **2003-12-13 12:44am**

Shrykull wrote:Over Thanksgiving dinner me and my cousin were talking about it, just speculation at this point. Guess we're gonna see him get his ass kicked majorly in the next episode while he kicks some major ass himself, but he said that he heard Vader fell into some lava once? As a GM in an RPG would you rule falling in lava is instant death, or heavy damage each round? Just in AD&D I saw these two different scenarios in the rules, one said the latter one said the former. Would it instantly destroy flesh and bone?

Well, I can speak for D&D. Immersion in lava deals 20d6 points of fire damage each round. Simple contact is 2d6 each round. My brother has the annoying policy of houseruling it to instant death, even though 20d6 is instant death for most characters below level 18 at least, at which point they're supposed to be able to survive insane situations. But that's his call. And I'm rambling, aren't I? I'll stop. Just that it doesn't have to be instant death.

Posted: **2003-12-13 01:05am**

I should aslo add that in most descriptions and mentions of the incident, it's a molton pit that Anakin falls into, not specifically lava. I don't know how much of a difference that would make, but there you go.

Posted: **2003-12-13 01:38am**

Not much. Most metal has a lower melting point than rock (or is it hte other way around?) but its not enough of a difference to matter to human flesh. You'd be equally screwed either way. The only difference is that you'd screw up whatever was being alloyed if it was metal.

Posted: **2003-12-13 01:41am**

Shrykull wrote:
Spanky The Dolphin wrote:The only thing that allowed Anakin Skywalker to survive falling into the molten pit and crawl back out as Darth Vader was his grasp of the Force.
Ah, so it is true? What canon documentation is there on it? The comics perhaps? And, just how severe were his injuries, worse than a bacta tank could cure?

The ROTJ novelization is the main source that I know of that describes what happened to Vader.

Posted: **2003-12-13 01:45am**

Yeah, here's the relevant passage, from Saxton's page on Vader's injuries:

" We fought ... your father fell into a molten pit. When your father clawed his way out of that fiery pool, the change had been burned into him forever --- he was Darth Vader, without a trace of Anakin Skywalker. Irredeemably dark. Scarred. Kept alive only by machinery and his own black will ... "

Posted: **2003-12-13 01:50am**

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Yeah, here's the relevant passage, from Saxton's page on Vader's injuries:
" We fought ... your father fell into a molten pit. When your father clawed his way out of that fiery pool, the change had been burned into him forever --- he was Darth Vader, without a trace of Anakin Skywalker. Irredeemably dark. Scarred. Kept alive only by machinery and his own black will ... "

I also recall a passage that described it from Anakin's perspective near the end, after his redemption. Do you have that quote on hand? Or am I misremembering it?

Posted: **2003-12-13 01:51am**

Don't know, I've never read it.

Posted: **2003-12-13 01:55am**

I think I may still have my old copy kicking around here somwhere. I'll see if I can find it.

Posted: **2003-12-13 02:23am**

Okay, I found it, and the bit that I was thinking of:

James Kahn wrote:And this memory brought back a wave of other memories with it. Memories of brotherhood, and home. His dear wife. The freedom of deep space. Obi-Wan.

Obi-Wan, his friend...and how that friendship had turned. Turned, he knew not how - but got injected, nonetheless, with some uncaring virulence that festered, until...hold. These were memories he wanted none of, not now. Memories of molten lava, crawling up his back...no.

This boy had pulled him from that pit - here, now, with this act. This boy was good.

Doesn't really give a whole lot of additional information, except to confirm that the "molten pit" was, in fact, lava.

Posted: **2003-12-13 02:48am**

It's not inconceivable that Anakin used Jedi techniques to reduce the amount of damage to himself to the extent that he could survive falling in lava/molten pit. We have Anakin at the mercy of Dooku's force lightning and Luke at the mercy of Palpatine's force lightning (both had smoking clothes, IIRC), as well as Qui-Gonn's cutting the TF battleship blast door without burning himself in any way.

Posted: **2003-12-13 04:36pm**

In The Jedi Accademy books Luke walks accross a river of Lava by creating a Force-Shield. I'd always thought Anakin did the same but was a bit slow putting it up and so he suffered damage.

