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Watching my disk earlier today I noticed a few things that, in my opinion, upped Jedi abilities considerably...

Notably:

1.) Anakin manages to leap at least one and a half times his own height as the elevator drops;

2.) He then jumps across to the back of the shaft, and across as the elevator comes up at a very rapid clip, landing on it with apparently only a slight loss of breath;

3.) Count Dooku kicks Anakin at least ten, fifteen feet across the room during their fight, just before he starts levitating and choking Obi-wan;

4.) Dooku then flings Obi-wan a good thirty-forty feet across the room.

5.) When running with Palpatine down the elevator shaft, and it tilts, Anakin is able to grab onto some loose wires, with Palpatine hanging on to his leg and Obi-wan on his back-- but a.) his artifical arm doesn't rip out of its socket, and b.) his arm doesn't even dislocate, which one should expect from any such similar feat.

6.) In the fight on Mustafar, Obi-wan and Anakin both leap from a pretty fair height, to land upon relatively small surfaces-- even smaller in Anakin's case.

These are just some examples... once quantified, I imagine they could be very useful in debate.

Example-- take my #5; we can find the approximate weights of Hayden, Ian Mcdiarmid and Ewan Mcgregor. We can then calculate what the force of dropping... looked like 20-ish? feet... would do to an average person had they grabbed onto a loose wire like that, as we know most of the relative limitations of the human body. Now, add Ewan and Mcdiarmid's weight on to that of Hayden's... and suddenly his arm and shoulder joint has much more to support.

I don't have these numbers at my fingertips, but I'm just putting this forward as an example of what we could do with these.

Feel free to add any other similar feats from the prequels if desired...

Were there not greater jumps seen in the Theed reactor battle? Darth Maul, Qui-Gon and Obi-Wann made some very impressive leaps from one catwalk to another.

Also, can we safely assume that the gravitational field in the elevator shaft was 9.8 m/s^2? The artificial gravity was known to be going wonky. Of course, it could just as easily have been less as more. Perhaps the gravitational field strength has to be confirmed first.

Another quantifiable feat, which Mike has pointed out, is the fact that Jedi can survive and do battle in very inhospitable environments. A normal human would die when exposed to Mustafarian conditions.

Shroom Man 777 wrote:Another quantifiable feat, which Mike has pointed out, is the fact that Jedi can survive and do battle in very inhospitable environments. A normal human would die when exposed to Mustafarian conditions.

That's really a question of vulcanology, something I don't think anyone here has great knowledge of. We don't know enough about the makeup of the lava in question to say much about its toxicity. As I understand it, some volcanos don't put out much gas at all - there are many types of lava with varying composition and viscosity, just on earth. Whatever the lava they were 'mining energy out of' on Mustafar was, it's likely not even the same as any lava we have on Earth. The properties of the gasses that come out of it are unknown.

It certainly isn't quantifyable. The most impressive bit there is that they're not harmed by bits of lava hitting ther robes.

Elheru Aran wrote:We can then calculate what the force of dropping... looked like 20-ish? feet...

Not really, the gravity aboard the IH was in flux at this stage (Besides. If you're in a ship that's dropping towards a planet, you will notice no gravitational pull from the planet moving you relative to the ship - that's why people in the vomit-comet and the shuttle feel weightless when they are in fact, falling - thus, the gravitational force pulling them towards the bow was from a malfunction in the ship's compensators and gravity units) as I recall, and we don't have a contnous shot of the fall to work from.

NecronLord wrote:That's really a question of vulcanology, something I don't think anyone here has great knowledge of. We don't know enough about the makeup of the lava in question to say much about its toxicity. As I understand it, some volcanos don't put out much gas at all - there are many types of lava with varying composition and viscosity, just on earth. Whatever the lava they were 'mining energy out of' on Mustafar was, it's likely not even the same as any lava we have on Earth. The properties of the gasses that come out of it are unknown.

It certainly isn't quantifyable. The most impressive bit there is that they're not harmed by bits of lava hitting ther robes.

Aw, damn. For a second, I kinda forgot what 'quantifyable' meant. Silly me. Still, the fact that the lava was hot enough to cause Ani to spontaneously combust...

Shroom Man 777 wrote:Still, the fact that the lava was hot enough to cause Ani to spontaneously combust...

His clothes caught light. His flesh didn't burst into flames. If anything, this scene makes his feat weaker - the RotJ novel described him as surviving lava flowing up his back.

NecronLord wrote:Not really, the gravity aboard the IH was in flux at this stage (Besides. If you're in a ship that's dropping towards a planet, you will notice no gravitational pull from the planet moving you relative to the ship - that's why people in the vomit-comet and the shuttle feel weightless when they are in fact, falling - thus, the gravitational force pulling them towards the bow was from a malfunction in the ship's compensators and gravity units) as I recall, and we don't have a contnous shot of the fall to work from.

The gravitational force pulling them towards the bow was I think, Courascant's gravity. A space-ship in orbit (or it's occupants) does not feel gravity because it is in a constant state of free fall. However, the Invisible Hand may have not actually been in freefall, such a large object so close to the planet is more likely to have been held up by its repulsors. I think the artificial gravity had been shut-off in the Hand and the power sent to more important systems, especially since it wasn't needed. This is the reason why when the ship's interiors became perpendicular to the planet's surface, everything fell towards the planet. It is probable that the artificial gravity was on at very low power, since at that altitude the gravity felt by occupants of a static object would be around .6g-7g (rough guess). In this case when the IH listed, the artificial gravity may have shut-off.

Adrian Laguna wrote:(rough guess)

Bingo. Unquantifiable without a full shot of the fall.

Is there anyone here willing to argue with a straight face that a normal human could survive zooming right over that river of lava like Anakin and Obi-Wan did? Even if we assume the little hoverpads they were riding shielded them perfectly from below?

