Fantasy and Giant Worms

Post by **haas mark** » 2003-08-19 09:22pm

So why is it that the fantasy genre is overridden with giant worms/serpents/dragons/etc.? I ask because I just saw "Dune" last night for the first time last night (good movie, save the repetition, btw), and I have noticed a lot of times, there are large... things about in fantasy novels/movies/etc. What, exactly, does this add to a fantasy?

~ver

Jadeite · Post by **Jadeite** » 2003-08-19 09:48pm

Probably because a huge subterranean predator would inspire fear in people, and a worm shape is the best choice for one.

SyntaxVorlon · Post by **SyntaxVorlon** » 2003-08-19 09:53pm

Agreed, something that you can't predict, that can be upon you in a minute and something that you can only feel get closer and never ever flee. That's why you have UG worms. That and it is ancient Germanic myth that such demonic creatures sleep in caves on hordes of gold. RE: Beowulf. That or under lakes with mommy.

Drooling Iguana · Post by **Drooling Iguana** » 2003-08-19 11:16pm

People like to stick giant penises in things. Probably compensating for something.

Singular Quartet · Post by **Singular Quartet** » 2003-08-20 10:28am

Use which wand? (e-f, y ?) y

Grid Bug turns into Purple Worm. Purple Worm eats you. You are dead.

Would you like to have your posetions identified? (y/n)

I love nethack.

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-08-20 01:02pm

I think it has mythological roots. Some ancient cultures actually elevated serpents and worms to divine status, particularly those of Neolithic Eastern Europe.

In Scandinavian mythology, the giant Ymer (who became the world itself when we was slain by Odin and his brothers) is also called Aurgelmer in some versions of the Scandinavian creation myth. And "gelmer" happens to mean "worm" in Icelandic!

Also, in the earliest myths, dragons were merely extraordinarily vicious and enormous snakes. (for example - Jörmungandr and Nidhug from aforementioned Scandinavian mythology, Python from Greco-Roman mythology and Livyathan/Leviathan from Judeo-Christian mythology)

Then some story-tellers added flame-breath, and others decided to make them winged snakes.... and as the nature of oral tradition led to monsters changing from story to story, mythological dragons wound up looking like they do today.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-08-21 05:56pm

In Dune they actually serve a purpose, so I don't mind them so much in that. Gratuitous giant creatures (i.e. just in as an obstacle) are the only ones that bother me.

BTW, ver, which Dune did you see? The old one, or the newer Sci-Fi Channel one?

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-08-22 12:55pm

The Dark wrote:Gratuitous giant creatures (i.e. just in as an obstacle) are the only ones that bother me.

... whether they are worms or not?

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-08-22 11:44pm

Simon H.Johansen wrote:
The Dark wrote:Gratuitous giant creatures (i.e. just in as an obstacle) are the only ones that bother me.
... whether they are worms or not?

Yeah, whether they're worms or not. Giant worms, giant elephants, giant space hamsters...all of them just make you wonder why. Big things are less likely than small things, for reasons explained when Mike was talking about structural strength for spaceships. 60 foot insects just can't happen.

Although I must admit a strange pleasure in playing War of the Monsters. Perhaps because it's so tongue-in-cheek, it can't be taken seriously.

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-08-24 10:53am

The Dark wrote:
Simon H.Johansen wrote:
The Dark wrote:Gratuitous giant creatures (i.e. just in as an obstacle) are the only ones that bother me.
... whether they are worms or not?
Yeah, whether they're worms or not. Giant worms, giant elephants, giant space hamsters...all of them just make you wonder why. Big things are less likely than small things, for reasons explained when Mike was talking about structural strength for spaceships. 60 foot insects just can't happen.

I have more tolerance of giant creatures than you, apparently. As long they aren't giant invertebrates and not ludicrously big, I'm fine with them. (In my mind, a horse-sized wolf is OK. A whale-sized gerbil isn't.)

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2003-08-24 01:04pm

The Dark wrote:
Simon H.Johansen wrote:
The Dark wrote:Gratuitous giant creatures (i.e. just in as an obstacle) are the only ones that bother me.
... whether they are worms or not?
Yeah, whether they're worms or not. Giant worms, giant elephants, giant space hamsters...all of them just make you wonder why. Big things are less likely than small things, for reasons explained when Mike was talking about structural strength for spaceships. 60 foot insects just can't happen.

Although I must admit a strange pleasure in playing War of the Monsters. Perhaps because it's so tongue-in-cheek, it can't be taken seriously.

It's because big things are much cooler than little things. Especially big things that go around blowing shit up.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-08-24 07:42pm

Simon H.Johansen wrote:
The Dark wrote: Yeah, whether they're worms or not. Giant worms, giant elephants, giant space hamsters...all of them just make you wonder why. Big things are less likely than small things, for reasons explained when Mike was talking about structural strength for spaceships. 60 foot insects just can't happen.
I have more tolerance of giant creatures than you, apparently. As long they aren't giant invertebrates and not ludicrously big, I'm fine with them. (In my mind, a horse-sized wolf is OK. A whale-sized gerbil isn't.)

Oh, a horse-sized wolf is OK. I can see them growing a little larger, particularly if gravity is lower. 60-foot mantises, or the whale-sized gerbils, OTOH, I don't like. Large is OK, giant is bad (and don't ask me to define those, because I don't have definitions

).

Post by **haas mark** » 2003-08-25 02:30am

The Dark wrote:In Dune they actually serve a purpose, so I don't mind them so much in that. Gratuitous giant creatures (i.e. just in as an obstacle) are the only ones that bother me.

BTW, ver, which Dune did you see? The old one, or the newer Sci-Fi Channel one?

I think it was the Sci-Fi Channel one. And I agree on the Dune worms.. they had a purpose, so I don't mind them so much, but it seems to me that in every fanatsy there's a giant SOMETHING-or-other to stir things up..

~ver

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-08-25 09:05am

verilon wrote:
The Dark wrote:In Dune they actually serve a purpose, so I don't mind them so much in that. Gratuitous giant creatures (i.e. just in as an obstacle) are the only ones that bother me.

BTW, ver, which Dune did you see? The old one, or the newer Sci-Fi Channel one?
I think it was the Sci-Fi Channel one. And I agree on the Dune worms.. they had a purpose, so I don't mind them so much, but it seems to me that in every fanatsy there's a giant SOMETHING-or-other to stir things up..

~ver

But do anyone else than me believe that the mythological role of wyrms/snakes explains why giant worms are specifically popular?