StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Forgive me if this has been discussed before, I did a brief search but found nothing relevant.

First of all, was the Death Star under construction in the closing scene of ROTS the DS1, or the Death Star prototype?

Second, if that was the original Death Star, and it took them nearly from the time the Empire began until the time of the first film to construct it, how long did it take them to build the second Death Star to the level of completion that we saw in ROTJ?

Did they actually wait until after the original Death Star was destroyed to start building it, and rely on improved technology, greater manpower and better understanding of the way the system worked to speed construction along? Or did construction on the DS2 actually begin before the destruction of the DS1 at the Battle of Yavin?

I'd be interested to know, as I found the closing scene of ROTS compelling, but also very interesting for these reasons.

The proportions are wrong for it to be the DS proper. It has to be a prototype.

RThurmont wrote:Forgive me if this has been discussed before, I did a brief search but found nothing relevant.

First of all, was the Death Star under construction in the closing scene of ROTS the DS1, or the Death Star prototype?

Second, if that was the original Death Star, and it took them nearly from the time the Empire began until the time of the first film to construct it, how long did it take them to build the second Death Star to the level of completion that we saw in ROTJ?

Did they actually wait until after the original Death Star was destroyed to start building it, and rely on improved technology, greater manpower and better understanding of the way the system worked to speed construction along? Or did construction on the DS2 actually begin before the destruction of the DS1 at the Battle of Yavin?

I'd be interested to know, as I found the closing scene of ROTS compelling, but also very interesting for these reasons.

actually building of death stars took 1-5 years

darth korte wrote:

RThurmont wrote:Forgive me if this has been discussed before, I did a brief search but found nothing relevant.

First of all, was the Death Star under construction in the closing scene of ROTS the DS1, or the Death Star prototype?

Second, if that was the original Death Star, and it took them nearly from the time the Empire began until the time of the first film to construct it, how long did it take them to build the second Death Star to the level of completion that we saw in ROTJ?

Did they actually wait until after the original Death Star was destroyed to start building it, and rely on improved technology, greater manpower and better understanding of the way the system worked to speed construction along? Or did construction on the DS2 actually begin before the destruction of the DS1 at the Battle of Yavin?

I'd be interested to know, as I found the closing scene of ROTS compelling, but also very interesting for these reasons.

actually building of death stars took 1-5 years

Source? If DS2 only took nine months, DS1 should've taken much less time.

DS1 was constructed while the Imperial Senate still existed, so it had to be built slower and in secret from it. DS2 had the luxury of being built while there was no longer a senate, so the Empire had free reign to build it as fast as they could.

Didn't the DS:TC or some other source say, that the DS1 took two years to built?

I don't think so. I own the book and I don't recall any sort of construction time scale.

I don't think the presence of the Imperial Senate would have a material impact on how long it would take to build the DS1, as the Senate as far as I know had no independent intelligence agency or any other means by which it could bypass the Imperial government to find out. The only way the Senate could have found out would be through the Rebel Alliance and the anti-Imperial senators such as Bail & Leia Organa and Mon Mothma, which is exactly what happened, but way too late to do anything about it.

Furthermore, even if the Senate had found out, what could they have done? Told Palpatine to stop? He would have found a way to downplay their concerns until the Death Star was complete.

It's worth noting that that Death Star we see at the end of ROTS could be a prototype, since a prototype Death Star was mentioned and described in detail in one of the EU novels. Illustrations of the prototype Death Star depicted it as skeletal, which the Death Star we see at the end of ROTS looks like. Perhaps if that was the DS1, it would look more like the DS2 did under construction. However, we really don't know, and I'm still unsure as to what was actually seen at the end of ROTS, so hopefully someone here has an answer.

The thing at the end of RotS is the incomplete CIS Great Weapon. That most of us have been over multiple times, so that's not an issue anymore.

The construction of DS1 had to be kept in secret from the Imperial Senate because they would have demanded that it be cancelled and would cause an uproar over the sensibilites and ethics of the Empire.

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:The thing at the end of RotS is the incomplete CIS Great Weapon. That most of us have been over multiple times, so that's not an issue anymore.

The construction of DS1 had to be kept in secret from the Imperial Senate because they would have demanded that it be cancelled and would cause an uproar over the sensibilites and ethics of the Empire.

What's wrong with building a measly old planetary miner? What? You don't want the Empire to have the material resources it needs to provide for its citizens!? How dare you, you obviously don't care for anyone but yourself!

Plushie wrote:

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:The thing at the end of RotS is the incomplete CIS Great Weapon. That most of us have been over multiple times, so that's not an issue anymore.

The construction of DS1 had to be kept in secret from the Imperial Senate because they would have demanded that it be cancelled and would cause an uproar over the sensibilites and ethics of the Empire.

What's wrong with building a measly old planetary miner? What? You don't want the Empire to have the material resources it needs to provide for its citizens!? How dare you, you obviously don't care for anyone but yourself!

The fact that it was a heavily armed and protected station negates the excuse of calling it a "measly old planetary miner", even though that was the justification given to the people responsible for designing the superlaser. Such a claim wouldn't have flown with the Senate.

The Senate wouldn't need an intelligence agency to find out about the DS1 if it was built at full speed because they'd notice the huge increase in military spending and start asking questions and nosing around where the emperor didn't want them to, heck its said in the ISD's backstory that the Senate was reluctant to approve the funding for the building of the ISD's which, in total, are in all likelihood cheaper than the DS1.

Firefox wrote: The fact that it was a heavily armed and protected station negates the excuse of calling it a "measly old planetary miner", even though that was the justification given to the people responsible for designing the superlaser. Such a claim wouldn't have flown with the Senate.

