Here's a goofy one for ya.

[Genfreak]

You have no proof that their carteroid arteries are any stronger than a normal persons.

What in the name of BS are you talking about?

No proof? The people can take planet destroying energy blasts to their face! If their arteries were no stronger than anyone else's, then they would explode inside their bodies and cuase them to bleed to death internally.

Are you going to even try and claim that only their ear drums, mucas membranes, skin, bones, teeths, hair, eyes, lungs, internal organs, and other parts of their bodies are, whle their artieres are normal?

Do you even know what grasping at straws is?

Also, Toriyama calls his world Earth, and therefore what he does not shows us to be changed must therefore be assumed to be the same lest we take on the authority of the author himself and try to rewrite his world based on our own opinions. It is the very nature of suspension of disbelief that dictates that until some evidence is given or implied that something is different, it is no different.

I also see the explosion example, as well as King Kai's words are being ignored. Typical considering they prove the point.

Also, Mr. Popo himself said that Goku, as a child was faster than lightining. As a child, with a power level of well under 1,000.

Your completely ignoring the points that prove you wrong and repeatedly claiming the same thing over and over as if it is somehow true because of it. That is pathetic.

[DPDarkPrimus]

Communicating with a person telepathically and crushing someone's internal organs with a thought are quite different things.

Yes, being that one is telepathy and one is telekenesis. Check the dictionary before posting next time, pup.

Why don't you get a brain? That was exactly the point I was making.

[Drach]

Proof of strength on internal organs: Buu punches Vegeta so hard you can see the punch bulge out his back, yet Vegeta lives

[KK]

Notes:

1. Chaotzu, also known as the utterly worthless Z-Senshi who hasn't be useful since before the Saiya-jin saga, used telekenesis as his main technique. He froze people in place and squeezed them telekenetically. Like I said, he started out a big deal but grew useless, since that technique wasn't effective once they got to a certain level of power.

2. Goku has had a villain who tried to make his heart explode before. Didn't work.

[Genfreak]

Proof of strength on internal organs: Buu punches Vegeta so hard you can see the punch bulge out his back, yet Vegeta lives

Oozaru Vegeta, who could shatter mountain rangers with his punches sqeezes a powerless and defeated Goku as hard as he can. It only breaks his legs.

[KK]

Communicating with a person telepathically and crushing someone's internal organs with a thought are quite different things.

Yes, being that one is telepathy and one is telekenesis. Check the dictionary before posting next time, pup.

Why don't you get a brain? That was exactly the point I was making.

I split telekenesis and telepathy into two seperate categories.

You tried to debunk my point on telepathy with a point on telekenesis.

If the point you were trying to make is that you don't know what you're talking about, then you did a good job.

[KK]

I need my memory refressed on this, but didn't Tao Pie Pie try his nerve strikes on Goku? I know he was so good at nerve strikes that he could kill a man with one touch of his tongue. But didn't Goku survive one of those attacks?

Meaning the internal organs Tao Pie Pie attacked were very tough?

[T-1000]

Indeed it is. Vader and Palpatine sever Goku and Gohan's carteroid arteries with but a though.

Oh sure. And how do they do that when they are vaporized?

[Strider119]

Still not faster than the speed of light.

*sigh* sure it isnt. What about when goku is shown as being in 2 places at once. He is moving faster than light can bounce off of him and he is virtually in 2 places at once. Or when he is standing still and it appears as if things are going through him? He moves so fast that he can move out of his stance to dodge a blast and then move back into his exact stance before light bounces off of him

More nonsensical replys? *sigh*

what is nonsensical about saying "good for them"? I know they are skilled in the ways of the force. I am congradualting them on being lucky enough to have a high metachlorean count. WAY TO GO!! get them 'chloreans!

I could argue the same, since you seem to exhibit the same amount of knowledge (rather, lack thereof) about SW facts. I know a fair amount about DBZ, and one thing I can recall clearly is that any sort of powerful attack takes and obscene amount of time to charge up.

In the buu saga Goku turns SSJ3 in the blink of an eye and immediately lets loose attacks on Buu that crumbles mountian ranges. He powered up and attacked in roughly 3 seconds and there are a billion other examples of them powering up and running in to fight in no time at all.

And I am as well versed in SW as I need to be. I've seen all the movies and read a few of the novels (admittedly not to many) but I know what has happenened in most of the novels through second hand knowledge. what leads you to believe that I am uninformed in SW universe? I havent said anything that is directly contradictory of SW continuity have I? I know you have proven yourself ignorant about DBZ with the comment that they always take long periods of time to power up and attack

Surely you mean "deluded", as I am not a solute. And if that is the case: Hello pot, meet kettle!

