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I’m not seeking to create a three-sided conflict in this thread, but I am wondering if there are any organizations/alliances/really angry aliens in the Star Wars galaxy during the OT that had both the resources, military, and desire to remain apart from both Empire and Rebel Alliance, and could have done some minor system conquering at the expense of both sides.

Ssi-ruuk(???)

…I’ve got nothing. The Yuuzhan Vong don’t count, they’re not in the SW galaxy.

Powerful, but had no inclination to anger Empire

Corporate Sector Authority (question about them: why didn’t the CIS companies just move there, instead of engaging in risky separatism?)

Hapes Consortium (they’re isolationist, but maybe their remoteness instead of power kept the free of both sides. I wonder if they’re the Amazons in the Furry Conflict fanverse…?)

Pentastar Alignment (isolationist, post-Endor creation)

The Centrality (pro-Empire)

Battlehymn Republic wrote:Corporate Sector Authority (question about them: why didn’t the CIS companies just move there, instead of engaging in risky separatism?)

CSA isn't truly independent, though allowed govern their space as wish (as long they give the Empire share of profits) and they're Imperial era organazation so that's why the CIS didn't just join them.

Battlehymn Republic wrote: Ssi-ruuk(???)

Only reason they were kept alive was because Palpatine wanted their entechment technology -- IIRC, they were going to be destroyed/invaded once Palpy got his info/tech.

Corporate Sector Authority (question about them: why didn’t the CIS companies just move there, instead of engaging in risky separatism?)

Was the CSA around during ROTS? Either way, some of the vessels in the CSA fleet are leftover Imperial ships.

Hapes Consortium (they’re isolationist, but maybe their remoteness instead of power kept the free of both sides. I wonder if they’re the Amazons in the Furry Conflict fanverse…?)

If I remember right, the Empire did have a presence in Hapes borders.

Overall, I think if the Empire didn't mind you being a separate entity (while likely still paying some sort of tribute), you could survive... but without some sort of tribute being paid, it's doubtful there was any faction that could successfully stay out of the Empire.

Is there any more info on the Centrality beside what can can be found in the Lando Calrissian novels?

There is also some mention of the Trianii being a fairly powerful entity in the Guide to Species, although I'm not sure if that lasted against the Empire.

The Centrality?! Can anyone give me a brief description?

Techno_Union wrote:Overall, I think if the Empire didn't mind you being a separate entity (while likely still paying some sort of tribute), you could survive... but without some sort of tribute being paid, it's doubtful there was any faction that could successfully stay out of the Empire.

Yea, this probably sums up about the whole situation. In all truth, during the OT, no one had any real 'Independence' aside from the Rebels who were fighting by the skin of their teeth.

Noble Ire wrote:There is also some mention of the Trianii being a fairly powerful entity in the Guide to Species, although I'm not sure if that lasted against the Empire.

The last part of the entry in the Guide to Species book says that they remained independant of the Empire and the later New Republic. Though it seems the Empire never actively tried to take over their system -- only the CSA did.

Jawawithagun wrote:Is there any more info on the Centrality beside what can can be found in the Lando Calrissian novels?

The article "A Campaign Guide to the Centrality" by Michael Kogge was printed in Star Wars Gamer No. 5. It does mention that "in return for a degree of semi-independence and economic aid, the Centrality has sworn allegiance to the Empire." It is probable that the Centrality's legal status is that of a client state like the Corporate Sector, Hutt Space, and the Tion Hegemony; i.e., it is formally independent, but still subject to the Empire's control.

One interesting sub-Regional, multi-Sector power is the Commonality, a confederation of nine Sectors in the Outer Rim, which Geonosis and the Outer Rim Worlds mentions in its article on Vorzyd V. It is unclear how this sub-state functions within the Empire's federal framework, although it is mentioned that Senator Simon Greyshade's relative, Dietrich Greyshade, is the responsible Moff for the Commonality. The fact that it has a Moff implies that it is fully integrated within the Empire and not a client state or satellite state like the Hapes Consortium.

Techno_Union wrote:

Noble Ire wrote:There is also some mention of the Trianii being a fairly powerful entity in the Guide to Species, although I'm not sure if that lasted against the Empire.

The last part of the entry in the Guide to Species book says that they remained independant of the Empire and the later New Republic. Though it seems the Empire never actively tried to take over their system -- only the CSA did.

The Trianii seem to be one of those species, like the Chiss and the Ssi-Ruuk, who were simply to remote to be bothered with. They only had about a dozen worlds under their control, and I think the only reason the CSA didn't crush them is that they would have been caught if they had violated their charter in such a flagrant fashion.

