Setzer watches Code Ge-Oss

[Setzer]

After seeing about 13 episodes, I can safely say this anime really annoys me. First off, the title. Like I keep telling people, I don't care if they pronounce it Ge-Oss, it should be Code "geese". Geas is an Irish term for a magical command that cannot be disobeyed. It fits in perfectly with the protagonist's power. Why then, should I call it by the mangled mispronunciation the writers use?

Now, the characters.

Lelouch is supposed to be some sort of grand strategist, but he seems to be ignorant of some basic tenets of guerrilla warfare. For starters, if your method of fighting depends on hit and fade attacks, don't give your soldiers uniforms and custom colors for their mechs. It seems that in addition to completely mangling history, the writers didn't bother to do even the most basic research on guerilla warfare. Why is he trying to wage a conventional war with guerilla tactics? The whole thing stinks of writer's fiat.

Also, he seems to be benefiting from the Dumb Watson trope. When you want to establish someone as smart, it helps to give them a partner that they're intellectually superior to. It lets the protagonist show off their genius. The classic trope is the portrayal of Holmes and Watson. However, when the "Watson" is clearly an idiot, the "Holmes" doesn't look all that impressive. The whole Black Knights team seem to be a collection of overgrown children. Do they even wipe their asses without a plan from Zero telling them how? Looking at their operation, it seems the whole thing would fall apart if Zero weren't there.

Suzaku seems to be a man of unparalleled stupidity. In a nation obsessed with bloodline and race, he seems to think the non-Britannian son of the former Japanese prime minister will be given a fair trial. Moron.

Euphemia? How does someone grow up to be all sweet and nicey nice in an empire where backstabbing and social Darwinism are the norm? I think some have accused her of being a clone of Lacus Clyne from Gundam Seed. If I'd seen the series, I'd comment on that.

CC? She seems to be a McGuffin that they don't know how to write out of the show once its purpose has been served. She gives Lelouch his Geas powers in the first episode and then spends the rest of the series running up pizza bills.

The Student council characcters? Why are they even in this show? I can't remember anything they actually did that affected the plot in any way. So in addition to research, the writers can't even be bothered to use their own characters for filler episodes.

All in all, I think this series tries to do too much. It could have worked as a Death Note-esque intrigue where the main character uses his supernatural powers to accomplish some nearly impossible goal. It could have worked as a Gundam style tale of warfare and politics. It even could have worked as a silly stupid high school romance story. But cram all three together and the result is just a jumbled mess.

[Duckie]

I've never seen Code Geas, but I got one sentence into your thread and would like to tell you to stop correcting people. I'll admit I'm no gaelic expert, but I'd like to note that "Geese" is massively incorrect, perhaps moreso than Gee-ass, unless one is using a hitherto unknown dialect of Irish as spoken by D&D Players hearing second-hand anglicisations. Geas is, as far as I know, an archaic spelling of Geis, the proper Irish term, which is pronounced Gesh or Jesh depending upon dialect. The plural is, incidentally, Geasa, which based off my knowledge of gaelic orthography is probably "G/Jesa".

Regardless, in no way is it gi:s, that'd be spelled gios or gaos or whatnot. It's gεʃ or ɟɛʃ (I'd hazard a guess the g- ones are the more northerly, scots-influenced ones, but I'm out of my depth to really authoritatively speak on gaelic dialectology).

Unless it's scots gaelic, where I believe geas is the standard, but it's still pronounced 'gesh' I believe.

[Setzer]

I took it from Terry Pratchett's pronounciation. He did a lot of Geas/Geese jokes, so I assumed that was how it was spelled.

[Duckie]

Yeah, it's a common enough mispronunciation due to its prevalence in old fantasy literature that many dictionaries are giving up and putting it as an alternate version of the way to pronounce it, which makes me sad. It's one of the mispronunciations that push my buttons, as much as people saying "Hyoogoh Shavez" for Hugo Chavez.

