Dark Empire: Like it or Leave it?

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-04-29 06:20am

So on my recent trip to New York I graced Midtown Comics with my presence. Deciding my wallet was heavy I relieved myself of the burden and purchased Dark Empire's I and II. When I read them I discovered, much to my dismay, that the story was unenjoyable. However the artwork was suberb, and well worth it.

I've heard some things about DE's creation, how George Lucas held it up as an example of good storytelling (or something), how Zahn was a fucker who didn't want to work with Vietch and his comic, and as such the end result creates an awkwardness in the continuity which is barely (if at all) explained away etc. (it's the NR in HttE, then reverts to RA for DE; Leia considers herself a Jedi in DE, yet in HttE she can barely use a lightsabre - an exaggeration I know, but it just seemed Zahn didn't want her to be a Jedi in training or something)

In any case who here has read it, and who here liked it or disliked it, and more importantly what do you think about it?

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2004-04-29 06:59am

Its scale was more impressive than anything else in the EU, its story was craptacular.

I wasn't blown away with the water colours so I didn't like it even for its artwork.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2004-04-29 07:00am

I like it for both its art and story. I'm weird like that.

Post by **Gandalf** » 2004-04-29 07:04am

Can't say I've read it.

Is it still available?

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-04-29 07:06am

Gandalf wrote:Is it still available?

Well I bought it, didn't I? *Raises eyebrows in Spock fashion*

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2004-04-29 09:20am

DE for me was very good...the art blew(sorry Kennedy only knows three colors and this isn't the only book he does this shit too) but Vietch's writing is good for this one(DE2 and EE have much to be desired for me anyways).

What I most enjoyed was the scale...of both events and battle as well as plans. It at least seem to acknowledge it's a galactic war.

Bertie Wooster · Post by **Bertie Wooster** » 2004-04-29 09:37am

I don't think there's a continuity problem; the Dark Empire trilogy(including Empire's End) began about a year after The Last Command, AFAIK. I agree that the story in the Dark Empire trilogy was not as good as the Thrawn Trilogy, but in many ways Dark Empire felt more like "starwars" than anything else in the EU, including the scale of the conflict.

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-04-29 11:09am

I've read bits and pieces but my problems aren't with the story (which was so so) but more with some of the precedent it made.

1. Palpatine and the never ending clone palpy loop.
2. Insane force powers from hell.
3. Minor variations in art creating a new class' of ships every fleet scene.

In a lot of things, it was just a wankfest.

Super-Gagme · Post by **Super-Gagme** » 2004-04-29 12:56pm

I hate comics, simply cannot enjoy them. However I once heard there was a novelisation of Dark Empire. Is this true?

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2004-04-29 01:47pm

No. The closest there was to a novel was an audio drama.

Dartzap · Post by **Dartzap** » 2004-04-29 02:18pm

the best bit in the Audio is when Han has to train the new E Wing pilots...

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-04-29 03:03pm

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:No. The closest there was to a novel was an audio drama.

I can dig that. Love the OT radio dramas. Is that still available? Because comics suck ass.

Captain tycho · Post by **Captain tycho** » 2004-04-29 03:06pm

Rogue 9 wrote:
Spanky The Dolphin wrote:No. The closest there was to a novel was an audio drama.
I can dig that. Love the OT radio dramas. Is that still available? Because comics suck ass.

My local library has the whole radio trilogy on CD. It kicks ass.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2004-04-29 05:00pm

Critics should check out the radio/audio dramatization of Dark Empire.

I hear its a beauty.

Icehawk · Post by **Icehawk** » 2004-04-29 05:36pm

Liked the first one, second was OK, third one (titled "Empires End") was the WORST comic I have EVER read.

Even the first one was stupid for having the Eclipse SSD destroyed without even doing anything. The world Devastators being shut out so quickly like that was also a bit of a dissappointment.

YT300000 · Post by **YT300000** » 2004-04-29 07:15pm

I've never actually read it.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-04-29 07:37pm

What is "Empire's End" and why should I steer clear of it?

YT300000 · Post by **YT300000** » 2004-04-29 07:52pm

Gandalf wrote:Can't say I've read it.

Is it still available?

It was re-released fairly recently.

Icehawk · Post by **Icehawk** » 2004-04-29 07:54pm

Stofsk wrote:What is "Empire's End" and why should I steer clear of it?

It covers the end of the Dark Empire story arc with the cloned Emperor.

Like I said, IMO its the worst comic I ever read. The story is SO rushed and what happens in it is just pure stupidity.

Publius · Post by **Publius** » 2004-04-29 08:17pm

Dark Empire itself was enjoyable, and is neatly complemented by the Dark Empire Sourcebook, one of West End Games's better products. Unfortunately, Dark Empire II left something to be desired, especially in its "dime a dozen" treatment of the Emperor's Dark Jedi ("Dark Side Elite" being the term now preferred), which substantially devalued the rarity and dignity of the dark side adherent in general. There is little to be said for Empire’s End except that it hints at a grander story (the siege of an Imperial shipyard, the enormous troop transport Pelagia, the armoured, turreted main battle tanks, &c.).

PUBLIUS

President Sharky · Post by **President Sharky** » 2004-04-29 10:46pm

Although DE2 and EE are terrible sequels (think Matrix sequels in crappiness), Dark Empire itself is one of my favourite pieces of EU. I remember reading it at a comic book store when I was 11, shortly after reading my first EU book, and I absolutely loved the idea of a cloned Emperor. The story and artwork hooked me to it, and the whole thing had such an epic feel to it that is missing in 90% of all other EU stories.

The arc would have been better if the Emperor truly did die at Pinnacle Moon (a magnificent final death), and that DE2 was just a war against the infighting elements of Sedriss' Empire. If he was given time to develop, Sedriss could have made a pretty badass villain, along with the Dark Side Elite, and through DE2 and EE, we could have seen the fall of Sedriss, and ultimately, the ultimate end of the Empire.

Icehawk · Post by **Icehawk** » 2004-04-29 11:55pm

One of the things that really irks me about the DE series is that it takes place over such a small amount of time, a year at best IIRC. It honestly should have been spread over years IMO, at least 4 or 5, but no, the oh so glorious NR as usual gets it super unrealistic luck and character shields on its side and manages to easily and quickly defeat huge forces and superweapons that should have AT LEAST drawn the war out for a number of years.

Dooey Jo · Post by **Dooey Jo** » 2004-04-30 09:36am

I've only read DE2, and, story-wise, I didn't think it was that bad until I was told that Palpatine was cloned in DE1 as well (one time is enough!). The thing I REALLY hate about it is the art. Way too much green and blue and WAY too dark! I have quite a few SW comics and this is easily the worst drawn of them all.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-04-30 11:07am

Dooey Jo wrote:I've only read DE2, and, story-wise, I didn't think it was that bad until I was told that Palpatine was cloned in DE1 as well (one time is enough!). The thing I REALLY hate about it is the art. Way too much green and blue and WAY too dark! I have quite a few SW comics and this is easily the worst drawn of them all.

I liked it for some reason. That is not to say Kennedy's use of single colours didn't grow tiresome. I dunno. It's hard to explain. I guess I liked it because it was different.

nightmare · Post by **nightmare** » 2004-05-01 01:58am

Crown wrote:Its scale was more impressive than anything else in the EU, its story was craptacular.

That sums it up rather nicely. DE could certainly have been improved, but overall I'm glad it's there.