Quadlok wrote:

Techno_Union wrote:

Noble Ire wrote:There is also some mention of the Trianii being a fairly powerful entity in the Guide to Species, although I'm not sure if that lasted against the Empire.

The last part of the entry in the Guide to Species book says that they remained independant of the Empire and the later New Republic. Though it seems the Empire never actively tried to take over their system -- only the CSA did.

The Trianii seem to be one of those species, like the Chiss and the Ssi-Ruuk, who were simply to remote to be bothered with. They only had about a dozen worlds under their control, and I think the only reason the CSA didn't crush them is that they would have been caught if they had violated their charter in such a flagrant fashion.

Actually, the Guide to Species book indicates that the CSA might not win in a fight against the Trianii.

Captain Jirprin Kosh of the Corporate Sector Authority - Guide to Species, Pg. 134 wrote:Fifteen Trianii attack vessels set upon us, and they had us completely surrounded. They destroyed most of our fighters and our motivator systems, rendering us helpless in space. Then, despite our offers for surrender, they busted through out shields and boarded the vessel, slaughtering everyone in their path on the way to the bridge.

When they reached the command staff, they took us as prisoners to their lead ship. There I was forced, on my knees, to explain my presence in the Trianii system and to apologize for our interference there. After this, they set us back on our own ship to limp back to our own system as a warning to others who would test them. I suggested to my superiors that we heed the warning.

Techno_Union wrote: Actually, the Guide to Species book indicates that the CSA might not win in a fight against the Trianii.

Captain Jirprin Kosh of the Corporate Sector Authority Guide to Species, Pg. 134 wrote:Fifteen Trianii attack vessels set upon us, and they had us completely surrounded. They destroyed most of our fighters and our motivator systems, rendering us helpless in space. Then, despite our offers for surrender, they busted through out shields and boarded the vessel, slaughtering everyone in their path on the way to the bridge.

When they reached the command staff, they took us as prisoners to their lead ship. There I was forced, on my knees, to explain my presence in the Trianii system and to apologize for our interference there. After this, they set us back on our own ship to limp back to our own system as a warning to others who would test them. I suggested to my superiors that we heed the warning.

The CSA has, at minimum, 250 Victory Star Destroyers, an unknown number of Invincible cruisers, and a large number of Marauder corvettes, and likely has the resources to build more warships if they were needed. If they really wanted to, they would undoubtably be able to overpower a civilization as small as the Trianii.

However, as their charter specifically states that their territory is not to include any native sentient species, and the Trianii are powerful enough to put up a noticable resistance, any invasion would simply be to difficult for the CSA to sweep under the rug to be worth the trouble.

On another subject, there is a race of unknown but potentially great power, that being the race of monks that live in the Kathol rift. They seem to be extremely powerful in the Force and their ships have appreciable firepower. However, they are extremely isolationist, and are unlikely to launch a waar of aggression.

Techno_Union wrote:

Quadlok wrote:

Techno_Union wrote: The last part of the entry in the Guide to Species book says that they remained independant of the Empire and the later New Republic. Though it seems the Empire never actively tried to take over their system -- only the CSA did.

The Trianii seem to be one of those species, like the Chiss and the Ssi-Ruuk, who were simply to remote to be bothered with. They only had about a dozen worlds under their control, and I think the only reason the CSA didn't crush them is that they would have been caught if they had violated their charter in such a flagrant fashion.

Actually, the Guide to Species book indicates that the CSA might not win in a fight against the Trianii.

Captain Jirprin Kosh of the Corporate Sector Authority - Guide to Species, Pg. 134 wrote:Fifteen Trianii attack vessels set upon us, and they had us completely surrounded. They destroyed most of our fighters and our motivator systems, rendering us helpless in space. Then, despite our offers for surrender, they busted through out shields and boarded the vessel, slaughtering everyone in their path on the way to the bridge.

When they reached the command staff, they took us as prisoners to their lead ship. There I was forced, on my knees, to explain my presence in the Trianii system and to apologize for our interference there. After this, they set us back on our own ship to limp back to our own system as a warning to others who would test them. I suggested to my superiors that we heed the warning.

If this would have happened to the main imperial starfleet during the height of the Empire, they would have been so angered, that I bet they would have send a bigger strike fleet to destroy them all. (meaning that no Trianii will come out of this alive)

Tribun wrote: If this would have happened to the main imperial starfleet during the height of the Empire, they would have been so angered, that I bet they would have send a bigger strike fleet to destroy them all. (meaning that no Trianii will come out of this alive)

More than likely. But I suppose the Trianii's location (IIRC, the outer edges of the CSA and the galaxy), helped them immensely in avoiding the Empire.