[Vendetta]

If you think season 1 of Geass is disjointed nonsense, R2 will blow your mind with rage.

There's a reason it got nicknamed Code Trainwreck, because it was horribly mangled but somehow you couldn't turn your eyes away. The best bits of the series were Jun Fukuyama and Norio Wakamoto trying to out-ham each other.

[Xon]

Season 2 had major production issues, they where literially only had the storyboarding done a few episodes ahead as each episode was released. Throw in some changing timeslots, some execuative meddling, and there is almost nothing in common between season 1 and season 2 beyond the initial setting and some character names.

[Setzer]

My main complaint is that so many of the characters seem to be there for no reason. So many of them don't really do anything. I mean, Nina humps a table, but that's about it.

[Vendetta]

Ironically, Nina is the one member of the silly school cast that actually does become plot relevant.

Shirley tries, repeatedly, and should really have been written out after the events of Ep. 17 of the first season, Rivalz does nothing except lust after the tits, and the tits just take up screen acreage for fanservice value.

[scythewielder]

I suppose it's worth typing up my two cents here.

Leaving aside that it's pretty much impossible to enjoy most modern anime -Code Geass included- without a high suspension of disbelief for stupid things that would never work in reality or let alone follow the laws of history, warfare and physics as we know them...this is certainly the kind of show that tries to do many different things at once and, in the end, only manages to succeed at a couple of them at most.

Some would say none, but that's not my position. When you take all the filler out -including any other aspects that had the potential to be something more- Code Geass is just a melodramatic morality tale about a Byronic hero named Lelouch. I would argue that central focus does remain consistent across both seasons, regardless of its very messy production, technical flaws and whatever else one might bring up. The show isn't about the high school harem antics, the worldwide war or even about Geass per se. It's simply about Lelouch.

To that end, most of the rest of the cast has a very limited use. For example, the entire Ashford Academy crew just exists for the sake of illustrating Lelouch's dual-sided nature. He essentially wants to be Light Yagami, but deep down he is still a high school student who would probably prefer to waste time with all those goofy antics (and his crippled sister) if there wasn't a personal vendetta in the way.

Suzaku seems incredibly stupid, yes, but he's meant to be like some recent Gundam protagonists who aren't especially bright and remain stubborn about justice or doing things the right way. He'd be right at home in a less morally ambiguous series where the heroic mecha pilot just fights Space Nazis. Still, in spite of all the problems with Code Geass I believe he still works decently as an antagonist and Lelouch's foil.

Just as well, I would say Euphemia was intentionally meant to be a Lacus clone, but I would say she's less of a Mary Sue and ends up having a very different kind of influence. Whether you think that's good or bad is another story, though I personally found her to be a lot less annoying.

If you find any of that interesting or at least superficially entertaining, maybe you'll manage to finish the whole thing and find some way to appreciate it. If not, then it's probably for the best to stop watching lest you rage too much (or rage at some of those raging, as the case might be, since this series easily polarizes people).

[Dragon Angel]

I imagine that the high school cast were written in to show Lelouch's "first life", in contrast with his other life as Zero the revolutionary. Kind of like a superhero and their alternate identity...except it was mostly executed rather strangely. Euphie, also, was that sweet because her older sister Cornelia pretty much sheltered her throughout her entire life - notice how she is just plain naive about a lot of things in the world.

Though, I definitely agree with you on Suzaku; he annoyed me very much with that endless absolute idealism he just loved to preach on about (you think it is bad now? ohh, just WAIT until you see R2...along with complete hypocrisy to finish it all off).

And I think R2 had its own kind of a, uhh, "weird" charm... One of my friends said it best: "Look, everyone! All of the episodes end with a plot twist!"

[scythewielder]

Though, I definitely agree with you on Suzaku; he annoyed me very much with that endless absolute idealism he just loved to preach on about (you think it is bad now? ohh, just WAIT until you see R2...along with complete hypocrisy to finish it all off).

