StarDestroyer.Net BBS

There have been a handful of content updates at this author's website, Domus Publica. The most obvious of these are the appendix to "All the Emperor's Men" on Imperial law, and the appendix on politics in the Imperial military/naval complex. There are also two new WEG-style vignettes, "A Visit from the Admiral" and "The President's War Room," have also been posted. As usual, any and all feedback and criticism are more than welcome, and indeed encouraged; at the present time, this thread or private messages are the best means of contacting the author.

Very good, Publius.

I just hope running behind on important projects doesn't run in your family.

The font, at least to me, seems rather small. So small for me at least that I can't read it.

EDIT: I think it's my computer rather than your site.

Very interesting reads. I'd be printing them out soon. You mentioned how people can be promoted rather suddenly into new ranks far above the one they held just moments ago. Do you have any ideas for explaining the phenomena where Biggs Darklighter (and apparently people from his class) could immediately attain such high positions as First Mate of a 750m class frigate while retaining the rank of Midshipman? I don't remember seeing that explained.

While I'm nitting, I should point out where you said Arhul Hextrophon admitted about how the justice system was improved, that may or may not be the case, because that chapter was supposedly not Hextrophon's work, but an assessment of Imperial Intelligence.

Otherwise excellent. I particularly enjoyed the one between Mon Mothma and Palpy.

Since when is the Rand Ecliptic only 750 meters? By my scaling (the hangar bays and the TIE fighters, to be exact) its more like several kilometers long.

Connor MacLeod wrote:Since when is the Rand Ecliptic only 750 meters? By my scaling (the hangar bays and the TIE fighters, to be exact) its more like several kilometers long.

I thought that the idea was that ship was meant to be the combat version of the Acclamator or something.

It is several kilometers long? And a midshipman with only a single blue square got a First Mate (XO) position on it?

Excuse me, I have to barf at the idiocy of the authors. Rand Ecliptic's story with Biggs Darklighter started out sounding reasonable in the ANH novelization. Then the freighter (implying a tiny ship about the size of the MF) became a frigate, and just quietly slipping away became seizing the ship. Then it becomes a 750m long frigate. And now this?

Hold me, I'm feeling faint...

Kazuaki Shimazaki wrote: I thought that the idea was that ship was meant to be the combat version of the Acclamator or something.

Based on what? Go ahead and scale the images yourself (there are relevant ones on SWTC under the Rand Ecliptic entry.. you should be able to scale it fairly well from those, since it has both interior and external shots of the hangar.)

It is several kilometers long? And a midshipman with only a single blue square got a First Mate (XO) position on it?

If the vessel is sufficiently understaffed or had replacement crews added he might be promoted to acting Executive Officer. Besides, as I recall "midshipman" (at least in the Age of Sail) isn't technically a rank. its more like a term denoting an "officer in training".

So he might have been temporarily promoted to XO either as a test of his abilities or as a way to keep him occupied or out of the way (Biggs did mostly pilot TIE fighters while on the Ecliptic, aftr all.)

Excuse me, I have to barf at the idiocy of the authors. Rand Ecliptic's story with Biggs Darklighter started out sounding reasonable in the ANH novelization. Then the freighter (implying a tiny ship about the size of the MF) became a frigate, and just quietly slipping away became seizing the ship. Then it becomes a 750m long frigate. And now this?

I don't ever believe they indicated just what it was in the novelization. Besides if it WAS a freighter, a freighter several kilometers long makes more sense than a tiny one (or do you prefer the Wild Karrde sized freighters?)

As for the 750 meter thing, where the hell are you getting that from?

Actually here are some of the images I used to do the scalings:

Interior hangar

interior hangar #2

Exterior shot #1

Exterior Shot #2

Kazuaki Shimazaki wrote:Very interesting reads. I'd be printing them out soon. You mentioned how people can be promoted rather suddenly into new ranks far above the one they held just moments ago. Do you have any ideas for explaining the phenomena where Biggs Darklighter (and apparently people from his class) could immediately attain such high positions as First Mate of a 750m class frigate while retaining the rank of Midshipman? I don't remember seeing that explained.

If Darklighter's comments in the novelization are any indication, he was not a commissioned officer of the Imperial Navy, but rather a part of the merchant marine. His comments about the Navy pulling officers out of the merchant services very easily explain the paucity of mid-ranking officers; the Navy may have already called up so many officers that the merchant services are forced to put recent graduates in positions of authority significantly higher than what they would normally be given. Darklighter's commission as "First Mate" of Rand Ecliptic could be indicative of nothing more than a shortage of officers on the part of the merchant services.

