THE OotS Thread, Part IV.

[Simon_Jester]

I wonder what the procedure is in the event of a tie?

[Bedlam]

I wonder what the procedure is in the event of a tie?

Fight to the death?
Recount?
Mortals get a say?

[Crazedwraith]

Well this points in favour of Hel wanting the world destroyed. Or a massive fight between gods.

[Raesene]

1000 is up

[Bedlam]

Plenty sneaky on Hel's part there, I'd guess that Durkon's little killing spree also killed off the priests of any demi-gods likely to vote no as well.

Is there actually anything in real life mythology about Loki tricking Hel into staying out of the affairs of other gods or is that purely a Oots thing? As far as I recall he was generally friendly with his little girl, he uses he ship to sail out into the apocalypse after all.

[Simon_Jester]

...It would appear that in various senses, all three of Bedlam's answers to my question are correct.

Also, it arguably pays to think about the traditional role of Loki in Norse mythology before his imprisonment and Ragnarok. This is clearly a Loki who hasn't been bound in a cave with horrible poison dripping onto his face, after all.

And up until the killing of Balder (who isn't dead here), Loki was a trickster and a prankster, yes... but he repeatedly saved Asgard or secured important benefits for the Aesir with pranks and tricks played on the giants and other hostile figures. He might cause annoyance and trouble, but when the chips were down he'd side with the continued existence of the world.

The myth eventually has him starting to create more and more destructive pranks, culminating in his tricking blind Hodr into killing Balder with a dart of mistletoe. Which is what causes the Norse gods to imprison him, and in turn embitters him into becoming a central figure in Ragnarok.

[Ahriman238]

Welp. Durkon made it home, posthumously, and brought great calamity with him. I think that satisfies both prophecies about him, and it's anyone's game now.

I am concerned that another cleric of bodyguard might interfere in this. And perhaps a little surprised (though I know the PCs need their agency and to effect the outcome of world shaking events) that no God on the "destroy" side changed their vote after Hel started gloating.

[Crazedwraith]

Welp. Durkon made it home, posthumously, and brought great calamity with him. I think that satisfies both prophecies about him, and it's anyone's game now.

I am concerned that another cleric of bodyguard might interfere in this. And perhaps a little surprised (though I know the PCs need their agency and to effect the outcome of world shaking events) that no God on the "destroy" side changed their vote after Hel started gloating.

My thought is Wrecan might jump and tip the balance in Roy's favour before submitting to the 'put to death' clause.

[Solauren]

All I can say is: GO ROY!

[Bedlam]

Welp. Durkon made it home, posthumously, and brought great calamity with him. I think that satisfies both prophecies about him, and it's anyone's game now.

I am concerned that another cleric of bodyguard might interfere in this. And perhaps a little surprised (though I know the PCs need their agency and to effect the outcome of world shaking events) that no God on the "destroy" side changed their vote after Hel started gloating.

It's not clear if the gods can actually change their vote, I could see there being rules to say they can't to prevent some of the more extreme Chaotic Neutral or true neutral types just constantly shifting their vote.

[Solauren]

Would the most extreme types even show up to vote?

[Bedlam]

Would the most extreme types even show up to vote?

Maybe not chaos elemental types but True neutral god of the balance types maybe, they'd presumably always vote for the loosing side to maintain equilibrium.

[Highlord Laan]

I hope this works. The comic could use a bit of classic Fighter Diplomacy every now and again.

[Rogue 9]

If Durkula has prepared properly, though, it isn't going to. Hell, at the end of the day Roy's Will save can't be more than two or three points higher than Belkar's, less if Belkar rages.

[Ahriman238]

Welp. Durkon made it home, posthumously, and brought great calamity with him. I think that satisfies both prophecies about him, and it's anyone's game now.

I am concerned that another cleric of bodyguard might interfere in this. And perhaps a little surprised (though I know the PCs need their agency and to effect the outcome of world shaking events) that no God on the "destroy" side changed their vote after Hel started gloating.

It's not clear if the gods can actually change their vote, I could see there being rules to say they can't to prevent some of the more extreme Chaotic Neutral or true neutral types just constantly shifting their vote.

I don't think there are any Gods like that in the Norse Pantheon, though it could be the rules were laid down by all the Gods for everyone.


Can Durkula cast or use hypnotism while the Divine Proxy is going? Is it a spell that needs maintaining? I see a few ways this goes down. 1.) the answer is no, taking or dodging the first attack dismisses the spell and the vote is settled, leaving Roy to battle Durkula and get out his feeling of betrayal. 2.) Durkon can fight while maintaining the proxy, but can't cast. The fight is relatively even. 3.) Durkon can move and cast freely, which should be a curb-stomp but Roy has the narrative on his side and pulls off a miraculous underdog win, proving straight fighters don't suck by beating a vampiric CoDzilla solo, but loses his friend. 4.) Durkula stomps Roy for a bit then one of the other clerics casts raise dead, hey it can only help the other representative to be alive, no?

Or 5.) Wrecan takes a big hint and stacks the deck of incoming priests of the minor gods, and the vote turns out to be No by the skin of their teeth and a legal technicality.

[Bedlam]

Welp. Durkon made it home, posthumously, and brought great calamity with him. I think that satisfies both prophecies about him, and it's anyone's game now.

I am concerned that another cleric of bodyguard might interfere in this. And perhaps a little surprised (though I know the PCs need their agency and to effect the outcome of world shaking events) that no God on the "destroy" side changed their vote after Hel started gloating.

It's not clear if the gods can actually change their vote, I could see there being rules to say they can't to prevent some of the more extreme Chaotic Neutral or true neutral types just constantly shifting their vote.

I don't think there are any Gods like that in the Norse Pantheon, though it could be the rules were laid down by all the Gods for everyone.