Posted: **2003-12-13 05:49pm**

I think that on Robert Brown's page (before it was taken down), he said that a factory worker who wasn't wearing special protective clothing fell into molten metal, and was seriously burned, but survived. He drew paralels between this a Vader's situation.

Posted: **2003-12-13 05:53pm**

Rogue 9 wrote:
Shrykull wrote:Over Thanksgiving dinner me and my cousin were talking about it, just speculation at this point. Guess we're gonna see him get his ass kicked majorly in the next episode while he kicks some major ass himself, but he said that he heard Vader fell into some lava once? As a GM in an RPG would you rule falling in lava is instant death, or heavy damage each round? Just in AD&D I saw these two different scenarios in the rules, one said the latter one said the former. Would it instantly destroy flesh and bone?
Well, I can speak for D&D. Immersion in lava deals 20d6 points of fire damage each round. Simple contact is 2d6 each round. My brother has the annoying policy of houseruling it to instant death, even though 20d6 is instant death for most characters below level 18 at least, at which point they're supposed to be able to survive insane situations. But that's his call. And I'm rambling, aren't I? I'll stop. Just that it doesn't have to be instant death.

The Dark sun product valley of dust and fire says lava is instant death City by the silt sea says 5d6 damage a round, and you also take some damage just being near it[/i]

Posted: **2003-12-13 05:54pm**

YT300000 wrote:I think that on Robert Brown's page (before it was taken down), he said that a factory worker who wasn't wearing special protective clothing fell into molten metal, and was seriously burned, but survived. He drew paralels between this a Vader's situation.

Fist I've ever read that.

Posted: **2003-12-13 06:00pm**

Rogue 9 wrote:
Shrykull wrote:Over Thanksgiving dinner me and my cousin were talking about it, just speculation at this point. Guess we're gonna see him get his ass kicked majorly in the next episode while he kicks some major ass himself, but he said that he heard Vader fell into some lava once? As a GM in an RPG would you rule falling in lava is instant death, or heavy damage each round? Just in AD&D I saw these two different scenarios in the rules, one said the latter one said the former. Would it instantly destroy flesh and bone?
Well, I can speak for D&D. Immersion in lava deals 20d6 points of fire damage each round. Simple contact is 2d6 each round. My brother has the annoying policy of houseruling it to instant death, even though 20d6 is instant death for most characters below level 18 at least, at which point they're supposed to be able to survive insane situations. But that's his call. And I'm rambling, aren't I? I'll stop. Just that it doesn't have to be instant death.

Also I had a cleric of Earth and dark sun who could the ignore the presence of his element, he could for example walk through stone walls, go underground, walk through anything earthy in origin (but the DM ruled out wood because it was (once) a living thing, and obsidian) Think I read in Earth, Air, Water and Fire that I could ingore the presence of lava even though it's not only just earth

Posted: **2003-12-13 06:05pm**

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:
YT300000 wrote:I think that on Robert Brown's page (before it was taken down), he said that a factory worker who wasn't wearing special protective clothing fell into molten metal, and was seriously burned, but survived. He drew paralels between this a Vader's situation.
Fist I've ever read that.

I haven't been able to see his page in a long while, but I distinctly remember that part.

Posted: **2003-12-13 06:06pm**

And that has nothing to do with Vader.

Posted: **2003-12-14 10:52pm**

Vympel wrote:It's not inconceivable that Anakin used Jedi techniques to reduce the amount of damage to himself to the extent that he could survive falling in lava/molten pit. We have Anakin at the mercy of Dooku's force lightning and Luke at the mercy of Palpatine's force lightning (both had smoking clothes, IIRC), as well as Qui-Gonn's cutting the TF battleship blast door without burning himself in any way.

Mace Windu may have also used the Force to reduce heat damage when he was attacked by Jango Fett's flamethrower.

Posted: **2003-12-15 12:22am**

YT300000 wrote:I think that on Robert Brown's page (before it was taken down), he said that a factory worker who wasn't wearing special protective clothing fell into molten metal, and was seriously burned, but survived. He drew paralels between this a Vader's situation.

I would highly doubt that unless there was a very repudable source on that. I know people in the industry, and when you get exposed to lots of molten anything, you die. Shit, I've heard people talking about how SOP dictated that you'd push someone under so they'd die quicker.

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