Kazuaki Shimazaki wrote:While I'm nitting, I should point out where you said Arhul Hextrophon admitted about how the justice system was improved, that may or may not be the case, because that chapter was supposedly not Hextrophon's work, but an assessment of Imperial Intelligence.

Yes, you are quite correct. Thank you.

Connor MacLeod wrote:Based on what? Go ahead and scale the images yourself (there are relevant ones on SWTC under the Rand Ecliptic entry.. you should be able to scale it fairly well from those, since it has both interior and external shots of the hangar.)

I just scaled it. You are right, because So far, I'm looking at a number surrounding 2.5km. Unless, of course, we used something we weren't supposed to use for scaling. And this is must be the biggest frigate ever!

EDIT: I suppose now that Nightmare had posted a link, with similar results but a slightly different method (I used width, he used height, I think), I can save myself the trouble.

If the vessel is sufficiently understaffed or had replacement crews added he might be promoted to acting Executive Officer.

Replacement crew is one thing, but the ship must be really shorthanded before a one square could advance up. It is just hard to see that the Imperial Navy is so short they can't find something better than a wet-behind-the-ears Midshipman for the job.

Besides, as I recall "midshipman" (at least in the Age of Sail) isn't technically a rank. its more like a term denoting an "officer in training".

This is such a great improvement ... an officer in training on a frigate that's now the size of a destroyer or even light cruiser becomes an XO...

So he might have been temporarily promoted to XO either as a test of his abilities or as a way to keep him occupied or out of the way (Biggs did mostly pilot TIE fighters while on the Ecliptic, aftr all.)

Test of his abilities = make a fresh officer a XO of a 2.5km long "frigate"? Hmm...

And how appropriate is it to make a TIE Pilot your XO? A X has a substantial duty load, including a rotation as watch officer, and plenty of paperwork. XOs in warships are supposed to buffer the Captian and crew, which is kinda hard when the XO is a total newbie.

I don't ever believe they indicated just what it was in the novelization.

It was mentioned to be a freighter.

ANH P.19 wrote:"There was something evasive about Biggs as he replied, looking slightly away, "Of course I got it. Signed to serve aboard the freighter Rand Ecliptic just last week. First Mate Biggs Darklighter, at your service."

Besides if it WAS a freighter, a freighter several kilometers long makes more sense than a tiny one (or do you prefer the Wild Karrde sized freighters?)

Honestly, while I believe that there are countless numbers of those large freighters you are mentioning, I honestly don't see a first-time-out officer getting such a large ship from one of those large companies. Certainly not as first mate. Sixth officer is more like the kind of position first time out would get on those large ships with intense competition. Tell me if I'm wrong, but you don't give your 747 copilot qualifications to someone who just graduated flight school - if you give them anything, you'd give them some short range plane on short-range, low-value routes; or the guy joins a tiny regional airline to gain experience. I envision Biggs first being a copilot on one of those little freighters. Then, if he hadn't chosen to join the Rebels, he could get two years under his belt, shoot for a junior position aboard the large ships and work his way up.

As for the 750 meter thing, where the hell are you getting that from?

I suppose it came from Curtis Saxton and everyone who noticed how much the darn ship looks like an Acclamator. Honestly, I don't have the comic, so I can only watch from afar.

Connor MacLeod wrote:Since when is the Rand Ecliptic only 750 meters? By my scaling (the hangar bays and the TIE fighters, to be exact) its more like several kilometers long.

I agree.

Only doubt I can see is that it is hard to range on the TIE Fighter, beyond a qualitative thing like "close because of the triangular portion". If they are somehow farther away than we thought, they would look smaller in relation to the hangar than they really are.

Kazuaki Shimazaki wrote:I just scaled it. You are right, because So far, I'm looking at a number surrounding 2.5km. Unless, of course, we used something we weren't supposed to use for scaling. And this is must be the biggest frigate ever!

Well if she's 2.5 km, maybe she's a light cruiser. They call her a cruiser enough in the comic.