...when you think about it, this show is chock full of hypocrites and liars.

Suzaku lies to himself but Lelouch lies to just about everyone else. Not a bad theme, in and of itself, but like many other things it would have benefited from a less annoying execution.

And I think R2 had its own kind of a, uhh, "weird" charm... One of my friends said it best: "Look, everyone! All of the episodes end with a plot twist!"

True enough. You can just go along for the ride and have fun with all the twists. That's also an option (though I don't think that's all you can do, it sure is tempting).

[speaker-to-trolls]

As stated, you have to have a high tolerance for nonsense to enjoy this series, I mean ten minutes into the first episode you have an auxiliary grunt piloting a super-special-awesome brand new prototype mech. This in an Empire that considers each individual auxiliary slightly less valuable than each individual bullet used by its native soldiers.

I agree that a lot of characters have loose ends, and this probably could have been handled with a tighter focus on Lulu and his endeavours. As a side note, despite the fact that Suzaku is very stupid, I liked him as a contrast to Lelouche. On the one hand a man who lies to everyone and has no qualms about killing lots of people to achieve his goals, and who fights against tyranny for the wrong reasons (self interest and vengeance) and on the other a man who wants to do the right thing and always tries to adhere to a code of good conduct, and because of that ends up fighting on the side of tyranny.

C.C is more than just a McGuffin, she could probably have been handled better but in later episodes she does become more important.

[Archaic`]

As stated, you have to have a high tolerance for nonsense to enjoy this series, I mean ten minutes into the first episode you have an auxiliary grunt piloting a super-special-awesome brand new prototype mech. This in an Empire that considers each individual auxiliary slightly less valuable than each individual bullet used by its native soldiers.

I thought that was actually perfectly reasonable, to be honest. Highly dangerous prototype mech that's killed or seriously injured every test pilot that's tried it; and a soldier who's scored at the top of all his aptitude tests for the Knightmares and as a non-Britannian is completely expendable.

[speaker-to-trolls]

^Yes, but it's presumably an incredibly expensive prototype mech which they are then throwing out into the fray with someone who's never actually piloted one before, that seems a little risky to me. Suzaku's expendable, yes, but considering what it can do when handled properly and how much it must have cost them, the machine presumably isn't.

Plus the thing about him being aptitude tested for Knightmares doesn't make sense to me, I was under the impression Honorary Britannians weren't allowed to be pilots under normal circumstances.

[Gil Hamilton]

Code Geass struck me as a show alot like Yugioh. Any show that requires you to stomp the clutch in your brain so much to separate logic from the rest is probably a piece of shit show, particularly when the show makes such a big deal about how super special awesome and intricate these plots the characters weave are supposed to be. In Yugioh, they are just doing stuff and a character watching the "action" is simply there to comment on how cunning a move they just made. Code Geass suffers from the same syndrome, as did Death Note. The character isn't that smart, but everyone else keeps talking about how genius he is in order to make up for it.

Some of the obvious criticism though is true of alot of anime. Code Geass is stuffed with a whole bunch of characters (the Black Knights, the Student Academy, et cetera) who are useless, but exist for Japanese teenagers to associate with it. In animes, you constantly get superpowerful Student Councils who will/are running the world even though it is nonsensical that high school students should have that authority. I suspect this is because animes are marketed to people whose student councils are extremely potent in their school, and in the narrow view of the Japanese middle schooler or high schooler, the school is everything.

[Srelex]

^Yes, but it's presumably an incredibly expensive prototype mech which they are then throwing out into the fray with someone who's never actually piloted one before, that seems a little risky to me. Suzaku's expendable, yes, but considering what it can do when handled properly and how much it must have cost them, the machine presumably isn't.

Plus the thing about him being aptitude tested for Knightmares doesn't make sense to me, I was under the impression Honorary Britannians weren't allowed to be pilots under normal circumstances.