Ahhhh, fixing someones grammatical mistakes. the last defense for a desperate little boy. Keep your head in the debate little man and leave the proof reading at the door. I openly acknowledge that my spelling is lackluster. I type a tad too fast and I don't check it. If I had known that this was a spelling bee and not a SW message board I would have checked my stuff a little closer


Man of the hour:
Strider119

[DPDarkPrimus]

Still not faster than the speed of light.

*sigh* sure it isnt. What about when goku is shown as being in 2 places at once. He is moving faster than light can bounce off of him and he is virtually in 2 places at once. Or when he is standing still and it appears as if things are going through him? He moves so fast that he can move out of his stance to dodge a blast and then move back into his exact stance before light bounces off of him

Wrong. The image of him standing where he was before is called an 'after-image'. Wave your hand in front of the computer monitor quickly. Notice how you see more than five fingers? That's an after-image. One does not need to travel the speed of light to create such after images.

I will concede that Vader and Palpatine would be killed from blows dealt to them by Goku and Gohan. I still hold that they could be killed by Force crushing/choking, etc if they were not fighting back. This debate has become about the abilites of Goku now. I'm more than willing to continue debating that.

[Jove]

Proof of Faster Than Light speed by Goku

One Pattern technique.

[KK]

Wrong. The image of him standing where he was before is called an 'after-image'. Wave your hand in front of the computer monitor quickly. Notice how you see more than five fingers? That's an after-image. One does not need to travel the speed of light to create such after images.

Wrong. It's called Zanzoken. He isn't just vibrating back and forth like your hand. He is actually in several places at once, so that his after-images stay there for several seconds, long enough to catch the attention of his opponent while he is coming up behind them.

[Jove]

Wrong. The image of him standing where he was before is called an 'after-image'. Wave your hand in front of the computer monitor quickly. Notice how you see more than five fingers? That's an after-image. One does not need to travel the speed of light to create such after images.

> Umm. Right. Because when you leave a completely substantial image (not blurred, completely and utterly visible, indistinguishable from your actual person) you're not traveling faster than light.

Newsflash. If your complete image is left behing, standing in mid-air for a significant period of time (a manner of seconds, here), and you're in completely different location, then you've moved faster than light could move with you. You've moved so fast that light itself has stood still.

I will concede that Vader and Palpatine would be killed from blows dealt to them by Goku and Gohan. I still hold that they could be killed by Force crushing/choking, etc if they were not fighting back. This debate has become about the abilites of Goku now. I'm more than willing to continue debating that.

Did you see the numerous points made on the Z-fighters durability? Y'know, the ones that take planet-destroying blasts? Hint: Your entire body has to be that durable, not just your outer portion. If it's not, you'd suffer massive internal hemmoraging.

[ShinjiGohan]

This is pathetic.

This board claims that I can mock stupid people, well let the mocking begin.


How the hell do Vader and Palpatine stand a chance at winning?

Precognition maybe? Actually that doesn't work either. Know why? Goku has that too. Check up on the DB manga. Here I'll even give you the page number. Vol 15, chapter 11, page 8.

Ok what else?... Oh the choke... too bad that still allows for projectiles to be used. Oh, not to mention teleportation. Or power up (a weak nappa when powering up shook the planet that they were on, you know, like a planet wide earth quake. Buu Saga, Goku and Gohan are so much beyond that. They'll be shredded to pieces just if one of them powers up to even 1% of their full power (of the wind force from it doesn't do it, then the millions of rocks flying at them will). Not to mention a ki blast from their hand which would vaporize Vador or Palpatine, or the ground beneath them.

So umm, what else can they do? Oh they can wave their lightsabers around, at speeds that Goku and Gohan were able to dodge since they were literally 5 years old. And funny thing about that saber, it can only cover one spot on the body at one time. So a little multi form so there's 4 Goku and/or Gohan around, and it becomes impossible for them to block every attack, and hence they die.

Oh. not to mention that the wind from their attack would KO if not flat out kill Vader and Palpatine.

What else? Oh the Jedi Mind tricks.... oh wait that only works against weak minded people with no will power. And will power is something Goku has in abundence. And Gohan is unlikely to fall before it. But he has a very small possibility of it work.

So umm what next? Oh, are they going to use the force to jump high? Too bad, Goku at 7 years old could do that.

Oh how about using the force to move really fast.... too bad Goku was faster in the first Budokai that he went to.

Oh, maybe they'll immoblize them... too bad they could fire blasts from their mouths, feet, eyes, whatever the heck they want. So making them immoble doesn't work.

