Hoth vs. Geonosis

[Uraniun235]

The Hoth battle in ESB vs. the Geonosis battle in AOTC

Which do you think was a better battle? I personally think Hoth was more intense, and while some of the walker shots weren't too convincing, some of them were also damn good. Best of all, the camera shots are steady and let you focus on key aspects of the battle.

[Darth Garden Gnome]

Although I like the "big war" and flashy effects at Geonsis, the Hoth battle takes the cake.

It just sent chills down your spine when you heard the groudn rumble. You saw those odd shapes int he distance, and when the soldier took his binoculars to it, you were like "ohhhhh shit."

The action was more fast pace, because it wasn't focusing on hundreds of thousands of soldiers, but just a handful. The AT-AT seem sfar more menacing, especially when the Rebel speeders had to fly close to them, adn into the heart of enemy fire. Plus you got a view into the minds of the Imperial troops manning them, and they were as cold as steel, cold calculating, forevere in duty to there Emperor. Maybe getting to philisophical? Quite frankly,you just don't see that kind of intense combat in SW anymore.

[Vympel]

Hoth was better because it had an all round better atmosphere

1- The music was superior
2- The AT-ATs created a permeable sense of fear and urgency to the scene
3- You can't beat real soldiers
4- You got a real sense of slaughter and loss- re: when the begin retreat order is given

However, that is not to say Geonosis sucked in comparison. I liked Geonosis because George Lucas really went all out with things he's never done before- the camera work was more adventurous and less grounded, the effects were spectacular and there were just so many forces ... most impressive.

[Vympel]

Plus you got a view into the minds of the Imperial troops manning them, and they were as cold as steel, cold calculating, forevere in duty to there Emperor.

General Maximillian Veers. The quintessential Imperial officer. He just oozes professionalism.

[Darth Garden Gnome]

Just the way he says so casually "The shield will be down in moments. You may begin your landing Lord Vader." You know that he is a straight up 100% Imperial Officer. He doesn't question. He doesn't fail his superiors. He is one badass dude.

[Vympel]

I think it's something along the lines of

"Yes Lord Vader. I've reached the *something*. The shield will be down in moments. You may start your landing." *pulls down targeting periscope*

[Darth Garden Gnome]

Bah, close enough. You get the idea. The man is the kinda guy you woulddreadto play a chess game with. He could beat ya in three moves tops.

Did I mention I love General Veers?

[Vympel]

Best. Imperial. Accent. EVER.

[Darth Garden Gnome]

Definatley, it wasn't snotily British (Piett, no offense), and it wasn't offendingly English (nothing off the top of my head, Tagge maybe? They were are really bad. I hate the way they say M'Lord. I think a guy said something like that in TESB, and American dude, and it pisses me off everytime I hear him say that!). Just the slight hint of a British accent and it is soooo perfect. If only more Imperials modelled after this great man.

[Biddybot]

It has been literally years since I've seen the Hoth battle, yet I still have vivid memories of it seeming quite real...it worked as well as would any like segment in a good war movie, just with an SF setting. I remember a palpaple sense of dread and people suffering. At the time, I was even a little put off, thinking, "Geez, this is serious for Star Wars." If you want something that somewhat captures the essense and intensity of pure battle and is just a good piece of film-making, I'd say the Hoth version is your baby.

The Geonosis battle struck me as much less serious. It had a sort of space opera campiness about it that I found rather endearing. The machines, the use of clone and droid warriors, the aliens, even the Mars look of the setting, all put me in mind of old pulp stuff. I found it very hard to get worked up about anybody dying in this version, having taken my cue from the silly humour during the arena battle, and laughed at parts that were probably resulting in people getting scragged. Being a big lover of space opera and trashy B-movies, I found it very much to my taste and so personally prefer it over the Hoth battle. I don't think it's exactly a masterpiece of cinema, though.

[Darth Garden Gnome]

Hmmm fair enough Biddy, although you still like the Hoth battle for all the right reasons, thsu you will be spared.

While you're here *arms RPP-Rocket Propelled Poke* POKE!

[FaxModem1]

I like the Hoth battle, when I saw that as a kid, I thought, "Come on, Come on, evacuate already!", it feels real when you see it, the Geonosis one is pretty dazzling, but it doesn't feel right, seeing all the jedi die in the arena was quite a shock though.

But, what really woke me up from TPM, was Padme's ship blowing up at the beginning, that was like, this is serious, not a kid's movie.

[Knife]

The Battle of Hoth was a rear guard action. It was hopeless and futile and the rebels did it anyway because they had no choise. This creates drama and is amplified by the characters and effects and the music. The cuts between scences was superb and told the story in a logical way.

The Battle of Geonosis was a battle between droids and clones and the death of either is seen as no big deal. While the scenes of the battle are awesome in their detail and the shear size of the battle is an accomplishment, it lacks in the drama department. You don't think, "Oh my god, look at all those people being slaughtered." They are objects and are not morned the way the rebel troops were in the OT.

