StarDestroyer.Net BBS

During his tantrum, he tells Padme that it was unprecedented for a Jedi to join the Council but not ascend to the rank of Master.

Even I remembered that Ki-Adi-Mundi wasn't a Master when he joined the Council, so why didn't Anakin? It wasn't exactly ancient history at that point.

Was that a continuity gaff or did I miss something?

If so, it could be retconned as an error on Anakin's part.

I've been wondering this myself, ever since seeing the movie.

How much do they say about that? Because it seems that Anakin expects being nominated to the Council as making him automatically a Master. Such could be the same as Anakin's case. We know there are other ways to become a Jedi Master, and even whole schools of though among them not on the Council. Is it possible that what's his name, who seems to be an oddball anyway, was a Knight, made council, and was then promoted?

Could it be that Anakin was pissed because he should, likewise, have been promoted to Master after being raised to the Council?

Your own link to Ki-Ad's bio states that once he was granted a permanent seat on the Council, he was granted the rank of Master.

During the EU storyline between TPM and AOTC it was stated that Mundi was still only a Knight while being on the council.

However, I'd say the movie canon has blown away the EU canon here.

It'd be nice if they could just settle down and explicitly declare how the Jedi hierarchy works once and for all.

I think Ki-Adi Mundi was "Master" as an Honorific Title only. Similar to how everyone refers to every Jedi as "Master" as seen in Episode II. Anyone on the council, whether "Master" or "Knight", is given the honorific title "Master."

Its like how anyone who commands a ship is refered to as "Captain," reguardless of rank.

When Anakin was appointed to the council, they did not grant him that honorific title.

The TPM: VD says that he is a knight, and was allowed on the council due to his special incited into the Force. During the first movie he's only a knight. He ascended to the rank of master some time after the "Jedi Council: Acts of War" graphic novel. Anakin's just upset and its entirely possible that he did not know.

SOD aside did GL not rewatch the previous films before penning the new script?

Spartan wrote:SOD aside did GL not rewatch the previous films before penning the new script?

IIRC, nobody refers to Ki-Adi by any title during the previous films.

Hell, nobody refers to Ki-Adi-Mundi by name in the previous two films, IIRC.

I knew it! I knew i remembered somone only being a knight and beiong on the council, but i couldn't remember there name.

Galvatron wrote:During his tantrum, he tells Padme that it was unprecedented for a Jedi to join the Council but not ascend to the rank of Master.

Even I remembered that Ki-Adi-Mundi wasn't a Master when he joined the Council, so why didn't Anakin? It wasn't exactly ancient history at that point.

Was that a continuity gaff or did I miss something?

Sort of falls into that whole, 'Vader disappeared, yet his suit kept its shape on the pyre' answer for the vanishing question a couple of years back. Always burns my asshole when they fuck up like that. I was surprised to see Ki Adi listed as a knight and not a master being on the council.

Could it be that Ki-Adi was only a Knight when he was appointed to the Council but was promoted to Master subsequently (Unlike Anakin)? Or is it conclusive that he was a Knight while serving on the Council.

I believe the source material explicitly states he was merely a Knight, and had never taken on a padawan learner. My Ep I novel is packed away, so I can't run and hit it up where they describe the Jedi Council, if they even go into that much detail.

Galvatron wrote:During his tantrum, he tells Padme that it was unprecedented for a Jedi to join the Council but not ascend to the rank of Master.

Even I remembered that Ki-Adi-Mundi wasn't a Master when he joined the Council, so why didn't Anakin? It wasn't exactly ancient history at that point.

Was that a continuity gaff or did I miss something?

Crap, I was just coming to post this
I remembered it while I was watching the movie even. Anakin says, "It's unprecedented!" and I almost shout, "What?!?"

I read it in the Episode 1 sourcebook and Starwars.com and a few other books.

Nex: Nope, according to what I've read he was a full Knight on the council, which was apparently a "very rare" thing and meant he was extraordinarily good. He was probably a master by Ep3 though if he was a Knight on the council during Ep1.

I, too remembered Ki-Adi-Mundi when Anakin was refused the rank of Master. When Anakin said:

How can you be on the Council and not be a Master? It's unprecedented!

I thought:

Um, what about Ki-Adi-Mundi? He was a Knight for part of his Council service.

I believe he was a Master by the time of Episode II. According to the comics he found and trained a padawan (A'Sharad Hett) in the time following the battle of Naboo.

Kuja wrote:I believe he was a Master by the time of Episode II. According to the comics he found and trained a padawan (A'Sharad Hett) in the time following the battle of Naboo.

Yes, he was a Master by THEN, but Anakin said it was unprecedented and it obviously wasn't since he was on the council during Ep1.

Macross wrote:I think Ki-Adi Mundi was "Master" as an Honorific Title only. Similar to how everyone refers to every Jedi as "Master" as seen in Episode II. Anyone on the council, whether "Master" or "Knight", is given the honorific title "Master."

Its like how anyone who commands a ship is refered to as "Captain," reguardless of rank.

When Anakin was appointed to the council, they did not grant him that honorific title.

It wasn't the honorific title Anakin wanted, the novelisation states that Anakin wanted access to the Holocrons in the library only Masters where allowed to access, he was trying to find a way to save Padame from dying during child birth.

It's also clear that training a Padawan is not the only way to become a Master. If that were the case then Anakin wouldn't be so upset. It's implied that, if a Jedi Knight is skilled enough, they can be given the title of Master without having trained a Padawan.

If you go by the AOTC novelization, training a padawan does not make you a master. Obi-wan in AOTC was not a Jedi Master, he was a Jedi Knight, but he was Anakin's master. Indeed Anakin makes a definite distiction between the masters who are on the coucil and everyone else. The Masters on the Jedi Coucil are the "Masters" of the Order. They are in all likelyhood the only true master in the order.

Its worth noting that Obi-Wan tells Luke that he was once a Jedi knight like your father. Then when he sends Luke for further training in TESB, he tells him he will train with Yoda the Jedi Master.

That seems like a pretty clear distinction to me. It likely that the Council is somewhat like the UN security council, have permanent senior members (true masters) and rotating junior members (knights and masters). Which would explain why jedi such as Adi, Skywalker, Kenobi, can serve. Along with people like Yaddle who never completed her training and never learned to use a lightsaber. It would also explain why some of the masters are so vastly weaker than say Mace or Yoda.

Actually I think Adi was a permanent member. He stayed on the council for 22 years onscreen, likely more.

Yep and Mace was a council member from age 28. While Yoda probably has something like 500 year on the council if not more. No wonder the the Jedi are so dogmatic council membership is like the US you serve till you either die or quit.

Praxis wrote:Actually I think Adi was a permanent member. He stayed on the council for 22 years onscreen, likely more.

The Prequel Trilogy only spans 13 years.

The council has a certain number of lifetime seats, semipermanent seats, and rotating seats, I believe. I'd have to check on it.

Look at the other councilmembers' reactions to Anakin's little fit, though. Mace is irritated, and Obi-Wan all but rolls his eyes. Duh, Anakin, Ki-Adi wasn't a master either... Mundi is also the first to break the awkward silence; he porbably wants to draw attention away from himself.