LordShaithis wrote:Is there anyone here willing to argue with a straight face that a normal human could survive zooming right over that river of lava like Anakin and Obi-Wan did? Even if we assume the little hoverpads they were riding shielded them perfectly from below?

<smirks> Beat me too it, I don't care what Jedi powers you have "Lava Surfing" inches about molten rock was Boo-O-o-O-gus.

There are a lot of nasty gases in evidence from the violence "burstiness" of the lava on Mustafar. There are leva flows on Earth which are less dangerous to be around, but they don't hurl gouts of lava fifty feet in the air. Remember that the installation actually required energy shielding.

As for Anakin igniting, I didn't see any of the lava flying up and hitting the bottoms of his legs.

Crossroads Inc. wrote:

LordShaithis wrote:Is there anyone here willing to argue with a straight face that a normal human could survive zooming right over that river of lava like Anakin and Obi-Wan did? Even if we assume the little hoverpads they were riding shielded them perfectly from below?

<smirks> Beat me too it, I don't care what Jedi powers you have "Lava Surfing" inches about molten rock was Boo-O-o-O-gus.

In KJA's Jedi Search, Luke actually walked on lava. With his feet.

Darth Wong wrote:Remember that the installation actually required energy shielding.

Hell, if I recall correctly, didn't the installation itself begin to melt after the shields went down? I tend to view Anakin and Obi-Wan's survival as a pretty good canon example of the oft-mentioned energy absorption ability. It also explains why, for example, Qui-Gon Jinn seemed totally unfazed by his proximity to the white-hot melting door he was cutting through aboard the Trade Federation ship at the beginning of Phantom Menace.

LordShaithis wrote:

Darth Wong wrote:Remember that the installation actually required energy shielding.

Hell, if I recall correctly, didn't the installation itself begin to melt after the shields went down?

No, unshielded part of the installation only melted after splashes of molten lava landed on them.

Nevertheless, the fact that such huge quantities of lava are routinely thrown up so far into the air means that we are talking about a very hot, very dangerous lava flow, not one of those slow oozers.

The most violent physical event we ever saw a Jedi withstand is probably Anakin grabbing onto Zam Wessel's speeder over Coruscant. First he falls a distance which is easily enough to kill someone, then he slams onto a speeder and grabs onto it without injury even though it's hauling ass in a velocity 90 degrees to his own downward velocity. Not only would that kill a normal person, but it would probably leave him in pieces.

Darth Wong wrote:Nevertheless, the fact that such huge quantities of lava are routinely thrown up so far into the air means that we are talking about a very hot, very dangerous lava flow, not one of those slow oozers.

8000K according to complete locations. It says it moves the way it does despite the lower temp because the metals in the lava have much lower melting points.

Complete Locations also confirms that Obi-Wan and Anakin were using the Force to protect themselves from the lava (I read the book in NYC, I haven't seen it for sale here yet).

Elheru Aran wrote:5.) When running with Palpatine down the elevator shaft, and it tilts, Anakin is able to grab onto some loose wires, with Palpatine hanging on to his leg and Obi-wan on his back-- but a.) his artifical arm doesn't rip out of its socket, and b.) his arm doesn't even dislocate, which one should expect from any such similar feat.

In AOTC when Obi-wan falls over the platform he is instantly stopped by gripping Jango's tie-line, not once but twice. The first time his wrists were wrapped in it and any normal human would have ended up in three pieces, the second time was after falling a long distance where he could only use his grip strength on a thin wet line, meaning Jedi have an insane grip and 'hold-my-joints-together' ability (shown more extremely in the Zam Wesell speeder 'Hitchhiker from Hell' grab).

Cykeisme wrote:Were there not greater jumps seen in the Theed reactor battle? Darth Maul, Qui-Gon and Obi-Wann made some very impressive leaps from one catwalk to another.

One strange example that i remember had Obi-wan take a quick look at Maul and Qui-Gon duking it out above, over a hundred meters away, and he leaps and then lands fairly close to where they were (apparently effortlessly).

Eframepilot wrote:

Crossroads Inc. wrote:

LordShaithis wrote:Is there anyone here willing to argue with a straight face that a normal human could survive zooming right over that river of lava like Anakin and Obi-Wan did? Even if we assume the little hoverpads they were riding shielded them perfectly from below?

<smirks> Beat me too it, I don't care what Jedi powers you have "Lava Surfing" inches about molten rock was Boo-O-o-O-gus.

In KJA's Jedi Search, Luke actually walked on lava. With his feet.

KJA is not a good source of info as most peole here agree he is a terrible writer.

dragon wrote:

Eframepilot wrote:In KJA's Jedi Search, Luke actually walked on lava. With his feet.

KJA is not a good source of info as most peole here agree he is a terrible writer.

As an official novel it's still canon unless contradicted.

Srynerson wrote:

dragon wrote:

Eframepilot wrote:In KJA's Jedi Search, Luke actually walked on lava. With his feet.

KJA is not a good source of info as most peole here agree he is a terrible writer.

As an official novel it's still canon unless contradicted.

Hum I supposes it possible to use the force like a pair of snow shoes enlargeing the surface area so he doesn't sink into the lava. And then use the force to keep a thin pocket of space around his feet.

Elheru Aran wrote:Watching my disk earlier today I noticed a few things that, in my opinion, upped Jedi abilities considerably...

Notably:

1.) Anakin manages to leap at least one and a half times his own height as the elevator drops;

As previously noted, there were plenty of much more impressive leaps in The Phantom Menace, and even The Empire Strikes Back has Luke (a barely trained padawan) jumping at least that distance straight up in order to escape the carbon-freezing chamber.