Can Durkula cast or use hypnotism while the Divine Proxy is going? Is it a spell that needs maintaining? I see a few ways this goes down. 1.) the answer is no, taking or dodging the first attack dismisses the spell and the vote is settled, leaving Roy to battle Durkula and get out his feeling of betrayal. 2.) Durkon can fight while maintaining the proxy, but can't cast. The fight is relatively even. 3.) Durkon can move and cast freely, which should be a curb-stomp but Roy has the narrative on his side and pulls off a miraculous underdog win, proving straight fighters don't suck by beating a vampiric CoDzilla solo, but loses his friend. 4.) Durkula stomps Roy for a bit then one of the other clerics casts raise dead, hey it can only help the other representative to be alive, no?

Or 5.) Wrecan takes a big hint and stacks the deck of incoming priests of the minor gods, and the vote turns out to be No by the skin of their teeth and a legal technicality.

I wonder if the other priests can help Roy without breaking the truce? Casting protection from evil on him is not attacking Durkon after all.

[Highlord Laan]

If Durkula has prepared properly, though, it isn't going to. Hell, at the end of the day Roy's Will save can't be more than two or three points higher than Belkar's, less if Belkar rages.

Dunno. When Roy was spending time in Celestia after his death, one of the angels did mention that his wisdom and charisma were both high enough for him to be a great cleric or paladin.

[Rogue 9]

If Durkula has prepared properly, though, it isn't going to. Hell, at the end of the day Roy's Will save can't be more than two or three points higher than Belkar's, less if Belkar rages.

Dunno. When Roy was spending time in Celestia after his death, one of the angels did mention that his wisdom and charisma were both high enough for him to be a great cleric or paladin.

Yes, but that doesn't translate into being as high as Durkon's, and he has a low base save. The story might not go that way because it would be anticlimactic, but by the D&D rules the setting operates under he only has a very slim chance of overcoming Durkula's domination ability, to say nothing of any spells he may or may not have prepared.

His greatsword, on the other hand, can probably do a number on the vampire if he can retain his will long enough to use it.

[Raesene]

The trapped real Durkon might choose this moment to free himself , providing a distraction to Durkula.

Forcing the vampire to fight an enemy within and one outside would improve Roy's chances.

[Raesene]

1001 is up

[Crazedwraith]

There's a 'no backsies' rule and Durkon directly referenced the First Prequel book there.

This is shaping up to be pretty good, Durkula's really pushing Roy's buttons, I'm just sad the rest of the Order aren't there. So often the plot breaks them down into little subsets rather than treating them as a whole.

[Napoleon the Clown]

Durkula does have a minor restriction on what he can do to retaliate. He can't realistically use AoE spells. Also, Roy picked up that feat a while ago that allows him to fizzle an enemy caster' spell when he lands an AoO. Add in the bonus his sword has against undead...


Durkula may be a vampire Cleric with roughly the same number of levels as Roy has in Fighter, but Roy's got a feat that basically negates Durkula's casting. Rebuke Undead is obviously useless against Roy, as he's living. All Durkula has are his vampire powers, and as we just witnessed Roy's will save looks to be high enough that Durkula can't just dominate him into submission. Which actually doesn't surprise me all that much, seeing as Durkon's charisma was awful, which indicates to me that Durkula's charisma is, at best, 12. So assuming he's level 15 the save DC is maybe 18. Given commentary on Roy's wisdom score many strips back, I'd estimate his will save could easily be around 8. Meaning, 50% chance to save even if he doesn't happen to have magic items that boost it. And considering he's planning on going up against a lich later, he'd be a fool to not have some sort of protection. His only other option that could be useful is his energy drain. If he can consistently hit Roy, viable option. If not... All he can do is escape. Which would mean he has to leave and his vote stops counting, I imagine. So who can kill who might just come down to stats and the will of the dice. With multiple attacks per round, an obviously high attack bonus, and power attack Roy might have enough sheer martial oomph to take on Durkula.

Actually, mentioning magic items to boost his save(s), Roy may have also picked up protection against energy drain. Again, he's going to be fighting a lich. In which case Durkula has little chance of winning a fight. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

[Mr Bean]

I like Napoleon the Clown theory, especially if it's made that way. Roy has been planning to fight a lich for years now , so being kitted out in anti-undead gear makes perfect sense. If 1002 is a series of X does not work because I knew I was going to fight a Lich. Y also does not work because hey Lich's can do that to. You may be just as strong as I am Durkula but I have a counter for every one of your tricks which means at the end of the day it's your combat ability vs my ability to hit you in the face with my sword made specifically for killing undead.

[Simon_Jester]

Actually, mentioning magic items to boost his save(s), Roy may have also picked up protection against energy drain. Again, he's going to be fighting a lich. In which case Durkula has little chance of winning a fight. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

A lich who can cast Maximized Energy Drain, no less.

[I would assume that V, being very intelligent and wanting the plan to succeed, has shared the tactical intelligence gained from V's... premature... magical duel with Xykon. V may not have revealed how V came by such immense magical power, I don't know, but it beggars the imagination that V wouldn't have shared the information gained about Xykon's spell list.]

[Crazedwraith]

Actually, mentioning magic items to boost his save(s), Roy may have also picked up protection against energy drain. Again, he's going to be fighting a lich. In which case Durkula has little chance of winning a fight. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

A lich who can cast Maximized Energy Drain, no less.

[I would assume that V, being very intelligent and wanting the plan to succeed, has shared the tactical intelligence gained from V's... premature... magical duel with Xykon. V may not have revealed how V came by such immense magical power, I don't know, but it beggars the imagination that V wouldn't have shared the information gained about Xykon's spell list.]

O-Chuul handed over an estimation of Xykon's entire spell list to Roy when Roy came back to live.