My pick is the Battle of Hoth, while the Battle of Geonosis is visualy spectacular and fun to watch, the story and emotion of the OT is better over all. GL needs to stop trying to top himself and center on the story.

[NecronLord]

Did I mention I love General Veers?

In what way?

Definatley, it wasn't snotily British (Piett, no offense), and it wasn't offendingly English (nothing off the top of my head, Tagge maybe? They were are really bad. I hate the way they say M'Lord. I think a guy said something like that in TESB, and American dude, and it pisses me off everytime I hear him say that!). Just the slight hint of a British accent and it is soooo perfect. If only more Imperials modelled after this great man.

No one in england says M'Lord. No-one.

[pellaeons_scion]

I liked the Battle of Hoth far more than the Geonosis battle. Sure, Geonosis introduced some good elements into SW battles (AA missile, A/T missiles, Gunships for fast deployment) but the entire Infantry tactic of "stride boldly forward and hope not to die was...well, kinda reminicent of WW1...ergo Stupid attrition based warfare...certainly not the way to use shock troops

Least Hoth had trenches, and the troops weren't blindly walking into Imperial fire. They countered with AT weapons, even if they weren't much good.

Granted on Geonosis they werent expecting an attack of that scale, but you would think for a planet whos main industry is weapons, would have had slightly more of an idea about planetary defence (Ion cannons, HTL emplacements, Shields, seeding the asteroid belt around it with mines etc)

Hoth had a sense of urgency, emotion and drew a stark contrast between the Empire and the Rebellion. I always get chills up my spine when the rebels postions are demolished by a seemingly unstoppable force.

And the most winning points for me: Snowtroopers, fast efficent, and well prepared (White armor actually being useful!) and Veers, a man whom every Imperial officer should aim to emulate: Cold, Hard, driven with a keen tactical mind.

[jaeger115]

Oh yeah, I agree. Let's start with the AT-TE and the AT-AT. When I first saw the AT-ATs in that battle, I went "Oh crap!" with that shiver running up and down my back like a musical chord...

But for the AT-TE, I saw it as a gaiting, six-legged beetle with a monstrous dick on top . It doesn't have that aura of raw power that an AT-AT has.

Also, the Hoth battle has unforgettable reverberations for me. Oh hell, just compare a struggle between an oppressive empire and the heroic Rebel Alliance and one between droids and clones and you can tell which is more convincing.

[God Emperor]

Yes Hoth is better. Simply because AT-AT kick ass and scare the shit out of people.

[Oberleutnant]

Geonosis battle had no soul.

[Sea Skimmer]

Hoth was better. Geonosis had more action and looked cool but was pretty stupid overall. It was also a forgone conclusion with no real excitement like how many walkers the Rebels would get.

[Vympel]

Hoth was better. Geonosis had more action and looked cool but was pretty stupid overall. It was also a forgone conclusion with no real excitement like how many walkers the Rebels would get.

Hey I was happy to see a total and utter rout in SW for once. Not every battle should be a close-run thing

[Darth Garden Gnome]

But its the close run thing that keeps us on the edge of our seats! It keeps us guessing! ITS INTENSE! Will Luke get it into that exhaust port? Will the Rebels be able to evacuate in time, before the walkers are on them? Will the teddy bears pound the stormies? And can Han open the generators blast doors? Those are the kinds of questions that keep us guessing!

Geonosis had a decided outcome, its like pitting Pee-Wee Herman in a fight against Lenix Luis (okay, so that would be humorous, but you get my point). It just doesn't have the suspense. And if you'd like to see a what was obvious victory in SW, look no further than the pitiful Gungan fleet getting stomped by the battle droids in TPM. Even before then in ANH the stormies completely crushed the Rebel resistance in the Tantice IV, although I guess that really wasn't a major engagment.

[Sea Skimmer]

Hoth was better. Geonosis had more action and looked cool but was pretty stupid overall. It was also a forgone conclusion with no real excitement like how many walkers the Rebels would get.

Hey I was happy to see a total and utter rout in SW for once. Not every battle should be a close-run thing

So was I. My post is poorly worded. Both where predictable routes, but Hoth was a better one because of the interesting anti walker tactics. Geonosis was just large bunches of explosions. Entertaining but not much of a battle. The everyone run towards each other aspect was also quite annoying.

[Lord Pounder]

Geonosis was more of a 17/18th centrary style battle. The Clones should really have been wearing Red Coats.

Hoth was more realistic in as far as they used trenches, artillery and Air Support etc. Plus Hoth had more atmosphere.

[Isolder74]

For my thoughts on the Battle Of Hoth Look here
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=1586

[Raptor 597]

General Veers all profession the best general in Imperial History. He doessn't fuck with you he just kills you. Hoth actually had tactics. Geonosis would of been better if they encircled the Droid army by splitting up the Army or blowing them up from the high ground.