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Clone Wars Grievous or RotS Grievous?

Drooling Iguana wrote:Clone Wars Grievous or RotS Grievous?

They are in esence the same being.

Of course, some of GG's feats in CW can be interprited as exaggeration for dramatic effect. Nevertheless, he is powerful enough to go toe to toe with several Jedi at once.

Still, I give it to Maul. He is capable of defeating a Jedi master and his apprentice (who eventually becomes the fourth most powerful Jedi in the Order) in single combat. His defeat was fluke. HOwever, GG might give him some trouble, especially if he uses his usual tactics, but in a straight fight, Maul wins.

Clone war's Grievous would have a good chance against Palpatine and would massacre 2 Maul's.= Instant slaughter

Rots grievous would still be faster, stronger and much better on the offense but Maul might have a chance if he has a chance to concentrate and use the force to choke him (Grievous would probably try to make sure to keep fear & surprise with him but intimidation would be more difficult).

Maul would be more resistant to Grievous's mind-fuck's but has been shown to focuse entirely on saber fighting in a fight rather than supplementing himself with force attack's like Dooku or Sidious, So he would probably start attacking straight away, an attitude that would give Grievous a large initial advantage to end the fight decisevely and quickly.

I would say unless Maul knows enough about Grievous to try and use the force that Grievous would beat him without much trouble in a straight duel, after all 4 independent sabers> 2 interconnected blade's

Noble Ire wrote:

Drooling Iguana wrote:Clone Wars Grievous or RotS Grievous?

They are in esence the same being.

Grievous was hampered by an injury throughout RotS, but was in near peak condition for the Clone Wars cartoon.

Grievous was hampered by an injury throughout RotS, but was in near peak condition for the Clone Wars cartoon.

Point. If it was a pre-Mace GG, I might reconsider.

Noble Ire wrote:

Grievous was hampered by an injury throughout RotS, but was in near peak condition for the Clone Wars cartoon.

Point. If it was a pre-Mace GG, I might reconsider.

Let's assume for all-intents and purposes, that Grievous is not impeded by any injury before his confrontation with Maul. And let's assume that Maul is also in ideal physical and fighting shape.

Order 66 wrote:

Noble Ire wrote:

Grievous was hampered by an injury throughout RotS, but was in near peak condition for the Clone Wars cartoon.

Point. If it was a pre-Mace GG, I might reconsider.

Let's assume for all-intents and purposes, that Grievous is not impeded by any injury before his confrontation with Maul. And let's assume that Maul is also in ideal physical and fighting shape.

You mean that he is fighting at Clone war's, outrun blaster bolt's 5 saber's slaughter 1 Padawan, 2 Knight's and 2 master's level.

That Grievous was shown as partially resistant to some force attack's by "weaker" force user's (the Ithorian's scream, the force push by a Jedi master at clone war's level barely knocked him of a wall that he had barely jumped on), unless maul grow's a few more hand's out of his ass, it would take an act of Force to save him.

GG was trained by a Sith Lord, Maul is a Sith Lord, who is an excellent sabre-slinger. In addition, the TMP Visual Dictionary calls him one of the highest trained Sith in history. And correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't this guy beat Palpatine at the end of his training?

If you'll note, Grievous's four or five sabres are centred around his body, while Maul successfully fought of two completely independant Jedi at once. Like it or not two completely independant blades are superior to four (or five) blades wielded by one person.

the .303 bookworm wrote:You mean that he is fighting at Clone war's, outrun blaster bolt's 5 saber's slaughter 1 Padawan, 2 Knight's and 2 master's level.

That Grievous was shown as partially resistant to some force attack's by "weaker" force user's (the Ithorian's scream, the force push by a Jedi master at clone war's level barely knocked him of a wall that he had barely jumped on), unless maul grow's a few more hand's out of his ass, it would take an act of Force to save him.

Beep! The CW series is officially a highly exaggerated retelling of events.

Ford Prefect wrote:GG was trained by a Sith Lord, Maul is a Sith Lord, who is an excellent sabre-slinger. In addition, the TMP Visual Dictionary calls him one of the highest trained Sith in history. And correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't this guy beat Palpatine at the end of his training?

Maul was trained to be a living weapon but was not exceptionally strong in the force.
At the end of his training he nearly held his own against Sidious while attacking in a surprise flurry of blow's fueled by a dark side rage, Sidious still managed to draw his saber and beat him without bothering to use the force (his speciality).