Stopping the heart? Been there and done that, no longer effective.

While how about Goku? TK to rip off Vaders head. Speed blitz at speeds that Vader and Palpatine can't even see (speeds that they got to in earily DB, and they got nearly infinitely faster ever since.) Power up will KO them, if not kill them. Blast them, a quick flick of their wrist and Vader and Palpatine die.

They literally are that weak.

[Zod]

Let me repeat: Telekinesis fails if the target's power level is too high. Chaozu already tried to kill Nappa by using his TK attack, which stops the target's heart, and it utterly failed because his power level was so much larger. Now, keep in mind that Chaozu at this point was nine or ten times the power level of Muten Roshi when he blew up the moon with his strongest attack, and two or three times stronger than Piccolo Daimaou when he casually blew up continents. Unless you seriously think that an adult SSj2 Gohan, who is literally millions of times the power level of Nappa, is somehow lower than a being whose Force powers cannot instantly kill one non-superdurable human, then you're on drugs.

Telekinetics are totally worthless, and that's the only true offensive attack they could muster.

[fgalkin]

Telekinetics are totally worthless, and that's the only true offensive attack they could muster.

In the DBZ wankverse, maybe, but not anywhere else. Although they might be immunde from DBZ-verse telekinesis, they are not immune from the Force tk.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[AdmiralKanos]

Wow. There are actually people out there who enjoy Dragonball Z and know the characters' names? That's amazing.

[Jove]

Telekinetics are totally worthless, and that's the only true offensive attack they could muster.

In the DBZ wankverse, maybe, but not anywhere else. Although they might be immunde from DBZ-verse telekinesis, they are not immune from the Force tk.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

Prove that Force TK usable by Palpy or Vader can equal exceed the damage that Goku and Gohan suffer on a regular basis.

Otherwise, shut the fuck up, you insufferable, blind, and deluded fanboy.

[Keevan_Colton]

Lets see...where to start....

DBZ meet BDZ. Much better really.

Just because they are immune to powers of people who use similar shit doesnt make them blanket immune to the Force....how's about a nice darkside fueled force storm for ruining your little wanking day?

[Jove]

*equal or exceed

[Frank Hipper]

Wow. There are actually people out there who enjoy Dragonball Z and know the characters' names? That's amazing.

And are old enough to use the internet, I might add.

[Jove]

Lets see...where to start....

DBZ meet BDZ. Much better really.

Just because they are immune to powers of people who use similar shit doesnt make them blanket immune to the Force....how's about a nice darkside fueled force storm for ruining your little wanking day?

Irony thy name is Warsie.

Prove that a force storm is:

A: More powerful than attacks that Goku and Gohan suffer on a regular basis.

and

B. Is significantly unique from any attacks that they have received to render Goku and Gohan's durability nil.

You also have to prove that Vader and Palpy can actually attack G and G before they're blown to pieces, keeping in mind that the latter two move faster than light, and that Force precog is useless because the former two can't move fast enough to escape the Saiya-jin's attacks.

[Keevan_Colton]

And are old enough to use the internet, I might add.

Ever wonder what happens if you chain under developed primates to a TV showing bad animation and then let a horde of them loose on a computer.....the above people are a horrifying example....

[T-1000]

Wrong. The image of him standing where he was before is called an 'after-image'. Wave your hand in front of the computer monitor quickly. Notice how you see more than five fingers? That's an after-image. One does not need to travel the speed of light to create such after images.

I will concede that Vader and Palpatine would be killed from blows dealt to them by Goku and Gohan. I still hold that they could be killed by Force crushing/choking, etc if they were not fighting back. This debate has become about the abilites of Goku now. I'm more than willing to continue debating that.

It's called instant transmission. It lets him travel at the speed of light. I'm not kidding and I'm also not going to repeat myself. It's been stated, it's a matter of fact. Deal with it.

[Genfreak]

So somehow the kinetic energy created by the Force is now different than nomral kinetic energy? WTF?

Man, it is too bad you guys cannot bag this stuff, you would make a killing in the fertilizer business because that has to be the biggest heap of BS I have seen in today.

There is no reason to think Force TK, DBZ TK, or even marvel Universe TK is any different. It comes from a different source, but its effects are the same. All of them try to move things without touching them.

If Vader and the Emp cannot crush a planet with their TK, they are not going to crush Goku with it either, since Goku is far more durable than a planet. It does not matter the source, the desired effect and the means is the same, and they are not powerful enough.

Why do you keep skirting the many point about their durability? Do you simply enjoy promenading how incompetent you are in front of others?