Given that she was originally referred to as a freighter, and appears (generally speaking) to be relatively lightly crewed if a recent graduate can be reasonably expected to serve as First Mate, and given Darklighter's apparent claims that he was not in the Navy, it seems clear that she was in fact an armed merchantman, a "frigate" or "battlecruiser" in the same sense that the Trade Federation had a fleet of "battleships."

It is worth pointing out that Darklighter was not a midshipman, seeing that he had in fact graduated from the Imperial Academy at Prefsbelt IV; he was an officer, not an officer in training. Nevertheless, if the Navy had already called up many of the merchant marine's mid-level officers, it is conceivable that junior officers would be compelled to take increasingly high appointments (which in and of itself would go a long way toward explaining the Captain's surly attitude at being presented with Darklighter and Klivian as members of his "senior" staff).

Keep in mind that if the merchant marine is willing to have a passed midshipman as a First Mate, it is not the only branch with peculiar tastes; the Imperial Navy had no problem whatever with have a post captain with fifty years' service as Executive Officer of an Imperial Star Destroyer. The Empire does not seem to view rank to be as absolute a proposition as many other states, regarding ability as more important. If Darklighter had demonstrated himself to be capable, why not give him a posting as First Mate aboard a merchantman in the galactic backwater? It would give him valuable experience that would later allow the Navy to conscript him and place him in positions of greater responsibility than his rank or length of service might suggest.

That's interesting. TIEs leased to the merchant marine?

Why not? There is a known problem with piracy, and the Imperial State requires trade and shipping as much as any state. The merchant marine is crewed by officers graduating from the same academies as the Navy's officers, and many at trained to pilot starfighters before graduation, regardless of destination in the Exploration, Merchant, or Military branches; this is a galaxy where banks (Bank of Aargau, InterGalactic Banking Clan), businesses (TaggeCo., Arakyd), and consortiums (Corporate Alliance, Commerce Guild, Techno Union, Trade Federation) have enormous private militaries. An additional benefit of giving the merchant marine use of Navy-grade starfighters is that it eases the transition between mercantile officer and Naval officer; a merchant marine officer who already has experience in running a large, armed ship and piloting combat starcraft is already in many respects performing the same tasks and missions that a Naval officer is.

Hm.

I wonder how many cases of rebel harassment of various backwater platforms, freighters, and whatnot of "Imperial" ownership (particularly in the "X-Wing" series of starfighter simulators) may actually have been the merchant marine, and the rebels fulfilling the typical stereotype of ambushing commerce and business that is seen the world over in real life.

Great update, Publius! I really like your articles, and I look forward to the next batch.

Has anyone e-mailed Dr. Saxton about the scaling? It's a minor detail, but relevant.
EDIT: I'm embarrassed. I forgot to mention how much you rock.
"Palpatine found chairs useful." It's rather cliched, but your use of it just about made me fall out of my chair.

I'll ask Wayne.

On the subject of the merchant marine using TIE fighters, it need not even be a policy of the Imperial Navy to lease their combat starfigthers to other services. The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, Second Edition (West End Games, 1992) features an advertisement by Novoil Cluster StarGoods stating the following:

Novoil Cluster StarGoods is making available completely remanufactured Sienar Fleet Systems TIE fighters. These ships are known for their excellent speed and maneuverability in short-range combat -- perfect for planetary patrols or convoy guard.

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Order our catalog for complete listings. From fighters to freighters, we carry everything!

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I would suspect that such fighters are of very poor quality, however. Saddam Hussein had some very advanced Russian tanks, nominally, but they were actually stripped down export models of dubious capability. TIEs which make it to the market are almost certainly in the same condition.

The Duchess of Zeon wrote:I would suspect that such fighters are of very poor quality, however. Saddam Hussein had some very advanced Russian tanks, nominally, but they were actually stripped down export models of dubious capability. TIEs which make it to the market are almost certainly in the same condition.

Perhaps this reflects a partial explanation between the otherwise odd dichotomy between shielded and unshielded TIE fighters.

Two new articles, "Sic Transit Gloria" and "A Billion Here, a Billion There...," have been posted. "Sic Transit Gloria" is at present part one of a commentary on the decline and fall of the Galactic Empire, while "A Billion Here, a Billion There..." is intended to be a series on major corporations in the galaxy.

"Sic Transit Gloria" is great, although you repeat two paragraphs. Reading "A Billion Here, a Billion There..." now.

I also like the title "Sic Transit Gloria," especially since it reminds me of Rushmore, and anything that reminds me of Rushmore is double-plus good.