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Hi guys and gals,

I was wondering if anyone knew how many Victory class star destroyers MK II it would take to beat an ISD MKII. Is a VSD MKII half the power of an ISD or is it less.

guyver wrote:Hi guys and gals,

I was wondering if anyone knew how many Victory class star destroyers MK II it would take to beat an ISD MKII. Is a VSD MKII half the power of an ISD or is it less.

All things being equal, two, three at the most. Two of them have the advantage of displaced targets forcing the ISD to shift fire between the two of them. Three are roughly equal to or slightly larger then the ISD and can field the same number of fighters.

It would probably take two. A VSD is only a little less powerful than an ISD. Properly handled they should be able to take an ISD though both can expect a beating in return.

Keep in mind, three dreadnaughts are a serious (ie potential lethal) threat to an ISD Mk2 so I see no reason VSD which are more powerful would need grater numbers.

Thanks for the quick feedback

I am starting a story with an ISD vs VSD type theme.

guyver wrote:Thanks for the quick feedback

I am starting a story with an ISD vs VSD type theme.

Much like the first part of Darksaber, eh?

Alyeska wrote:

guyver wrote:Hi guys and gals,

I was wondering if anyone knew how many Victory class star destroyers MK II it would take to beat an ISD MKII. Is a VSD MKII half the power of an ISD or is it less.

All things being equal, two, three at the most. Two of them have the advantage of displaced targets forcing the ISD to shift fire between the two of them. Three are roughly equal to or slightly larger then the ISD and can field the same number of fighters.

Ditto, there is something to be said about slitting the attension of one's opponent. Fire and manuver.

Stormbringer wrote:It would probably take two. A VSD is only a little less powerful than an ISD. Properly handled they should be able to take an ISD though both can expect a beating in return.

Keep in mind, three dreadnaughts are a serious (ie potential lethal) threat to an ISD Mk2 so I see no reason VSD which are more powerful would need grater numbers.

Ehm...what? It is made pretty clear in the Thrawn trilogy that even 3 Dreadnaughts with ion cannons are no match for an ISD MKII. When the Falcon and Bel Iblis's ship escape Abregado-Rae and an ISD chases them but 3 Dreads come to assist, it is mentioned that the Dreads could hold the ISD for a while but they would be no match for it in long term fight.

Ditto, there is something to be said about slitting the attension of one's opponent. Fire and manuver

Funny, I always thought VSD's and ISD's had very little in the way of manuvering capability. Great linear acceleration, but not excatly a nimble pair of vessels. I wouldnt think there would be much room for manuver at all, considering the fire rates. Be more of a slashing attack Id think.

On VSD's taking on an ISD, how long would it take a trio of VSD's to destroy an ISD 2?

Rightous Fist Of Heaven wrote:

Stormbringer wrote:It would probably take two. A VSD is only a little less powerful than an ISD. Properly handled they should be able to take an ISD though both can expect a beating in return.

Keep in mind, three dreadnaughts are a serious (ie potential lethal) threat to an ISD Mk2 so I see no reason VSD which are more powerful would need grater numbers.

Ehm...what? It is made pretty clear in the Thrawn trilogy that even 3 Dreadnaughts with ion cannons are no match for an ISD MKII. When the Falcon and Bel Iblis's ship escape Abregado-Rae and an ISD chases them but 3 Dreads come to assist, it is mentioned that the Dreads could hold the ISD for a while but they would be no match for it in long term fight.

That quote has always had me wondering. It seemed quite clear that the Dreadnaughts were a threat to the ISD, yet they said they couldn't take on the ISD in the long run. My interpretation of the events is that three Dreadnaughts can roughly equal an ISD (fighters excluded) however two Dreadnaughts are likely to be destroyed and it leaves a damaged ISD against a relatively fresh Dreadnaught. The quote in question was probably regarding that Iblis did not want to loose any Dreadnaughts thus his fleet wasn't enough to fully handle the ISD.

Interesting note:

A VSD 1 is stronger then a VSD 2. From weapons comparrison, The VSD 2 is the same strength as the Dreadnaught, presumably with just more speed, better armor, and better shields. My theory with this is that as the Dreadnaught served as a lighter version of the Vic one to augment fleets and turn up where a whole vic wasn't needed, the Vic 2 was designed to serve in the same role with the newer ISD replacing the Vic 1.

I always saw the Vic acting in a destroyer role more than a battleship. Seems to me it was better equppied for dealing with fighter and small craft threats than for going head to head with a cruiser class or heavier. They'd act more as fleet defenders and as a swift strike force to strike deep into the enemy line and harrass the rear elements and support vessels.