Meh, I was always under the impression that Lloyd didn't care much for Britannian social attitudes.

[Guardsman Bass]

Suzaku seems incredibly stupid, yes, but he's meant to be like some recent Gundam protagonists who aren't especially bright and remain stubborn about justice or doing things the right way. He'd be right at home in a less morally ambiguous series where the heroic mecha pilot just fights Space Nazis. Still, in spite of all the problems with Code Geass I believe he still works decently as an antagonist and Lelouch's foil.

I agree, and I think that his naivete and stubborn nature actually works for his character (in the first season), because the show doesn't glorify it. Quite the contrary - he often comes across as naive, hypocritical, and foolish at times (particularly since he's a murderer himself with soiled hands).

He's quite an interesting contrast for Lelouch in the first season, and the interaction between them (plus Lelouch's scheming) was the main reason I kept up with the show (that, and I'm a completion freak who wanted to see the end of it).

who fights against tyranny for the wrong reasons (self interest and vengeance)

That's one of the things that interested me first about Lelouch's character. For all his talk about bringing down Britannia and creating a world where his sister is accepted and can live, he's still very obviously shaped by Britannian views of the world early on - he thinks in terms of blood and family. That changes, but it was an interesting facet to him.

[Axiomatic]

I think you do Lelouch a disfavor by saying he has no qualms about killing. He has a ton of qualms. He just never lets his qualms stop him from killing more. In between killing, he devises various emotional tortures for himself.

He's no Light Yagami. Light called himself the God of the New World, while Lelouch is more likely to compare himself to the guy downstairs. That's why he says stuff like "My hands are already stained with blood" and when Kaguya, the loli Goddess of Victory tells him she wants to marry him, he says that unfortunately he has already made a deal with the devil, and that it would perhaps be best for a man such as him to avoid the attention of Heaven.

Plus there's the whole Shirley subplot.

[Ford Prefect]

^Yes, but it's presumably an incredibly expensive prototype mech which they are then throwing out into the fray with someone who's never actually piloted one before, that seems a little risky to me. Suzaku's expendable, yes, but considering what it can do when handled properly and how much it must have cost them, the machine presumably isn't.

The Lancelot was Lloyd's personal thing, and it was being funded by Schneizel. There's no reason at all to assume that he has to conform to anything other than his own whims, because he's not really beholden to anyone. Except Schneizel, obviously, but Schneizel is deliberately indulgent of the people around him, and later on Lloyd works for Suzaku.

Plus the thing about him being aptitude tested for Knightmares doesn't make sense to me, I was under the impression Honorary Britannians weren't allowed to be pilots under normal circumstances.

It was probably a simulator, but it's not inconceivable that they ran through the paces in some Gloucesters for fun. I mean, Knightmare Frames are cool, you could probably attract a few younger people to enlist on the pretense that theym ight get to play around in KMFs from time to time. I mean, strictly speaking I don't think it's entirely impossible to climb up the ranks if you were originally a Number - attitudes within the military differ regarding the individual worth of Numbers. On one hand you have the Blood Purist movement (and it would interesting to know how many Blood Purists are commoners with RPI commissions riding on the stylish coat tails of actual nobles, like Viletta), and on the other you have General Darlton who doesn't care where Suzaku came from, only about what he can do. The latter actually fits with Charles' supposed vision for Britannia, where the strong will thrive. That said, that Social Darwinist rhetoric almost certainly fuels Blood Purist racism in a lot of cases.

[speaker-to-trolls]

I think you do Lelouch a disfavor by saying he has no qualms about killing. He has a ton of qualms. He just never lets his qualms stop him from killing more. In between killing, he devises various emotional tortures for himself.

He's no Light Yagami. Light called himself the God of the New World, while Lelouch is more likely to compare himself to the guy downstairs. That's why he says stuff like "My hands are already stained with blood" and when Kaguya, the loli Goddess of Victory tells him she wants to marry him, he says that unfortunately he has already made a deal with the devil, and that it would perhaps be best for a man such as him to avoid the attention of Heaven.