What, we can't let such a powerful mining tool to fall into the hands of those who would use it for evil, now could we? You're really starting to strike me as someone who doesn't want the Empire and her citizens to benefit from the great advances in technology we've experienced over the last twenty years...

Ok ok, I'll stop.

Plushie wrote:What, we can't let such a powerful mining tool to fall into the hands of those who would use it for evil, now could we? You're really starting to strike me as someone who doesn't want the Empire and her citizens to benefit from the great advances in technology we've experienced over the last twenty years...

You're missing the point. The "mining tool" excuse wouldn't fly because it's a military facility, equipped with weapons, shields, and thick armor. It's not something you'd expect miners to haul around.

FTeik wrote:Didn't the DS:TC or some other source say, that the DS1 took two years to built?

From the Star Wars Technical Journal.

Star Wars Technical Journal, page 100
An unoccupied and isolated sector of space was chosen as the construction site. For nearly two years, every resource of the Empire was directed toward the completion of the project. Grand Moff Tarkin, a former governor of one of the outlying territories, had served as project supervisor of the battle station and was awared command of the Death Star once it was complete.

This is also mentioned at the Death Star entry over at the SWTC.

You're missing the point. The "mining tool" excuse wouldn't fly because it's a military facility, equipped with weapons, shields, and thick armor. It's not something you'd expect miners to haul around.

Your forgeting that much of the mining in the SW universe takes place in asteriod fields. In fact, a smaller scale Death Star would be an Ideal mining home base, with enough shielding and firepower to shrug off any asteriod impacts, and a superlaser to break up larger rocks for more managable processing.

Noble Ire wrote:Your forgeting that much of the mining in the SW universe takes place in asteriod fields. In fact, a smaller scale Death Star would be an Ideal mining home base, with enough shielding and firepower to shrug off any asteriod impacts, and a superlaser to break up larger rocks for more managable processing.

Not to the same degree of armor, shields and weaponry that the Death Star possessed! That's the point I'm trying to reach.

Plushie wrote: What's wrong with building a measly old planetary miner? What? You don't want the Empire to have the material resources it needs to provide for its citizens!? How dare you, you obviously don't care for anyone but yourself!

Of the quadrillions of people in the entire galaxy, there's only one truly dumb enough to fall for a moronic story like that: Qui Xux.

I guess that makes her the Ann Coulter of the Empire. "'What about when those vile Rebels declared we were using our mobile recycling factories as 'wold devestator' war machines?' 'Those were war machines, Qui Xux.' 'Are you sure? I'm pretty sure they were recycling-' 'No Qui, no.'"

Firefox wrote:

Noble Ire wrote:Your forgeting that much of the mining in the SW universe takes place in asteriod fields. In fact, a smaller scale Death Star would be an Ideal mining home base, with enough shielding and firepower to shrug off any asteriod impacts, and a superlaser to break up larger rocks for more managable processing.

Not to the same degree of armor, shields and weaponry that the Death Star possessed! That's the point I'm trying to reach.

True.
Still, if our government can buy "Teh WMDs!11!!!!!", I think its possible that Palpatine might be able to pass of the DS.

Firefox wrote:

Plushie wrote:What, we can't let such a powerful mining tool to fall into the hands of those who would use it for evil, now could we? You're really starting to strike me as someone who doesn't want the Empire and her citizens to benefit from the great advances in technology we've experienced over the last twenty years...

You're missing the point. The "mining tool" excuse wouldn't fly because it's a military facility, equipped with weapons, shields, and thick armor. It's not something you'd expect miners to haul around.

Calm down, I was being highly facetious.

Surlethe wrote:

darth korte wrote:

RThurmont wrote:Forgive me if this has been discussed before, I did a brief search but found nothing relevant.

First of all, was the Death Star under construction in the closing scene of ROTS the DS1, or the Death Star prototype?

Second, if that was the original Death Star, and it took them nearly from the time the Empire began until the time of the first film to construct it, how long did it take them to build the second Death Star to the level of completion that we saw in ROTJ?

Did they actually wait until after the original Death Star was destroyed to start building it, and rely on improved technology, greater manpower and better understanding of the way the system worked to speed construction along? Or did construction on the DS2 actually begin before the destruction of the DS1 at the Battle of Yavin?

I'd be interested to know, as I found the closing scene of ROTS compelling, but also very interesting for these reasons.

actually building of death stars took 1-5 years

Source? If DS2 only took nine months, DS1 should've taken much less time.

i forget post that "up to"

applejack wrote:

FTeik wrote:Didn't the DS:TC or some other source say, that the DS1 took two years to built?

From the Star Wars Technical Journal.

Star Wars Technical Journal, page 100
An unoccupied and isolated sector of space was chosen as the construction site. For nearly two years, every resource of the Empire was directed toward the completion of the project. Grand Moff Tarkin, a former governor of one of the outlying territories, had served as project supervisor of the battle station and was awared command of the Death Star once it was complete.

This is also mentioned at the Death Star entry over at the SWTC.

As much sense as that would make, Lucas can override any of that stuff if he wants to. It's his baby, after all. I've heard that the station you see at the end of ROTS is the DS1, regardless of its proportions being wrong or not. If it took 19 years to build it must have gone through a lot of interruptions along the way.

If the station seen at the end of RotS *is* the DS1 it's the same difference since it'd have to be completely rebuilt right down to the superstructure.

Are its proportions really that out of whack? I've only seen the movie once and haven't seen any good pictures of it since. Got any links?

Seriouly, I'd just as soon have it that it's not the DS1, but I'd also rather have Han Solo shoot first, and we saw how well that worked out.

Kenoshi wrote:Are its proportions really that out of whack? I've only seen the movie once and haven't seen any good pictures of it since. Got any links?

http://www.theforce.net/swtc/ds/ruction.html#cgw

It's quite different.