Ford Prefect wrote: If you'll note, Grievous's four or five sabres are centred around his body, while Maul successfully fought of two completely independant Jedi at once. Like it or not two completely independant blades are superior to four (or five) blades wielded by one person.

how is a saber with two end's independent? Grievous was able to make sepperate attack's with each of his saber's while maul's wasnt even two saber's but one that could be manuevered so that he could use the other end.

eep! The CW series is officially a highly exaggerated retelling of events

I know, I raised that hypothesis last week (I may not have been the first though) and that was why I asked if he was fighting at a higher ("peak") level compared to ROTS or was fighting at the uberness shown in Clone war's.
The Jedi in the series were also exaggerated but we dont have a CW version of Maul, so that angle is moot.

the .303 bookworm wrote:

Ford Prefect wrote:If you'll note, Grievous's four or five sabres are centred around his body, while Maul successfully fought of two completely independant Jedi at once. Like it or not two completely independant blades are superior to four (or five) blades wielded by one person.

how is a saber with two end's independent? Grievous was able to make sepperate attack's with each of his saber's while maul's wasnt even two saber's but one that could be manuevered so that he could use the other end.

He's referring to the sabres held by Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon, implying that since Maul was able to defend himself against two independantly-wielded lightsabres, he'd have little trouble defending himself against four sabres wielded by the same person.

By completely independant, I mean those used by Qui-gon and Obi-wan. Think about that for a moment. Having multiple weapons weilded by one person is not as good as you would think. For one, your blades are limited in where you can move them, and you can still only attack from one direction. With two opponents, have have attacks coming in on multiple vectors.

And I'll admit, Maul doesn't exhibit massive amounts of Force power. Does that stop him from being brutally fast and strong, able to leap large distances and predict his opponents moves? No.

the .303 bookworm wrote:

Ford Prefect wrote: If you'll note, Grievous's four or five sabres are centred around his body, while Maul successfully fought of two completely independant Jedi at once. Like it or not two completely independant blades are superior to four (or five) blades wielded by one person.

how is a saber with two end's independent? Grievous was able to make sepperate attack's with each of his saber's while maul's wasnt even two saber's but one that could be manuevered so that he could use the other end.

Get some reading comprehension skills; He's talking about Maul being able to fend off Obi and Qui-Gon.

the .303 bookworm wrote:

Beep! The CW series is officially a highly exaggerated retelling of events.

I know, I raised that hypothesis last week (I may not have been the first though) and that was why I asked if he was fighting at a higher ("peak") level compared to ROTS or was fighting at the uberness shown in Clone war's.
The Jedi in the series were also exaggerated but we dont have a CW version of Maul, so that angle is moot.

Except we're not talking about CW Greivous.

Drooling Iguana wrote: He's referring to the sabres held by Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon, implying that since Maul was able to defend himself against two independantly-wielded lightsabres, he'd have little trouble defending himself against four sabres wielded by the same person.

Not quite, what I had in mind, but Grievous will not be attacking from both sides, now will he?

We have as skilled as he is Darth Maul might realize to attack the weapons instead Grievous himself (that's why Kenobi able to cut two of Grievous' arms off). Grievous is fast and strong and the move Maul used against Qui-Gon is probaly gonna send him flying due to kick from from Grievous and it should noted that Mual can block only two attacks at same time, but Grievous can launch four.

Lord Revan wrote: the move Maul used against Qui-Gon is probaly gonna send him flying due to kick from from Grievous

And kicking Grievous worked so well for Obi Wan, also didnt Maul hit Qui Gon with the saber hilt to finish him

Lord Revan wrote:
and it should noted that Mual can block only two attacks at same time, but Grievous can launch four.

If he is in his peak then there's no reason that he should attack with his leg, either a head crush attack or with another saber. (5 saber's attacking seperately at [based on the Rot's novel with 4 hand's] 25 attack's a second )

Grievous is used to fighting multiple saber's from multiple vector's, he usually whip's out (Going from the series and his penchance for surprise and fear) his 3d and 4th saber's when in a saber lock, something that could happen easily if Maul try's to hold his blade down like he did with Qui Gon.

the .303 bookworm wrote:

Lord Revan wrote: the move Maul used against Qui-Gon is probaly gonna send him flying due to kick from from Grievous

And kicking Grievous worked so well for Obi Wan, also didnt Maul hit Qui Gon with the saber hilt to finish him

I meant that if Maul used the hilt to strike at Grievous, he would find next useless and get hit by Grievous leg.

Lord Revan wrote:
and it should noted that Mual can block only two attacks at same time, but Grievous can launch four.