As for even three VSD2 against an ISD2? They might prevail, but I think the cost of victory would be high

The VSD is actually very slow, and most fighters and small warships can easily outrun it. The official sources state that the ISD is a direct successor of the VSD, taking over its role as the fleet's big ships.

pellaeons_scion wrote:

Ditto, there is something to be said about slitting the attension of one's opponent. Fire and manuver

Funny, I always thought VSD's and ISD's had very little in the way of manuvering capability. Great linear acceleration, but not excatly a nimble pair of vessels. I wouldnt think there would be much room for manuver at all, considering the fire rates. Be more of a slashing attack Id think.

On VSD's taking on an ISD, how long would it take a trio of VSD's to destroy an ISD 2?

Exactly my point. If you have two realitively unmanuverable ships fighting against and splitting the attension of another realitively unmanuberable ship, the by default the two have more manuverability than just the one. Also, the weapons of the one have to split their time between two targets while the two opponents can concentrated on the one.

If your accuracy is good enough, this doesn't really matter, and in fact can work for the larger combatant. Say an ISD is twive as powerful as a VSD, and there are 2 VSDs fighting an ISD. Assume 100% accuracy, just for the hell of it. If the ISD focuses all fire on one VSD, it will die when half of the ISD's shields are gone. Then the ISD focuses fire on the other, and is only subjected to half of the original VSD firepower, while it still fires with full force.

Howedar wrote:If your accuracy is good enough, this doesn't really matter, and in fact can work for the larger combatant. Say an ISD is twive as powerful as a VSD, and there are 2 VSDs fighting an ISD. Assume 100% accuracy, just for the hell of it. If the ISD focuses all fire on one VSD, it will die when half of the ISD's shields are gone. Then the ISD focuses fire on the other, and is only subjected to half of the original VSD firepower, while it still fires with full force.

Which is why you have to remember the manuver part. If one Victory moves toward the rear to the ISD and the other Vic moves towars the front, then the commander of the ISD needs to calculate the potential threat of each and choose one to follow.

Or another way, if one droppes below the ventral hull and the other above the same applies. If the shielding between the combatants were grossly outmatched then the manuvering would not be that effective, but since the Vics can hold up to 200GT for a short time, then they have time to wear the ISD down.

Alyeska wrote:

Rightous Fist Of Heaven wrote:

Stormbringer wrote:It would probably take two. A VSD is only a little less powerful than an ISD. Properly handled they should be able to take an ISD though both can expect a beating in return.

Keep in mind, three dreadnaughts are a serious (ie potential lethal) threat to an ISD Mk2 so I see no reason VSD which are more powerful would need grater numbers.

Ehm...what? It is made pretty clear in the Thrawn trilogy that even 3 Dreadnaughts with ion cannons are no match for an ISD MKII. When the Falcon and Bel Iblis's ship escape Abregado-Rae and an ISD chases them but 3 Dreads come to assist, it is mentioned that the Dreads could hold the ISD for a while but they would be no match for it in long term fight.

That quote has always had me wondering. It seemed quite clear that the Dreadnaughts were a threat to the ISD, yet they said they couldn't take on the ISD in the long run. My interpretation of the events is that three Dreadnaughts can roughly equal an ISD (fighters excluded) however two Dreadnaughts are likely to be destroyed and it leaves a damaged ISD against a relatively fresh Dreadnaught. The quote in question was probably regarding that Iblis did not want to loose any Dreadnaughts thus his fleet wasn't enough to fully handle the ISD.

That's Han's thoughts, not Bel Ibis's.
And as far as Bel Ibis was concerned, they had a near-limitless supply of Dreadnaughts from the Katana fleet graveyard.

If the ISD concentrates fire always on just one of the Dreadnoughts and she always show just one side to them, I think the ISD will win.

While she erase the first Dreadnought she will loose her shield on the -let's say- left side.
Then she turns, while grabs the disabled Dreadnought on a tractor beam to cover his unshielded side.
While she deals with the other two Dreadnoughts, the right side shield will fall also and the ISD will take some hits as well, but at the end all three Dreadnoughts would blow.

Boba Fett wrote:If the ISD concentrates fire always on just one of the Dreadnoughts and she always show just one side to them, I think the ISD will win.

While she erase the first Dreadnought she will loose her shield on the -let's say- left side.
Then she turns, while grabs the disabled Dreadnought on a tractor beam to cover his unshielded side.
While she deals with the other two Dreadnoughts, the right side shield will fall also and the ISD will take some hits as well, but at the end all three Dreadnoughts would blow.

This assumes the Dreadnaughts do practically nothing and let the ISD win.

Both classes of ISDs are actually FASTER than either VSD class. So this means it could outrun both ships, tug one along with a few tractors away from the other one, and split them up that way. They wouldn't stand a chance against a competent ISD captain.