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Two questions.

1. Suppose a Jedi is talking to someone. He asks the person if he has a cellphone. The person replies yes.

Now could the Jedi using his pre cognition forsee this and learn the answer without asking ?

2. A Jedi is using MSN messenger. He is chatting with someone. Could he forsee what the other person will type before he/she types and sends the IM ?

evilcat4000 wrote:Two questions.

1. Suppose a Jedi is talking to someone. He asks the person if he has a cellphone. The person replies yes.

Now could the Jedi using his pre cognition forsee this and learn the answer without asking ?

2. A Jedi is using MSN messenger. He is chatting with someone. Could he forsee what the other person will type before he/she types and sends the IM ?

Yoda implied that the future was always in motion which made predictions difficult. Despite that Luke, an novice Jedi, managed to detect the agony of Han Solo light years away!

... so ... range really isn't an issue here.

Yoda used his precognition to predict Luke's death. The Emperor ignored his own precognition that indicated his defeat at Endor. My suspicion is that the further ahead in the future you attempt to predict, the higher the probability of you being wrong.

But considering how Jedi have been observed to deflect blaster bolts, I'm pretty comfortable saying that they can predict a few seconds ahead with some degree of accuracy. So I figure that yeah, they'd know what the person would say next.

Crom wrote:Yoda used his precognition to predict Luke's death. The Emperor ignored his own precognition that indicated his defeat at Endor. My suspicion is that the further ahead in the future you attempt to predict, the higher the probability of you being wrong.

When did Yoda predict Luke's death? Was that in the novelisation or something? And the same with Palpatine - when did he forsee his defeat at Endor, especially when he said the reverse onscreen?

Stofsk wrote:When did Yoda predict Luke's death? Was that in the novelisation or something?

I was thinking TESB in the scene where Luke is leaving Dagobah and Yoda tells him that he is not ready to face Darth Vader. It's been a while since I've seen the movie, so I could be wrong.

Stofsk wrote:And the same with Palpatine - when did he forsee his defeat at Endor, especially when he said the reverse onscreen?

I think I read that in this forum somewhere, which, I know, makes for poor evidence. From what I recall it was that Palpatine foresaw the possibility of his own defeat but dismissed it out of pride.

Crom wrote: I was thinking TESB in the scene where Luke is leaving Dagobah and Yoda tells him that he is not ready to face Darth Vader. It's been a while since I've seen the movie, so I could be wrong.

It could simply mean that he was likely to fall to the Dark Side...

Palpatine predicted complete success at Endor, his acolytes didn't (and went into hiding prior to the defeat).

Crom wrote:

Stofsk wrote:When did Yoda predict Luke's death? Was that in the novelisation or something?

I was thinking TESB in the scene where Luke is leaving Dagobah and Yoda tells him that he is not ready to face Darth Vader. It's been a while since I've seen the movie, so I could be wrong.

I think the most important point that was brought up about Force precog in the movies was the difficulty in trusting it. Yoda could see Han, Leia et al's pain, but didn't know their ultimate fate. Ditto for the Emperor, who predicted victory.

The Force moves in mysterious ways...

Stofsk wrote:I think the most important point that was brought up about Force precog in the movies was the difficulty in trusting it. Yoda could see Han, Leia et al's pain, but didn't know their ultimate fate. Ditto for the Emperor, who predicted victory.

The Force moves in mysterious ways...

I agree with you, even Yoda implied that seeing into the future was difficult and he was the Jedi Fucking Master (Pulp Fiction reference).

But from what we've seen from the movies, short term precognition seems to work pretty well. We've seen dozens of Jedi actively deflecting blaster bolts, for instance. I think that there's an inverse proportional relationship between the amount of time you look ahead and the accuracy of your viewing.

The Nomad wrote:It could simply mean that he was likely to fall to the Dark Side...

Likely? Did he phrase it like that? I don't have a copy around here, but from what I recall I thought Yoda sounded pretty certain that Luke was going to get killed.

But the point is, Luke didn't go over to the Dark Side, so Yoda's prediction was incorrect. Which implies to me that seeing far into the future is a thing full of uncertainty.

Perhaps Anakin returning to the light was a sufficientley unforseeable factor. As that was the reason Luke wasn't killed maybe that's why Yoda thought he would be and why Palpatine didn't see it coming.

Cao Cao wrote:Perhaps Anakin returning to the light was a sufficientley unforseeable factor. As that was the reason Luke wasn't killed maybe that's why Yoda thought he would be and why Palpatine didn't see it coming.

Don't forget the Shroud of the Dark Side. There are apparently ways to cloak the future from precognitives.

It would seem that the unexpected activity of Force-sensitives is pretty much enough to disrupt the foreseeing of even the more powerful individuals (Luke's unexpected intervention in ANH was pretty much enough to hamper Vader's precog in spite of him not being a trained Force-user -most certainly Anakin did not foresee with near enough margin the Falcon coming from above-).

Two things come to mind;

1. the phrase, 'we see only what we want to see'

2. the sheer number of other factors the come into the picture the further ahead you look.

Palpatine probably saw many possible fates for Endor (and other things) but probably latched on to what he wanted to see. Vader in the trench at Yavin really didn't expect, and so didn't look for let alone see, outside interference.

If Vader was in a trance thingy, he probably could have forseen the Falcon but he was kind of busy at the moment.

In general, if you look ahead half a second to feel/see/whatever where some one is aiming and firing at, there is only so many other factors that can come into play for that half a second.

Determining what will happen to one specific person over the course of many days or months or years, incorperates sooooo many factors and sooooooo many other people who intern bring in soooooo many moooore factors, that the odds or predicting where all the chips will fall go insane.

*shrug* my take on it, anyways.