If he is in his peak then there's no reason that he should attack with his leg, either a head crush attack or with another saber. (5 saber's attacking seperately at [based on the Rot's novel with 4 hand's] 25 attack's a second )

Grievous is used to fighting multiple saber's from multiple vector's, he usually whip's out (Going from the series and his penchance for surprise and fear) his 3d and 4th saber's when in a saber lock, something that could happen easily if Maul try's to hold his blade down like he did with Qui Gon.

well ignored the leg, so no could blame me for Grievous

What's this bullshit about Maul not using Force powers in battle? For one thing, the exercise of Force power to limit or retard an opponent's movements is not necessarily visible. For another, he blew Obi-Wan off the precipice and into the pit with a Force push.

the .303 bookworm wrote:

Order 66 wrote:

Noble Ire wrote: Point. If it was a pre-Mace GG, I might reconsider.

Let's assume for all-intents and purposes, that Grievous is not impeded by any injury before his confrontation with Maul. And let's assume that Maul is also in ideal physical and fighting shape.

You mean that he is fighting at Clone war's, outrun blaster bolt's 5 saber's slaughter 1 Padawan, 2 Knight's and 2 master's level.

That Grievous was shown as partially resistant to some force attack's by "weaker" force user's (the Ithorian's scream, the force push by a Jedi master at clone war's level barely knocked him of a wall that he had barely jumped on), unless maul grow's a few more hand's out of his ass, it would take an act of Force to save him.

Grievous ran. The only way Grievous has won any of his encounters it through fear surprise. Maul has no fear, and it would have to be a surprise attack in which he was severly crippled or killed in one blow. We've seen what Maul can do. That's take one of the Order's best two duelist and except for fucking around, beat them both. Just remember, Obi Wan cut Grievous' hands off, but could only manage getting to Maul's sabre. Which he wasn't able to handle when Maul was concentrating on single sabre combat.

Lord Revan wrote:We have as skilled as he is Darth Maul might realize to attack the weapons instead Grievous himself (that's why Kenobi able to cut two of Grievous' arms off). Grievous is fast and strong and the move Maul used against Qui-Gon is probaly gonna send him flying due to kick from from Grievous and it should noted that Mual can block only two attacks at same time, but Grievous can launch four.

Obi Wan theoretically can only block one. Though he managed to lock two and even three up.

Hey, what happens in that sabre lock, if Maul drops and rotates his blades. Hope Grievous had jump rope on his alien world growing up.

Cal Wright wrote:

Lord Revan wrote:We have as skilled as he is Darth Maul might realize to attack the weapons instead Grievous himself (that's why Kenobi able to cut two of Grievous' arms off). Grievous is fast and strong and the move Maul used against Qui-Gon is probaly gonna send him flying due to kick from from Grievous and it should noted that Mual can block only two attacks at same time, but Grievous can launch four.

Obi Wan theoretically can only block one. Though he managed to lock two and even three up.

Hey, what happens in that sabre lock, if Maul drops and rotates his blades. Hope Grievous had jump rope on his alien world growing up.

true, both Grievous and Maul use a style/form that ultra aggressive, were as Form 3 is defensive to point of being almost passive.

Cal Wright wrote:That's take one of the Order's best two duelist and except for fucking around, beat them both. Just remember, Obi Wan cut Grievous' hands off, but could only manage getting to Maul's sabre. Which he wasn't able to handle when Maul was concentrating on single sabre combat.

Obi Wan was a padawn at the time, He was nowhere near the level he was at the time of ROTS where he only managed to beat Grievous by having a style that countered his perfectly and by surrendering himself fully to the force.
Obi Wan improved in over a decade.

Cal Wright wrote: Obi Wan theoretically can only block one. Though he managed to lock two and even three up.

What does this have to do with Obi wan

Cal Wright wrote: Hey, what happens in that sabre lock, if Maul drops and rotates his blades. Hope Grievous had jump rope on his alien world growing up.

If maul drop's his blade then Grievous will slice him with his three other unlocked blades, even if Maul catches all of Grievous's hand mounted saber's then he will be vulnerable to a foot attack while holding the lock.

Grievous can stand, maneuver and fight with one leg and yes he can play jump rope , (The training fight with Dooku in CW)

as for Darth Maul not using the Force, the only reason I can think of is that he's too focused on blocking Grievous' blows.

the .303 bookworm wrote:

Cal Wright wrote: Obi Wan theoretically can only block one. Though he managed to lock two and even three up.

What does this have to do with Obi wan

he is referring to Lord Revan's comment

Lord Revan wrote:and it should noted that Mual can block only two attacks at same time, but Grievous can launch four.

but number of blades does not equal number of attacks you can block. If that were true then Dooku would have fell to Anakin in the AotC and then again in RotS vs Anakin and Obi Wan then Sidious would have fell really fast in RotS versus the four masters and Obi Wan would have fell before Grievous but alas Obi Wan was able to block multiple saber attacks with one blade.