Plus there's the whole Shirley subplot.

OK, he isn't entirely without conscience when it comes to killing.

But I think it only really effects him when he's killed someone close to him or someone close to him has been effected by it. OK, in the first episode he throws up a couple of times when he remembers what he did, but he quickly gets over it, and he didn't just kill strangers there, he shot his brother in the face. He didn't give a damn about all the people who died at Narita until it effects people he knows, he doesn't think twice about killing people who were on his side for tactical gain, and when he makes those comments you've listed then, yes, he was sorry for the deaths he'd caused, but I think what really got to him was what happened to someone he loved.

As the Guardsman said, in the first season he still thinks in Britannian terms, blood, family, personal honour. Think about what he says to Euphie during the hotel crisis.
L:Clovis begged pitifully for his life, with the same mouth that ordered the death of thousands of elevens.
E: Is that why you killed him?
L: No, I killed him because he was the son of that man.

[Commander 598]

I mean, strictly speaking I don't think it's entirely impossible to climb up the ranks if you were originally a Number - attitudes within the military differ regarding the individual worth of Numbers. On one hand you have the Blood Purist movement (and it would interesting to know how many Blood Purists are commoners with RPI commissions riding on the stylish coat tails of actual nobles, like Viletta), and on the other you have General Darlton who doesn't care where Suzaku came from, only about what he can do. The latter actually fits with Charles' supposed vision for Britannia, where the strong will thrive. That said, that Social Darwinist rhetoric almost certainly fuels Blood Purist racism in a lot of cases.

I believe that Cornelia also tended to completely ignore the Purists and had a few less than nice things to say about Japan's former (Actually current as well) aristocracy. I doubt the former was JUST the result of Jeremiah's uncontrollable actions. Also wasn't most of the Glaston Knights the adopted sons of Darlton?

[Ford Prefect]

I believe that Cornelia also tended to completely ignore the Purists and had a few less than nice things to say about Japan's former (Actually current as well) aristocracy. I doubt the former was JUST the result of Jeremiah's uncontrollable actions. Also wasn't most of the Glaston Knights the adopted sons of Darlton?

The way she had the Purists positioned during the Narita offensive seems like a pretty serious shaming for not just Orange but the entire faction. While Cornelia doesn't like Japan, unlike Clovis she has no interest in appeasing the Purists there, probably because she doesn't need to - she has Division C, who are all elite knights, so she has no need of muscle. She spends a lot of the series being distrustful of Suzaku of course, but that's probably because he's practically dating Euphie.

The Glaston Knights were all Darlton's adopted sons, yeah (and he apparently has many more adopted children, as I recall). I don't think it's ever stated where he adopted them from, but given that he's basically on campaign all the time, I like to imagine that they're war orphans from conquered Areas. That's just me, though, I'm not sure if it's chronologically possible.

[speaker-to-trolls]

^She seems to look down on the Japanese, but then in the heat of battle she also calls her enemies "Lowborn scum!" I think she looks down on anyone who isn't a member of either her family or her personal command.

[Dragon Angel]

Spoiler

I'm beginning to wonder this now: Before the director and writers were executively sodomized, what exactly was Charles' ultimate plan with the Sword of Akasha? I seem to recall that the production crew had a totally different outcome in mind for R2, but meddling is what mainly caused them to adopt an "Instrumentality" style plot with regard to him. No amount of searching is revealing any details about this, and I completely forgot where I originally heard this from, so what I just said may as well be pure fan fiction.

Edit: After a little consideration, I've spoilerized this post in case it reveals anything critical.

[Setzer]

What I don't get is why Zero openly refers to Japanese as Elevens. Why would he adopt the title the Britannians used for them when it clearly isn't one the Japanese have adopted for themselves?