There's a lot we don't know about the Trianii though, we don't know how many ships the CSA threw at them, or what type of ships they were (don't take this to mean that I believe the CSA or the Empire couldn't win in a larger battle). The Guide mentions that they are advanced -- problem then being advanced compared to whom?

On topic the thread: I doubt the Trianii could stand up to the Empire and live to tell about it.

On topic the thread: I doubt the Trianii could stand up to the Empire and live to tell about it.

True, at its height, no established galactic power could even come close to the power of the GE at its height. The only ones that might have a chance at all would be the Vong (they would still lose) and the two canon "Star Trek like Ancients" races, being the afformentioned Monks, and those Orb things from the Lando Calrissian books.

Noble Ire wrote: True, at its height, no established galactic power could even come close to the power of the GE at its height. The only ones that might have a chance at all would be the Vong (they would still lose) and the two canon "Star Trek like Ancients" races, being the afformentioned Monks, and those Orb things from the Lando Calrissian books.

Orb things?

Do you mean Vuufi Wa's race of sentient intergalactic giant space robot species or the race that built the temple that manipulated time and space?
(Both might stand a chance)

the .303 bookworm wrote:Do you mean Vuufi Wa's race of sentient intergalactic giant space robot species or the race that built the temple that manipulated time and space?
(Both might stand a chance)

The former.
I only heard about this from the Essential chronology, so I'm unfamiliar with the latter.
Lando's a regular James T. Kirk, isnt he?

Lando . . . Lando got into some weird shit back in the day.

The CSA was around pre-Empire. It was an independant faction during the clone wars.

The Hapes Consortium was conquored by the Empire, but was allowed a degree of self-governance.

The Pentastar Alignmant was a post-Endor Imperial successor state, akin to the warlord fiefdoms in the Core, Zsinj's territory, the Citruic Hegemony, or any number of the other Imperial splinter states. It was incredibly powerful, though, and a number of Grand Admirals, former moffs, dark side Prophets and inquisitors aligned themselves with it. It lasted until being conquored by the Imperial Remnant between the years 50-52 post resynch (ca 15-17 ABY).

If anyone's interested, I made a fairly detailed chart a few months ago detailing the successor and splinter states of the Galactic Empire. It's a little out of date, but it's helpful in showing visually the different nation-states.

If anyone's interested, I made a fairly detailed chart a few months ago detailing the successor and splinter states of the Galactic Empire. It's a little out of date, but it's helpful in showing visually the different nation-states.

Could you provide a link?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v287/ ... Slide1.png

The chart's a little on the big side, but unfortunately that's the only way to convey that amount of info graphically and still have readable text.

Like I said, it need updating... there may be a couple of errors, and the Desann/Fyyar alliance for example was revealed just a couple of days ago to be under Lord Hethrir and his Empire Reborn, which I neglected to add.

A very interesting chart, seeing it updated would be nice.
The inclusion of the False Prophets is a bit dubious though.

There are a handful of difficulties with the chart in its current form. Although one supposes that one could interpret the Galactic Emperor's speech to the Senate as naming that state the "First Galactic Empire" (versus the "first Galactic Empire"), there is no basis for the usage "Second Galactic Empire" to refer to the Empire ruled by the reincarnated Galactic Emperor on Byss (in fact, the fact that the neo-Palpatinist movement served by Brakiss in the Young Jedi Knights series is called the "Second Imperium" and its pseudo-Palpatine called "the Great Leader of the Second Imperium" precludes the usage "Second Galactic Empire," as the Second Imperium would therefore be the Third Imperium). The chart also implies that the Galactic Emperor reincarnated after the Battle of Dathomir, when the Dark Empire Sourcebook sets his reincarnation at about one year after the Battle of Endor (i.e., during Isard's regency). The chart also obscures the fact that the Emperor's Ruling Circle controlled the Empire after the fall of Isard's regency, and that indeed Thrawn was nominally their shôgun rather than the formal leader of the Empire.

You might also want to note that some groups, like Lianna and the Corporate Sector Authority, also splintered from the Empire but declined to join the New Republic or any other warlords, as mentioned in the Dark Empire Sourcebook.

Ford Prefect wrote:Lando . . . Lando got into some weird shit back in the day.

That's Captainmasterlandocalrissiansir to you

edit: P.S. That's an awesome chart, Glaidus, now you just need to update it with the GFFA.